Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators
General Discussion => General Discussion => The Great Reset, New World Order & Global Mind Control => Topic started by: everlastinglove_MJ on February 18, 2011, 04:57:33 PM
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17 February 2011
Bahrain protests banned as military tightens grip
Protests have been banned in Bahrain and the military has been ordered to tighten its grip after the violent removal of anti-government demonstrators, state TV reports.
The army would take every measure necessary to preserve security, the interior ministry said.
Three people died and 231 were injured when police broke up the main protest camp, said Bahrain's health minister.
The unrest comes amid a wave of protest in the Middle East and North Africa.
Bahrain's demonstrators want wide-ranging political reforms and had been camped out in the capital, Manama, since Tuesday.
Tanks and checkpoints
US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton expressed Washington's "deep concern" in a call to the Bahraini foreign minister on Thursday.
Mrs Clinton "urged restraint moving forward. They discussed political and economic reform efforts to respond to the citizens of Bahrain," a state department official told the BBC.
Police action was necessary to pull Bahrain back from the "brink of a sectarian abyss", Bahraini Foreign Minister Khaled bin Ahmed al-Khalifa said on Thursday.
Bahrain's Shia Muslim majority has been ruled by a Sunni Muslim royal family since the 18th Century.
The announcement on state television said the army had taken control of "key parts" of the city.
Tanks, army patrols and military checkpoints are out on key streets, with helicopters deployed overhead.
Barbed wire has been erected on roads leading to the main protest area, Pearl Square, and the interior ministry has warned people to stay off the streets.
Protesters and opposition politicians expressed outrage at the violence of the crackdown.
A leader of the main minority Shia opposition, Abdul Jalil Khalil, said 18 MPs were resigning in protest.
Ibrahim Sharif, of Bahrain's secular Waad party, told the BBC the protests would continue.
"We are going to do what's necessary to change this into a democratic country, even if some of us lose our lives," he said.
"We want a proper, functioning, constitutional democracy."
Mr Sharif said the riot police had moved into Pearl Square at about 0300 (0000 GMT) as people were sleeping.
Hundreds of protesters were injured Bahrain's authorities defended their actions. Finance Minister Sheikh Ahmed Bin Mohammed Al Khalifa told the BBC up to 70 police officers had been hurt.
"When (the police) first went in, they went in without any intention to harm anybody, just to move the people who were occupying the roundabout and blocking traffic," Sheikh Al Khalifa said.
"Some of those people left but some of those people came back and fought."
He added: "I think restraint is being used."
But many protesters said there had been no warning about the raid.
On Thursday morning there were angry scenes outside Manama's main hospital, Salmaniya, as hundreds of people gathered, some answering calls to donate blood and others defacing images of the Bahraini royal family.
'Exercise restraint'
The crackdown has caused unease in the West. Bahrain is a key UK and US ally and hosts the US Navy's Fifth Fleet.
UK Foreign Secretary William Hague condemned the violent clashes, calling on Bahrain's government to "exercise restraint".
Britain has also said it will review its licences for arms exports to Bahrain. The UK has sold tear gas and riot control equipment to Bahrain, but the Foreign Offices says these licences will be revoked if it is found those arms were used to facilitate internal repression.
Foreign ministers of the Gulf Cooperation Council, which includes Bahrain, Oman, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and the United Arab Emirates, are to hold an extraordinary meeting in Bahrain on Thursday.
Bahrain's foreign ministry said council members were "expected to announce their support for the [Bahraini] government in security, defence and politically".
Since independence from the UK in 1971, tensions between the Sunni elite and the less affluent Shia have frequently caused civil unrest. Shia groups say they are marginalised, subject to unfair laws, and repressed.
The conflict lessened in 1999 when Sheikh Hamad bin Isa Al Khalifa became emir. He began a cautious process of democratic reform. In 2002, he proclaimed himself king and landmark elections were held.
But the opposition boycotted the polls because the appointed upper chamber of parliament was given equal powers to the elected lower chamber.
At the scene
Ian Pannell,
BBC News, Manama
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There were columns of tanks and armoured personnel carriers moving through the city this morning. The area around Pearl Square, which was the home of the protesters up until 12 to 15 hours ago, is now ringfenced by the security forces.
Barbed wire has been erected; there are vehicle checkpoints and roadblocks around the city, traffic is being controlled, and the authorities have said all protests have been banned.
It was a very different scene at the hospital: one of passion, chaos, mourning - and anger. Hundreds of people were gathered outside as the ambulances turned up. Crowds rushed forward; doctors were angry because they said ambulances had been prevented from attending to those people who had been injured when the police attacked them.
