Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators
Hoax Investigation => The Conrad Murray Investigation & Court Case => After June 25, 2009 => Court Case & Hearings; Discussion and Articles => Topic started by: finfin on December 29, 2010, 04:24:49 PM
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http://content.usatoday.com/communities ... himself-/1 (http://content.usatoday.com/communities/entertainment/post/2010/12/prosecutor-defense-will-claim-jackson-killed-himself-/1)
USA TODAY article
Prosecutor: Defense will claim Jackson killed himself The trial surrounding the death of Michael Jackson is sure to be one of the most closely followed cases. It hasn't even started yet, and there's already a shocker. A prosecutor tells the Associated Press that one of Conrad Murray's defense lawyers is ready to claim that the singer killed himself with the powerful anesthetic Propofol.
(http://i.usatoday.net/communitymanager/_photos/lifeline-live/2010/12/29/jacksonx-inset-community.jpg)
According to defense attorney J. Michael Flanagan, Murray says he only gave Jackson 25 milligrams of the drug, even though a much larger amount was found in the pop superstar's body after he died of a drug overdose on June 25, 2009. The defense will argue that Jackson injected himself with more Propofol on his own. A preliminary hearing is scheduled for Tuesday.
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http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/wir ... d=12502239 (http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/wireStory?id=12502239)
Prosecutor: Defense Will Claim Jackson Killed Self
Prosecutor says defense will claim superstar Michael Jackson killed himself with Propofol
The Associated Press
By LINDA DEUTSCH AP Special Correspondent
LOS ANGELES December 29, 2010 (AP)
A prosecutor says defense lawyers for Michael Jackson's doctor will claim at his involuntary manslaughter trial that the singer killed himself.
The statement by Los Angeles County Deputy District Attorney David Walgren came at a hearing Wednesday where a lawyer for Dr. Conrad Murray clashed with the prosecutor over who should test residue from two syringes found in Jackson's bedroom.
Defense attorney J. Michael Flanagan said a huge amount of the anesthetic Propofol was found in Jackson's body but his client has said he gave him only 25 milligrams of the drug.
Walgren suggested the defense will claim Jackson killed himself by injecting more of the drug into himself.
A preliminary hearing in the case begins Jan. 4.
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@darkchild I think you and I have put similar posts up,lol, mine is from USA Today I wonder if any kind person is able to put them together please??
viewtopic.php?f=96&t=16832#p286834 (http://michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=96&t=16832#p286834)
@ROFL was that you, thank you very much :D
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So Murray gave Mike 25ml and after that Mike gave himself so much propofol that it killed him? LMFAO, what a mess. I don't know if any of you ever got propofol, but that is simply IMPOSSIBLE. He wouldn't be put under from that 25ML at all, so first question would be: why would Murray even give him a small amount like that if he was trying to put him under. After that Mike injected himself until he died... When I got my propofol shot, I was completely out in a few seconds. No way I could have injected myself so much that I would OD. This story stinks and I really don't get why there is not a single doctor speaking out on this madness... Probably no one gives a fuck.
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So Murray gave Mike 25ml and after that Mike gave himself so much propofol that it killed him? LMFAO, what a mess. I don't know if any of you ever got propofol, but that is simply IMPOSSIBLE. He wouldn't be put under from that 25ML at all, so first question would be: why would Murray even give him a small amount like that if he was trying to put him under. After that Mike injected himself until he died... When I got my propofol shot, I was completely out in a few seconds. No way I could have injected myself so much that I would OD. This story stinks and I really don't get why there is not a single doctor speaking out on this madness... Probably no one gives a fuck.
I've never had a propofol shot and I'm not a doctor but I know enough to know that what the defense is claiming is a bunch of BS. Then again Michael dying is a bunch of BS too. So I guess that makes sense - it's all BS!
As for other doctors not speaking out on it, it is kind of weird and ya, they probably just don't care. Or, maybe some have spoken about it amongst themselves and know something doesn't add up. But who knows why they've kept quiet about it. Any doctors on the forum??
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It is the same kind of BS as testing the syringes after 1,5ys. And again nobody raises an eyebrow? Really... funny thing is that I truly believe most ppl will really buy it - just cause they read it in a magazine. lol
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I had surgery a year half ago and the minute they stuck that needle in me and told me to start counting backwards from 100 I was out so fast, and when I woke up I was drowsy and tired. How can Mike give himself that? In possible.
I also was in the room when they gave my daughter the shot for her surgery and she was out so fast.
I do not believe that the defense will even come up with some mess like that, however they have to make up something. Murray is a liar. MJ did not do that to himself.
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As we all know mike did "kill" himself ;)
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As we all know mike did "kill" himself ;)
Aha! Nice one.
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If Michael supposedly injected enough Propofol into himself to cause death...did he also put the lidocaine into the syringe and inject that too?
Lidocaine was also supposedly found in the syringes, in the tissue samples and at the scene.
Lidocaine was not mixed into the propofol found at the scene either. They were in separate bottles.
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So Murray gave Mike 25ml and after that Mike gave himself so much propofol that it killed him? LMFAO, what a mess. I don't know if any of you ever got propofol, but that is simply IMPOSSIBLE. He wouldn't be put under from that 25ML at all, so first question would be: why would Murray even give him a small amount like that if he was trying to put him under. After that Mike injected himself until he died... When I got my propofol shot, I was completely out in a few seconds. No way I could have injected myself so much that I would OD. This story stinks and I really don't get why there is not a single doctor speaking out on this madness... Probably no one gives a fuck.
I've never had a propofol shot and I'm not a doctor but I know enough to know that what the defense is claiming is a bunch of BS. Then again Michael dying is a bunch of BS too. So I guess that makes sense - it's all BS!
As for other doctors not speaking out on it, it is kind of weird and ya, they probably just don't care. Or, maybe some have spoken about it amongst themselves and know something doesn't add up. But who knows why they've kept quiet about it. Any doctors on the forum??
Because any doctor would know it stinks and doesn't even consider to interfere (I'm not a doctor btw, but I felt free to react :lol: ) AND doctors have an inherent mutual protective agreement, which makes them mute or a wimp. Hope one of them cares and will speak up. Come on doctors we need the TRUTH!!
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My brain hurts :shock: :?
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Murray also supposedly administered 4 benzopines, propofol, & lidocaine in the IV but only 2 syringes were found. One had a broken needle and both syringes had the IV system only had traces of propofol and lidocaine and not the other drugs.
Where are the other syringes or did Murray use the same syringe to administer all the drugs, hours apart? What about contaminating these drugs with one another and bacteria after being used to repeatedly inject Michael or the IV system?
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I wonder why do we think Murray did all of this when in fact he doesn't even know to do a CPR!?
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I wonder why do we think Murray did all of this when in fact he doesn't even know to do a CPR!?
Right because he aint no doctor. Lol
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What about the Flumazenil, it was detected in the IV system but not the syringe or the tissue/blood samples. How was it introduced into the IV, there is no syringe for it?
This drug works to counter the effects of benzodiazepines. It is supposed to be administered repeatedly (but it wasn't) and it acts quickly and is metabolized through the liver so if Michael's oragns were no longer functioning and his blood wasn't circulating then it should be found in the tissue and/or blood samples...but it wasn't.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flumazenil
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Another TS connection to TMZ's Michael stories today.
There have been 3 stories (so far) today. Here are the times:
Conrad Murray to Prosecutor: So Whatcha Got?
12/29/2010 12:40 AM PST by TMZ Staff 1+2+4= 7
MJ Estate: Discovery Channel Is 'Debased, Sick'
12/29/2010 12:22 PM PST by TMZ Staff 1+2+2+2= 7
D.A. Acknowledges Murray Defense: MJ Killed Himself
12/29/2010 3:04 PM PST by TMZ Staff 3+4 = 7
Triple Seven.
Edit: I put this in the wrong thread, I'll leave it but copy it to another one.
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This is so ridiculous. How convenient for Murray's story all along to have been that he left Michael alone for an unspecified amount of time, therefore building an alibi for himself. Wouldn't it be funny if he did in fact give Michael 25 m, stayed away from his post leaving Michael unattended (of course he's being paid to keep an eye out so Murray's in the hot seat), Michael was never out, waited on the right time and simply just left. Now nobody knows where he is. What now :shock: Gotta come up with something. However, something in the back of my mind keeps insisting that Michael never came back after those rehearsals on 6/24/2009 and that AEG & Sony was in the hot seat and had to make themselves appear not at fault; because with Michael gone they needed to recoup their money by any means necessary. That also being the reason everyone was fired and put under contract not to utter a word.
Don't mind me, lol. I'm very imaginative.
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This event promises to be very interesting, let's see if any media hype of all these inconsistencies
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[youtube:1s8wp1xq]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8vINCq_IAI[/youtube:1s8wp1xq]
Sorry, I just had to break out the theme music on this one. "Send In The Clowns. Don't bother they're here." :lol: :lol:
Seriously though, let's think about it. We know this is a hoax and Michael is in charge.
Murray isn't a doctor, he can't afford these lawyers, someone's paying the lawyers (MJ), so Murray is fake, his lawyers are fake, the defense is fake. I guess the hearing today was faked. The paid actors, (I mean 30 witnesses), should put on a good show and I hope provide some enlightenment.
There are so many balls being juggled it's hard to see what the illusion is and I'm losing my patience, but I'll regroup and wait on the Lord. ( I never did like the circus.)
The circus never stands still (Cecil B. DeMille)[/color]
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Hello guys,
First of Merry Christmas and Happy new year.
I am a pharmacist and in the biotechnology field as well. I started to doubt this whole case from the beginning because of the medical facts. Of course no way on earth, he could commit suicide using propofol, because this drug has rapid onset, and action, and you're out in a matter of seconds like some members here mentioned. Murray knows quite well what he was doing in that day he is not stupid, he gave him a perfect anesthesia cocktail to knock him down, i even sat with an anesthesiologist, and he told me he supposedly died from that?!!! he was shocked, he said the dosage is perfect and he even can take more. I believe that Michael was taken against his will on that day, and i did an investigation on that and the medical stuff. You can check it on the link that i will provide, the whole thing, and am gonna write some here, it's too long and that's why i will provide you with the link just in case you're interested, i don't believe that this is a case done by Michael, it's a hoax done on us by those who did harm Michael to divert us away from the truth.
here is the link as well, you're gonna fine all the information under "the trap section"
http://unitedformichael.weebly.com/
and check this as well, a summary to rowe's book is added, if you're interested
http://realitycheck1.weebly.com/
This is part from my findings:
"This is what happened in the meeting with the anthesiologist:
I met with him and he sat down with me and explained everything to me and i have to say what he told me is the same as i said.