On the wards, we saw a ledger of those who had been admitted: there were more than 300 names at that point. In the morgue, there were three people who had been killed, all with very clear evidence that live rounds had been used on them.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12495733 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12495733)
Again a fight for freedom and democracy, which I completely support, though I'm worried because three people have been killed yesterday, a fourth today, many injured and many protesters are missing. It's sickening to read that some protesters were shot dead by the police without warning. Shouldn't we all (the world) join the protests against the surpressing authorities in Bahrain. I know, that's not realistic, I'm afraid it's very complicated, but that's how I feel right now. I deeply wish strength and faith for the people in Bahrain and others who fight for freedom.
''The caged bird sings
with a fearful trill
of things unknown
but longed for still
and his tune is heard
on the distant hill
for the caged bird
sings of freedom.''
Maya Angelou (b. 1928), U.S. author. Caged Bird, Shaker, Why Don't You Sing? (1983).
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God, I really hope this tide will turn. They should not give up, who the fuck thinks they can kill someone for demanding freedom?
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God, I really hope this tide will turn. They should not give up, who the fuck thinks they can kill someone for demanding freedom?
the ones who think they got the power :x
There must be ONE LOVE, we get to share it, LOVE will conquer all
[youtube:3jcd8gkm]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zz7Yf-etI2E[/youtube:3jcd8gkm]
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A little history on the geopolitics of the Persian Gulf
By: Lorenzo Angiolillo F.
The Carter era deployed warships in the Gulf and compact that forces Americans could do use periodically Bahrain, military bases in Diego Garcia (an island under British control in the Ocean Indian), as well as in Oman and Saudi Arabia. All these bases were employed between 1990 y1991 during the Gulf war, and are using today.
The State of Bahrain, ancient Saar, belongs to the Asian continent its strategic position in the Persian Gulf has done was controlled and influenced by the Assyrians, Babylonians, Greeks, Persians and the Arabs, in which the island became Islamic. Bahrain was known in ancient times as Dilmun, Tylos (name given by the Greeks), Awal and Mishmahig when it was part of the Persian Empire. In 1977 United States evacuated the naval base of al - Jufayr. The Iranian revolution had an impact on the country in the 1980s due to the effect that produced a Sunni power on a mainly Shiite population as a consequence of this fact, in 1981 establishing the clandestine front for national liberation. In 1999 Emir Isa bin Sulman Al Khalifa dies and his son Hamad bin Isa Al-Khalifa inherits the throne. 2002 The Emir assumes the throne as King. Bahrain is a hereditary monarchy under the leadership of Al-Khalifa family. The King is head of State and Prime Minister is head of Government. Both positions are occupied by members of the Al-Khalifa family. During the war of Iraq V fleet carriers and United States command Central Naval (NAVCENT) operated from Manama and Al - Jufayr in full swing. The full cooperation of Bahrain with United States in the military field made that pleased White House, 14 March 2002 have select condition who until then had only Egypt and Jordan among Arab countries (then Bahrain was the first monarchy of the Gulf in obtaining it) to Bahrain of the status of Principal ally and nothing more than eight States around the world, which allows access to surplus of NATO armaments remittances and tendering of contracts of the U.S. armed forces. Live primarily oil, although it has large reserves of Gas.
Island Diego Garcia is a coral atoll of approximately 40 km², the largest in a group of 52 islands comprising the Chagos Archipelago, located in the Indian Ocean was discovered at the beginning of the 16th century, by a Portuguese expedition in 1554, the marine is Spanish Diego García de Moguer discovered the Chagos Archipelago named largest island with its name, Diego Garcia. EE.UU. requested in 1966 to United Kingdom authorization to use military assignment is for 50 years until 2016. (Already are asking for renewal for 50 years more). Its native residents were expelled by Great Britain to clear the field to an American military base. Two conditions were required by the Americans: Island was completely emptied of its inhabitants and eluded the British evacuate them. Between 1967 and 1973 "ilois" (as they are referred to as the "diegogarcianos") were systematically expelled from their homes. The diegogarcianos people expelled from their territories in the 20th century. At the end of 2000, in a lawsuit initiated by the expelled, the European Court of human rights and the London High Court he found had been "shamefully treated" and they had the right to return to the island, but he recognized the military character that prevents civilians, settlement and a sarcastic English government excuses is that according to their studies that island will be flooded by climate change, "apparently" the gringos think otherwise. Now there there a large naval base that controls the Near East and South Asia. Diego Garcia was the only American naval base launched air offensive operations during operation "Desert Storm" and is considered to be vital in the defensive structure of the United States. Diego Garcia was used as a clandestine detention center "cesspool" of the C.I.A since 2001 as he could know... Why all the bases have its objective
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God, I really hope this tide will turn. They should not give up, who the fuck thinks they can kill someone for demanding freedom?
DiTTo that!
Interesting developments in the middle east.
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2011 seems to be the year for revolution, freedom and take overs.