He said: After seeing the doses and calculating it based on Michael's information these doses aren't lethal at all, on the contrary it's suitable with him as a patient, and the cocktail of drugs is a perfect anesthesia to knock down a person and put them to sleep, he told me if you want to leave them for a long time you're gonna give the propofol as an IV infusion (because we can control the rate like this), and one shot only for sedation. The drug Lorazepam, he told me we don't usually use it we only use it if we want to control the patient (if the patient is resistant and doesn't want to comply, which could explain why it was used if he was taken against his will he was sure fighting back and they had to control him). I asked him about the antidote as well, he told me this is usually used in emergency cases, if there is a problem happened they inject the antidote to overcome the problem. The only danger if the propofol would be taken alone without control then it could be lethal.
Conclusion: This cocktail is not lethal and is a perfect anesthesia usually used, he told me that whoever did this cocktail knows what he was doing, this is not lethal at all and if there is control then it's perfect.
This was a professional opinion, this is one thing that proves one point in the plot i believe in."
Take care and have a nice day, love and peace[/color]
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Conclusion: This cocktail is not lethal and is a perfect anesthesia usually used, he told me that whoever did this cocktail knows what he was doing, this is not lethal at all and if there is control then it's perfect.
This was a professional opinion, this is one thing that proves one point in the plot i believe in."
Thank you Nothing but love for your professional opinion. This is good news & it could be valuable information. It confirms what we already assumed, that is was not a lethal dose. I hope this will be useful for the prosecutor.
L.O.V.E.
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@everlastinglove_MJ: You're welcome sweetie, they should know that, simple dose calculation will get them there, if they care in the first place, except that i believe that this case is one of two things, he is either taken against his will and is locked somewhere (due to medical facts and other stuff), or he is murdered, there is nothing else at least to me, and this hoax is being played on us big time as a huge cover up. If you wanna know more about my findings, please see this link, i didn't post the info in it here, because it's too long, and many members would find it annoying to have a post this long lol :lol: .
i hope you would check it out and if there is anything please let me know, will be glad to discuss it.
http://unitedformichael.weebly.com/
Happy new year, and have a nice day, love and peace
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@Nothing but love- Wonderful New Year to you as well. I have some questions: If Michael is held somewhere- What for? Do you think the family knows? I mean what would be the benefit of holding him? It can't be blackmail, because surely they would realize that the "kidnappers" would not let him go anyway. So why take him, but not kill him? Also, if he was taken- how do we know the drug levels we have are correct (meaning, I know what you say is correct dosage wise and administration wise, but we may not have the correct info) ? If he was taken (alive) there would not have been an autopsy. We know the drug levels from the autoypsy (that I believe never happened- so fake blood results and levels).
If he was murdered- why bother to set up this very elaborate hoax? If anything the believers constantly are belittled and decried- what use would the hoax be ( I mean why would "they" want us to believe? Of what value is it to have a so far silent minority believe he might be alive)? I mean, if he was dead, why have a hoax to make us think he is alive- but he really is dead? The set-up of the hoax would seem redundant after he was already killed.
As I see it the Attivan (lorezepam) was just part of the set-up as were the other benzos. The ammount that he was said to have taken would show extremely high tolernace to those drugs (=paint him as at least dependent on benzos). If he really was given propofol (which I doubt, again- the only verification we have about that is from the "authopsy" so at this point, the levels are suspect IF we think he is alive. If he is dead and the autopsy is correct, blood and vitrious fluid levels of Propofol were MUCH higher than the dosage Murray said he administered. He did not self administer- once it hits you, you are out. Meaning-the self administration defense would fly. And that means it is most likely part of a bigger plan.
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@everlastinglove_MJ: You're welcome sweetie, they should know that, simple dose calculation will get them there, if they care in the first place, except that i believe that this case is one of two things, he is either taken against his will and is locked somewhere (due to medical facts and other stuff), or he is murdered, there is nothing else at least to me, and this hoax is being played on us big time as a huge cover up. If you wanna know more about my findings, please see this link, i didn't post the info in it here, because it's too long, and many members would find it annoying to have a post this long lol :lol: .
i hope you would check it out and if there is anything please let me know, will be glad to discuss it.
http://unitedformichael.weebly.com/
Happy new year, and have a nice day, love and peace
I wish you the same nothing but love. I did look at your website, very informative. I'm definately pro a re-release of INVINCIBLE. It's a masterpiece, I love this album. Michael certainly deserves a re-release if Invincible and unbiased criticism.
Have a sparkling turn of the year :D !
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Hey! This hair is my breakfast!
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This is so ridiculous. How convenient for Murray's story all along to have been that he left Michael alone for an unspecified amount of time, therefore building an alibi for himself. Wouldn't it be funny if he did in fact give Michael 25 m, stayed away from his post leaving Michael unattended (of course he's being paid to keep an eye out so Murray's in the hot seat), Michael was never out, waited on the right time and simply just left. Now nobody knows where he is. What now :shock: Gotta come up with something. However, something in the back of my mind keeps insisting that Michael never came back after those rehearsals on 6/24/2009 and that AEG & Sony was in the hot seat and had to make themselves appear not at fault; because with Michael gone they needed to recoup their money by any means necessary. That also being the reason everyone was fired and put under contract not to utter a word.
Don't mind me, lol. I'm very imaginative.
I just cant stop thinking about those cctv tapes,were are they,they need to be found. :? :?
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This is so ridiculous. How convenient for Murray's story all along to have been that he left Michael alone for an unspecified amount of time, therefore building an alibi for himself. Wouldn't it be funny if he did in fact give Michael 25 m, stayed away from his post leaving Michael unattended (of course he's being paid to keep an eye out so Murray's in the hot seat), Michael was never out, waited on the right time and simply just left. Now nobody knows where he is. What now :shock: Gotta come up with something. However, something in the back of my mind keeps insisting that Michael never came back after those rehearsals on 6/24/2009 and that AEG & Sony was in the hot seat and had to make themselves appear not at fault; because with Michael gone they needed to recoup their money by any means necessary. That also being the reason everyone was fired and put under contract not to utter a word.
Don't mind me, lol. I'm very imaginative.
I just cant stop thinking about those cctv tapes,were are they,they need to be found. :? :?
That could explain why the last photos were taken 48 hours before. He just took off!!
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@ignisaeternus: Hi, thanks and have a great year. I will try to answer the questions as much as i can because after all i don't have all the answers, but I am really glad to see your post. I'll keep referring you to the sites because this is too long am just mentioning the main points and i have already wrote too much as you can see.
-Why would they take him?
--Why did they try to put him in jail in 2005, they always wanted him out of the way, because he won't do anything they want. and to add to your question why now?, that is since i don't believe in coincidences at all, when you look at the timeline, Michael's contract with sony was due to end July 2009, and he was gonna leave them once and for all, and he was gonna have 100% of his royalties back in 2011, i have explained this in details. The incident happened in the 25th of June, 2009. Could this be a coincidence? I don't think so, that's a red flag to be raised. Why was he working on a new album to be released only at the time that he was leaving sony? That's right, because he was finally gonna be a free agent and work away from them, if he wanted to work with them again, he would have done so years before, but he didn't, he was working privately, until the time that his contract was gonna end and then worked professionally to prepare the album for release, except that it was away from sony, in a private studio, even Will.i.am said that they finished the album and that Michael have it and no one, not even him has a copy or know where it is. When Michael leaves sony what will happen to them? They will loose the millions of dollars they make on his expense every year, and they will lose almost the only artist who sells in the age of the internet and piracy. According to an economic article, MJ saved sony music department from losses, you guessed it (after his d****), saying that without that, they would have continued to lose in the music section.
So, why would they keep him, they just wanted him out of the way, so they could control his stuff, but they still need him for the creative work, for the music stuff, because no one could do it like him, and we all saw the last album and how it had the vocals of someone else, and most of the fans am included, would have preferred the release of raw demos, rather than this. As long as Michael is not co-operating they still need him, because when they are done with him, he is out. He is the only one who knows where most of his unreleased work and plans, he is the only one who can get them out MJ style and no one else can do that. They wanted him to be under their control and do what they pleases like the other artists, but we all know that is not possible with MJ, he stopped working for years just because he doesn't want to work with them.
-Do you think the family knows?
-- Sure, they do, that's why Kathrine suddenly stopped speaking about a third autopsy and stopped doubting it, that's why Joe's name is dragged through mud every time he speaks, that's why he said (ask those who know!, i don't know as the people who know,,,when i know am gonna tell you) when larry asked him about where is Michael's body is, he should have said ask the FAMILY, since they were the ones doing everything while joe was away, but instead he said ask the people who know, not the family, at the time it didn't make any sense, and all of the fans thought it's hoax related, but it didn't add up with me, until i watched it again and looked at his body language, just looks how angry and serious he gets when asked that question, he stared at larry as a sign to stop pushing the matter forward, see it again. That's why all of a sudden they stopped talking a lot about conspiracy and so, including Latoya who was all over the place, now the best they could say is that murray was fall guy and the most they can do is accuse AEG and they know that is a lose situation. The only one who really thinks that he is the next MJ is jermaine and i already have my doubts about him, because just like in 2005 when geller introduced bashit to Michael and afterwards the trial started, this time in 2009 his brother introduced him to tohme and afterwards Michael was gone, and i am not gonna be convinced that jermaine didn't know tohme before introducing him, just like am not gonna be convinced that geller didn't know bashit before introducing him, illogical, and many other things, i have explained a lot in the site.
-Your question about the autopsy:
-- There is part of the truth in it and that is the IV drug levels for one reason only, when you are doing something like that, they sure have the coroner working with them but they can't have the entire stuff in on it, there are very few people involved, what happened is that the stuff went to the house (and not all of them like i said know), they went there, collected whatever they found and included in a report on the 26th (the report was written on that day, so they must have been in the house on the day of the incident the 25th), murray is not stupid (in other words the people who are operating him) he planted the rest of the drugs and bottles so it could appear as if Michael was using drugs like crazy. The same thing happened in the hospital, according to the paramedics report, murray called someone (an official) in UCLA right before they left, but again you can buy one person but you can't buy the entire hospital, so they took him there and the Head of the Emergency department was there with the responsible doctor and staff and according to her timeline (you can see it in the link, under the summary of what really happened to MJ, http://realitycheck1.weebly.com/), Michael was doing fine, when you take anesthesia, it's normal that your HR would be below the normal and your breathing would be barely and hardly noticed that's why they have to put something to monitor the breathing, Michael's HR was fifty something according to her and he was breathing fine through the balloon, suddenly he was pronounced doesn't make sense, it's normal that they would take blood samples and so on for testing, so what we have is his blood test results, because remember Michael doesn't drink and don't do drugs and his sample was clean, no levels of alcohol or any other drugs but the IV ones. The doctor there can't tell the staff don't take the samples or do normal procedures they would be busted big time, they can control what's gonna be in the report, and how it's gonna look like, so they could mix the truth with the lies, look at his forehead in the ambulance photo, there is an obvious frown on his face, and that could make sense if he was resisting them, and that's why they used these drugs. If he wants to run away, there is no need for all of this mess, it could have been an accident and we're done here, the fact that he was knocked out using heavy anesthesia, the alarm at the hospital went off as soon as the family saw him and he was on the plane and of he goes and no one knows where the hell was he taken, speaks volumes, again check the site for more details on the autopsy.