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Im not sure violent protests are the way forward and i dont think they should be encouraged.
I find it disturbing that Egypt is now being used as a blueprint for "change"
What if this is the NWO plan?? bring chaos and unrest to the World???
I am sure my view will not be shared by many....
But the pen is mightier than the sword.
Violent protests are not the answer.
This will only bring more death and pain.
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I agree .... so the ruling elites have decided some time ago Affects us all ... the strategy is for all people.
Even in Italy ... the media are converging attention on the behavior of the Prime Minister, for the crimes of extortion and prostitution of minors.
This is very serious, sure, but the media divert people's attention from more serious events : the goal is to exaggerate the popular reactions to this facts so to being asked a government "strong and authoritarian "....
light the fuse of the disorder popular in Arab countries.
It 's a clear strategy of fire for the Mediterranean and overturn the governments.
This is not for Freedom of the people but to tighten their living conditions and to
force them then, with false promises, to a government even more authoritarian and
gradually up to the New World Order.
For all us...Affects us all ... the strategy is for all people.
Even in Italy ... the media are converging attention on the behavior of the Prime Minister, for the crimes of extortion and prostitution of minors.
A premier who has combined sorts of things, accused for serious offenses and proscribed terms, is investigated and processed in record time for an alleged sexual offense. How can we ever think that a state apparatus such as the judiciary, always ready to protect the interests of power suddenly is free to prosecute what appears today as the most powerful man in Italy?
This is very serious, sure, but the media divert people's attention from more serious events : the object is to cause the popular reactions to this facts so to being asked a government "strong and authoritarian "....... to restore honesty and cleanliness :roll:
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Im not sure violent protests are the way forward and i dont think they should be encouraged.
I find it disturbing that Egypt is now being used as a blueprint for "change"
What if this is the NWO plan?? bring chaos and unrest to the World???
I am sure my view will not be shared by many....
But the pen is mightier than the sword.
Violent protests are not the answer.
This will only bring more death and pain.
As far as I know the government turned this into a violent demonstration and not the demonstrators. I think people are opening their eyes. Tunesia was the first to show the world that if you feel like your freedom has been taken away, that you have the power to get it back if you unite. I hope they will continue to fight for their freedom. I don't like the violence, but if that is what they have to face to get their freedom back, then all I hope is that it won't be in vain. Point is that they need to stay awake after they succeed, because taking down the government is only the beginning. Building up your country and making it work is the next step. And always stay alert so that they can't trick you anymore.
I heard there were demonstrations in Spain too, did anyone hear something about that?
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If the protesters are not being violent... then how did police officers become hurt?
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If the protesters are not being violent... then how did police officers become hurt?
Self defence?
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If the protesters are not being violent... then how did police officers become hurt?
Self defence?
We have to be careful here. Police officers are people doing their jobs. I find it interesting, police officers are becoming a legitimate target in all of this and are always painted as the bad guys and the instigator in violence.
It could equally be argued that the injuries that were sustained by protesters were caused by police officers acting in self defence.
This is part of my argument as to why these protests should not be encouraged. We are pitting people against people.... whilst the ones who are required to stand up and answer are protected in their ivory towers.
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If the protesters are not being violent... then how did police officers become hurt?
Self defence?
We have to be careful here. Police officers are people doing their jobs. I find it interesting, police officers are becoming a legitimate target in all of this and are always painted as the bad guys and the instigator in violence.
It could equally be argued that the injuries that were sustained by protesters were caused by police officers acting in self defence.
They follow up orders from the government to stop protesters, even with violence if needed. They should have looked at the army in Egypt, who only made sure that it didn't get out of hand, but let the people peacefully demonstrate.
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They follow up orders from the government to stop protesters, even with violence if needed. They should have looked at the army in Egypt, who only made sure that it didn't get out of hand, but let the people peacefully demonstrate.
I guess it depends on the country you are in.
In the UK, the police are "policing by consent".
I know not all police officers (as in all jobs) are good people. There are bad apples and corruption in all walks of life.
However, a government cannot order to stop protesters in my country. The police are there to protect the citizens and uphold the law. No-one can "order" a police officer to make an arrest. That is up to individual descretion.
The point i am trying to make....
is what if this is what the NWO want?? Pit people against people. Create chaos and disorder, whilst they sit back and watch it all unfold. They are not the ones on the street. They are not the ones faced with a baying mob they have to stop. Think for one minute what it would be like to be a police officer on the front line faced with that. They are humans... people... with families and children themselves. They are not robots.
Sometimes i think we really have to stop and think deeper, for a minute.
It is not ok to be violent and hurt a fellow human being under any circumstances. You say "self defence". Like i said.. the police officers can equally use that excuse too.
I feel that the World is being encouraged, at the moment,.. to join in with these protests.. that it is ok to violently protest and injure people and destroy property. I cannot agree with that. There are ways and means of protesting. It doesnt have to be violent.