-Why would the make a hoax for small people?
--because they need to cover up their tracks, and it's always the minority that matters, the general public takes whatever they hear on the tv even if doesn't make sense, they take it and that's it, it's the minority that matters, because they dig and search and look for the truth, and they could be the ones uncovering them, so when they keep us busy for a hoax waiting for him to comeback and looking for the clues and so, we won't look for the truth and we won't follow real evidence we will keep looking at fake stuff. And after years when he won't come back, the fans would say he just want to be left alone but we know he is alright and everyone would be happy but him. I'll give you an example, a hollywood producer who was working on the movie scream, she said we used to set up forums and put fake theories on them so that the fans won't UNCOVER what's gonna happen in the next part, it was a method of DISTRACTION and it succeeded according to her, now the same question Why would a producer care about the minority of fans of the movie (you won't expect that all the people were online discussing the movie, only few)?
she answered it: SO THEY WON'T UNCOVER WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN, DISTRACTION. The same is happening here, if they can do this with a movie or whatever, it's better used as murder or a kidnap cover up. Why don't you ask the same question: why would Michael care about a small number of fans to give him clues when he has to focus on himself if he is in danger and hiding? the logical answer is that he won't bother, when i am hiding for serious reasons i AM HIDING period, no trail, nothing that could endanger me or my life, and him hiding for a movie or a comeback, seriously for almost 2 years now, doesn't add up, he would be crucified for this and he is not stupid and he doesn't need that.
The minority matters more than the majority, because these are the thinkers, just let them in the wrong direction and they will complete and keep going on in circles forever. And they would allow everything to pass, even the autopsy documentary of discovery, and a fake album to be released under his name, just because they are looking for "CLUES", let's keep them busy while we are doing our work, stealing.
Again considering the drugs and the autopsy, i am a pharmacist and i sat with an anesthesiologist, and we calculated the dosage and everything, it's a perfect dosage for him, they are not high or anything, this am 100% sure about, he could even take up to 50 mls more and it won't be danger to him, and what the doctor said was IS HE SUPPOSED TO HAVE DIED FROM THIS? i told him yes, he nodded and said it doesn't make sense, because it's a perfect anesthesia cocktail that is being used in operations, and it's being given to him, the autopsy report has the truth mixed up and hidden with the rest of crap mentioned there, you just should be able to find it, and that is like i said you can't bribe the whole stuff to be on a conspiracy, so the things that were collected are true, the blood tests are true, just the comments and the other drugs which are not IV are false. To hide them, murray planted many boxes of even the IV drugs themselves and other pills and so on, because that's the best they could do when the people who are gonna collect the stuff come, because they can't tell the entire medical community, we have kidnapped him and you need to play along, you see what i mean.
I hope i answered your questions and if you want to discuss anything further please do, after all we want the truth, nothing more and nothing less. I kept referring you to the sites, because as you can see, i already wrote too much in this post, and it's really just main points i gave you, and it's that long, so you can read more details of you like on the sites and i'll be more than glad to answer anything and discuss anything further.
http://realitycheck1.weebly.com/
http://unitedformichael.weebly.com/
Take care sweetie and have a nice day, love and peace
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@everlastinglove_MJ: thanks sweetie and am glad that you find it good one way or another, :) , yes he definitely deserves the best. The same to you sweetie, have an amazing year, ;) much love to you. :)
Take care and have a nice day, love and peace
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or, to add to my other post, perhaps it was planned (by MJ & Murray & everyone "in" on it) for Murray "not to be in the room for an unspecified amount of time" thereby building an alibi for not knowing what transpired during his absence. The loophole :shock: The missing tapes seem to point to something being awry right about that time. Planned.
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Nothingbutlove, I always respected and admired your research and your theory.
I've got a question:
1. If SONY have kidnapped MJ and have been perpetuating hoax scenario for the sake of a cover-up then WHY ISN'T THE HOAX DISCUSSION allowed on the official SONY forum - MJJCOMMUNITY? :oops: A perfect place for doing this.
2. Why does the family keep repeating: "It's all gonna come out, it's all gonna unfold"? (Jermaine and Rebbie) Why are they are so sure it will come out? How?
3. If they want to make money from him, why they put "Michael" the album for free on the official SONY website?
4. If the children knew their father was kidnapped they'd look scared like sh** on Oprah's. Instead, they looked relaxed and smiling. How is that possible?
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Nothingbutlove- Thank you for your thorough answer. I respect your opinion and your research- and I am reserving the right to disagree. With Love, of course!
With all the pieces we know, the "he was taken" theory (while I do agree with the reasons you listed) seems to be the least likely to me. I agree with VeryLittleSuzie- Paris' non-verbal communication is very open and actually challening- not scared at all.
I do not question your knowledge as a pharacist. I am a clinical social worker and work daily with psychiatrists, therefore I know that Ativan is used quite frequently for anxiety disorders (less often to induce sleep, benzos of choice would be Xanax or Valium)- so it is possible Michael took it for that.
Also, it was pretty well known and documented (from both the trial and from people who were around him) that Michael did like his red wine and Vodka. So, yes, he did drink. And nothing wrong with that- he and I even share our poison of choice. LOL.
I still think ALL blood tests that were published at the "autopsy" are fake. Or were not Michael's.
I guess for my own sanity, I cannot right now even go mentally to a place where I think he is being held and tortured like this. But as I said, thank you for your research and I value your opinion.
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what the fuck??? :? all these lies and BS and yet he is walking around as a free man. this is like a twisted comedy/horror movie :lol: . with so much inconsistencies, he should be in jail long time :roll: . whoops i forgot, this a bunch of lie after all. one more question, where is this man's mugshot? :lol:
so many contradicting stories and none of the non-believers find it suspicious? how many times does Murray have to change his story?
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@hesouttamylife: hey, yes the missing tapes shows that there was something planned, and it could be evil, and that's why they had to take the tapes away to hide what they have done, and don't you find it weird that even the prosecutor is not searching for the tapes or asking about them, while they are of a big importance to this case, they are only concentrating on Michael's drug use and that's it. They are not even looking at the contract between AEG and murray that was found, and not giving AEG any attention, murray is the fall guy for the big guys and that's why this trial if any will happen will end in him being innocent or the minimal charge would be pressed against him, what they are doing is not an investigation, it's a joke, pure one :? , and the state of California especially the Barbara County district won't help Michael Jackson to pull off a hoax, while they refused to let him file a lawsuit against sneddon in the first place, and they changed a law just to prosecute Michael in 2004, (sneddon filed for change of a section in the law to give the prosecution the right ONLY IN CHILD MOLESTATION TRIALS to bring the old allegations in court even if it never made it to trial, he did this and was approved somewhere between 1999and 2000 it was mentioned by Mesereau and i have found this info as well, i haven't posted everything i have found by the way, i was advised not to for safety reasons (his)), they were planning to bring MJ down years ago no matter what, it came to their surprise that he came out strong from this trial and his fans still love him and loved him even more, so they worked on bringing him down financially and when he was still standing up and didn't fall down and the time was about to end (for the contract to finish) they took it to the next level, enough is enough for them, they have been trying to bring him down since 1993, that's too long, they didn't expect that he would last this long and he would be that strong.
The only way for him to pull this off and not be in jail if he was found and/or came back like some think, is that the authorities would help him, and after what they have done to him and still doing to him, they won't help him, and laws are there to protect corporations, nothing more nothing less and we all know that, they even changed the laws just to bring him down :cry: .
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@VeryLittleSusie: Hey sweetie, thanks for your nice words, i am glad to see you here :) , hope everything is fine with you and happy new year. Of course i don't have all the answers and no one does, but i will answer from what i know, and i will leave out what i don't.
1- Why would they allow discussions on the official website, of course that never happens, it will be too obvious, when they were discussing the fake theories of the movie scream, they created forums and fan communities to do so, they didn't do it on the official site, it will be a dead give away that they are behind this. so, no it should not be done on the official site or anywhere that is related to them, they work behind scenes.
2-Look jermaine, i don't trust as i said before and to me he is on the suspect list until proven innocent, for the reasons i have mentioned before, so i take no word he says of importance. I don't know about the rest, Joe said the same thing, maybe they are hopeful that the truth will find it's way out one day, just like when happened with the trial, but it came out after 2 and half years or so, it took so long. When you are in a desperate situation you usually hope for the truth to come out and maybe that's why they say so, otherwise i don't know, because i never met them neither did the hoax community, words can be interpreted in many ways and usually according to the liking of the listener, that's why i depend on documents, facts that happened before, timeline and motives, words to me are secondary not a priority. Them saying that is not a proof of a hoax or otherwise because we can't possibly know.
3-to prove that they don't care about the money so here you go, because at the time of the release there were many campaigns against them and the album, so they said here you go fans it's all for love and it actually worked when many fans saw this,, they were like aww sony doesn't want our money (except of course for few fans and me included who smelled the rat) and off they go to buy the album :? , you see what i mean it's a strategy. They didn't lose anything, actually there was an article in the economic news, saying that MJ saved sony's music publishing division from losing after his d**** because no artist in this age sells, and if it wasn't for the fans they would have lost double of what they did last year. So, the fans saved sony, yay :? .
4-You really wouldn't expect the family to tell the kids that their father is in danger of any sort, i am sure if that's the case they absolutely don't know, how would you expect to tell kids something like that, it will ruin them and they won't be able to handle it or absorb it. He has to be away for business and so on, stuff like that, that would be heartless to tell them something like that, so in my opinion and if my research is true, of course the kids don't know.
I hope i was able to answer your questions and if there is anything else please let me know.
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@ignisaeternus: You're welcome sweetie, it's nothing to mention. Of course, you have every right to agree or disagree, who said otherwise lol.
Please refer to my reply to VeryLittleSusie right above yours regarding the children.
Ativan (lorazepam) yes can be used for what you have mentioned, but it's a drug of no choice due it's side effects that could be damaging on many levels, and the doctors usually prescribe it for severe cases and like you mentioned it's not used mainly for sleep induction, there are many more safer drugs than that and could be used instead. It's main use is for the control of aggressive and non-co-operative patients because it causes muscle relaxation, meaning that the patient won't be able to resist because he won't move, coincidence, again i don't think so. Sure if my findings are right, Michael didn't surrender just like that, and that's why it was used, as soon as i knew that this drug was found it raised a hell of questions and i have asked many doctors as well about that drug, they were all shocked as well that it could be used just like that, it's usually used in hospitals and like i mentioned for severe cases.
I disagree with you on the wine thing, because i have read the court documents of the trial and the mention of wine was from the flight attendants who said he used to hide it in a cola can, and it was denied by Mesereau as this was not true, Michael never asked for this to be done and it was discredited and am pretty sure about that. As for the people around him (the good ones, the true ones) all of them said that they never saw him drinking, it's mentioned everywhere, even from the 80's, Paul Mccartney even said he was not that type, and he talked alot about that. All the honest people around him said they never saw him drinking, and Michael said it so it's enough for me. Even the wine cellar in Neverland the guy who designed the place when interviewed he mentioned that the initial design had no wine cellar or anything of that sort, but he and some people around him told him that all the big houses and the perfect ones had a wine cellar and he should have one and he even said since he is a perfectionist he said then i should have one with the best stuff in it, that's why he has one. So, this is a fact am pretty sure about, he was perfectly healthy and he took good care of his body and again all the facts point to this. I could do a topic about that and provide all the evidence but it will take a while since i am busy these days.
Regarding the autopsy like i said, part of it is true because no one not even the evil ones can't pay off all the medical and coroner's staff, it's just not possible. Not even from a hoax prespective, and in a hospital there are certain procedures and they would not tell the entire stuff, don't do anything we will handle it, doesn't make sense not even from a hoax point of view, and the house, before the police or anything, people from the coroners office along with a detective went there on the same day, so again you can't buy off all of these people, not possible, so there is part of the truth in it, just mixed up and hidden with the lies.
I know it's hard to accept the idea of him being in danger, i myself when i started to research this and when it hit me, i stopped for almost 2 weeks because i didn't want to accept this or even think that it could be what happened, but i found out that denying this won't make it go away if it's indeed true and that's what made me go on, what if he needs help, and that's why am not stopping. So, i completely understand you, it's hard but what if this is the truth, and we are wasting our time in the wrong direction, we won't help him even if we wanted, we should keep our emotions aside one way or another to be able to figure it out, as we all know feelings are blind and no one wants to feel bad. In my case, i can't deny the facts and what i saw and found just because it hurts me, it's a hard decision, and i had to make it, so i completely know where you are coming from xxooxx. If this is the truth and if this is what happened, denying it won't make it fiction. I just hope he is fine. :?
Take care guys and have a nice day, love and peace
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I can't wait to hear the explanation from Lordes of London regarding the performance insurance. Unless someone with that company cut a shady deal, the story about Michael being heavily addicted wont fly. The surveillance tapes I believe are already in custody and probably have been from jump.
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@NothingButLove
Actually, the story about the wine in the coke cans on flights was true.
MJ was a nervous flyer and he did drink wine. However, it was initially the fight attendants idea to put it in a cola can. MJ agreed as this way he could drink and his children wouldnt be aware that he was drinking alcohol.
This was not "discredited by Meseurea" at all. Ive read the full court transcripts and this is fact.
What was discredited, was the fact that this "wine in coke cans on flights" was twisted by the media to make out Michael gave kids wine in coke cans at Neverland.
Michael was a human adult man. He enjoyed a drink sometimes. So what??
And many other people have said he liked a drink occasionally and there are many pictures out there of MJ holding a drink at various places.
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If Michael did commit suicide, i would be more comfortable with that.
Id rather Michael ended his life on his own choice, rather than someone take ir from him.
I just need this damn trial to start. Im sure there is a lot of evidence that has been with-held that we dont know about yet.
Maybe once we know, the puzzle will fall into place and we can get closure.
This has been going on for so long now... i just want to know what happened so i can let Michael go in peace. :cry:
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Thank you NothingButLove for your reply. I must think it over.
DancingTheDream, I agree with you - "i just want to know what happened so i can let Michael go in peace." My thoughts exactly.... :cry:
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@DancingTheDream: First, Happy new year. :)
About the wine, i have no problem with anyone doing anything and i won't hate him because of it, but i am stating things, that was documented by his friends and close ones. Through my search i found that the wine in cans weren't the attendants idea they were given instructions for his meals and everything and it was written by one of his people not by Mike himself, and it was right before the court date, so they could use it in court like you said and twist the truth, if he was drinking in cans during his flights why wasn't it known way before the trial, i mean come on Michael has been travelling his entire life and not all the people around him would keep a secret, so why hasn't it come out except until the trial, coincidence again, no. I am not making things up, all the close people around him mentioned that he didn't drink, Michael himself said so, the guy who designed the house said the same. Regarding the picture, we had the same thing with our former King, pictures of him were circulating that he was drinking and of course they used it against him just like they did with Michael :? , and then it turned out to be that he used to put apple juice in his glass because it is protocol and him being a gentleman so not to embarrass those who drink, so they would feel free, and there is one picture for Michael if you saw it, he was with a group of friends and they were all raising the glasses, and Michael wasn't he was just laughing with them. I don't care if he drinks or not, apparently i have no problem with that but the majority have a problem accepting or dealing with the fact that he didn't drink or abuse drugs, like this makes him less human or not normal, you see what i mean, and like i said i could do a topic and include all the testimonies and articles and everything, but it's gonna take time, and i am busy plus we have a problem in my country :? , it sucks :cry: , the world is heading to a dark place :? , please pray for us, and that's why i don't have the time now. Anyways sweetie, no bad feelings, even if we disagree we're still good ;) , am not trying to convince anyone with anything i am just saying what i know. :)
I agree with you when you said this "This has been going on for so long now... i just want to know what happened so i can let Michael go in peace." i understand where you are coming from, and i really hope the truth would come out one day soon. :cry:
@VeryLittleSusie: you're welcome sweetie it's nothing to mention, take your time and if there is anything i can do please let me know :) , i hope the truth would come out soon.
Take care guys and have a nice day, love and peace. Much love to you guys.
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This particular phrase in Nothingbutlove's post caught my eye:
The only way for him to pull this off and not be in jail if he was found and/or came back like some think, is that the authorities would help him, and after what they have done to him and still doing to him, they won't help him, and laws are there to protect corporations, nothing more nothing less and we all know that, they even changed the laws just to bring him down.
What laws did they change? I didn't hear about that? :| :oops:
I guess that it is hard for me to accept this theory, I must be still very young at heart and delusional... I can't believe world could be so bad.... :cry:
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This particular phrase in Nothingbutlove's post caught my eye:
The only way for him to pull this off and not be in jail if he was found and/or came back like some think, is that the authorities would help him, and after what they have done to him and still doing to him, they won't help him, and laws are there to protect corporations, nothing more nothing less and we all know that, they even changed the laws just to bring him down.
What laws did they change? I didn't hear about that? :| :oops:
I guess that it is hard for me to accept this theory, I must be still very young at heart and delusional... I can't believe world could be so bad.... :cry:
The law that now states that if a celebrity or person of high standing settles out of court, the state can still go after the person and prosecute them. They no longer need for the victim to file charges. Stems from Michael paying off the 1st accusers of child molestation. Before then, it didn't exist.
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if MJ has killed himself, so why Murray traveled to Forest Lawn
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:cry: :cry: :cry:
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This particular phrase in Nothingbutlove's post caught my eye:
The only way for him to pull this off and not be in jail if he was found and/or came back like some think, is that the authorities would help him, and after what they have done to him and still doing to him, they won't help him, and laws are there to protect corporations, nothing more nothing less and we all know that, they even changed the laws just to bring him down.
What laws did they change? I didn't hear about that? :| :oops:
I guess that it is hard for me to accept this theory, I must be still very young at heart and delusional... I can't believe world could be so bad.... :cry:
The law that now states that if a celebrity or person of high standing settles out of court, the state can still go after the person and prosecute them. They no longer need for the victim to file charges. Stems from Michael paying off the 1st accusers of child molestation. Before then, it didn't exist.
Thank you so much for your explanation. I didn't realise that... :?
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if MJ has killed himself, so why Murray traveled to Forest Lawn
That's why. To mourn his "friend" who comitted suicide. :?
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I just cant stop thinking about those cctv tapes,were are they,they need to be found.
Me too!!
Can anyone here attend the front of the courthouse with a placards loudly displaying the words "WHERE ARE THE CCTV TAPES??!!" ?
Surely this would compel the media to comment and make the issue more difficult to sweep under the carpet?
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I just cant stop thinking about those cctv tapes,were are they,they need to be found.
Me too!!
Can anyone here attend the front of the courthouse with a placards loudly displaying the words "WHERE ARE THE CCTV TAPES??!!" ?
Surely this would compel the media to comment and make the issue more difficult to sweep under the carpet?
I agree
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I just cant stop thinking about those cctv tapes,were are they,they need to be found.
Me too!!
Can anyone here attend the front of the courthouse with a placards loudly displaying the words "WHERE ARE THE CCTV TAPES??!!" ?
Surely this would compel the media to comment and make the issue more difficult to sweep under the carpet?
I agree
Should some Army troops be deployed via pm or should we start a new topic requesting help?
Or... do we just stay calm & wait? :?
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So Murray gave Mike 25ml and after that Mike gave himself so much propofol that it killed him? LMFAO, what a mess. I don't know if any of you ever got propofol, but that is simply IMPOSSIBLE. He wouldn't be put under from that 25ML at all, so first question would be: why would Murray even give him a small amount like that if he was trying to put him under. After that Mike injected himself until he died... When I got my propofol shot, I was completely out in a few seconds. No way I could have injected myself so much that I would OD. This story stinks and I really don't get why there is not a single doctor speaking out on this madness... Probably no one gives a fuck.
I've never had a propofol shot and I'm not a doctor but I know enough to know that what the defense is claiming is a bunch of BS. Then again Michael dying is a bunch of BS too. So I guess that makes sense - it's all BS!
As for other doctors not speaking out on it, it is kind of weird and ya, they probably just don't care. Or, maybe some have spoken about it amongst themselves and know something doesn't add up. But who knows why they've kept quiet about it. Any doctors on the forum??
Amen. And taking that in account I say: if such a lame story gets the judge to accept the 'evidence' :?: and bring CM to trial - although medics can confirm that an OD by self-injection made by MJ is not possible - then that is AGAIN next evidence, this trial is fake.