This could be part of the plan.. is what i am saying.. create chaos and violence and disorder. Let it unfold before they can use it as an excuse to rein it all back in.
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I keep thinking about the increasing amount of protests in the Middle East. In the news I'm trying to find the cause of all the unrest. It's like a domino track and wondering where the first stone was falling, I suppose Tunesia. May be the tension of being surpressed became too high among the people of Tunesia that it was the last straw. In the news we learned that it started with protests against high unemployment, but it turned out to be protests against the violent police brutality. The goverment condemned the protests as a act of terrorism. Though the government had announced lower figures of people who've been killed according to human right organisations.
The police in Bahrain who's claiming according to the news that they got injured by the protesters. No doubt it was self defence of the protesters.
The media is used as a tool by the government's/authorities, not only in Tunesia, also in Egypt, Bahrain, Yemen etc., to camouflage their flaws and keep a positive reputation towards the rest of the world. That is the power of the government AND the media.We don't know exactly what really happened there, we're dependent on what the media - under consent of the Middle East governments - provides us, which is tricky because we'll see what the governments want us to see.
LOVE & Peace
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The dark side can turn a peaceful demonstration into a violent one. They can infiltrate it with agents provocateurs and hence give an excuse for the police to retaliate and discredit the purpose of the demonstration .... . We never know :?
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All I know is the guy that was responsible for what went down in Cairo was an Egyptian and it was started via the internet...pretty cool.
I think this was bound to happen sooner or later...this could be the sooner OR the later.
Since we are a global society with lots of educated people...a lot which have been or finished their education in the states...then went back to their various countries have seen what we live like or any free country as adversed to a dictatorship.
They are sick of being the worker bee paupers over there and the wealth going to the dictator.
I think this is a good thing.
The next big thing is going to be establishing a different kind of government...
it will not be easy....hope they can do it right.
POWER TO THE PEOPLE!
Big sacrifices were and are being made to make this happen.
I figured Bahrain would be mowing them down in the streets more then they did.
That country is disappointing....they are such liar's.
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Now what about Mexico?
We have a serious problem right next door...I feel sorry for the residents.
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Im not sure violent protests are the way forward and i dont think they should be encouraged.
I find it disturbing that Egypt is now being used as a blueprint for "change"
What if this is the NWO plan?? bring chaos and unrest to the World???
Coincidentally or not, a video went viral today showing a group of peaceful Bahraini protesters getting shot at by Bahrain's army: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3WRKoZPPao
Way to discourage any peaceful protesting.
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Figures.
The big heads over there will not go quietly.
I read a site where poster's who live in Bahrain post and ...little did I know how
harsh they really are behind their big glass modern curtain...until I read what they had to say.
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Looks like it is spreading to Marocco.
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Im not sure violent protests are the way forward and i dont think they should be encouraged.
I find it disturbing that Egypt is now being used as a blueprint for "change"
What if this is the NWO plan?? bring chaos and unrest to the World???
I am sure my view will not be shared by many....
But the pen is mightier than the sword.
Violent protests are not the answer.
This will only bring more death and pain.
Who said that the revolution in Egypt was a violent one?!?!? The Egyptian protesters were unarmed and the revolution was a very peaceful one!!! But the government started to shoot them from the top of the houses. The police was shooting the crowds of the protesters and killing them. Children were killed too. It was a real fight on the streets but remember one thing: The protesters normally don't start the violence. It is always the police or the army that tries to kill the people to make them afraid of the government. But the people want their freedom and are fed up with their governments. They want democracy. How is that wish to be fulfilled if the people don't fight for their freedom? When the Egyptian President stepped down the Egyptian people got very happy and they went to the streets ad started to clean all the streets of the city especially the Tahrir Square where all these violent act took place. They were happy for the victory. So cleaning the city was a major sign of their victory and their feelings towards their country!
The first revolution in the Middle East this year was in Tunisia, not in Egypt.
Now in Libya things are getting worse. The government is shooting the crows of protesters with canons!!!!! Watch the news. It's madness!!!!!!! I hope they could succeed to change their government as soon as possible!!!!!![attachment=1:luezofmt]5438689994_e11b119ce6_z.jpg[/attachment:luezofmt]
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[attachment=1:63drx7d8]tahrir.jpg[/attachment:63drx7d8]
This is how the Tahrir Square in Cairo looked like starting from the 25th of this month. People slept on the streets and demanded the president to step down. There were over 3 Million Egyptians demonstrating.
This is the Revolution in Bahrain. Many people were killed there too by the governmet!!!
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Like it or not, the whole volatility in the middle east is nothing to do with democracy but everything to do with safeguarding oil. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if the USA had a hand in all of this so they can destabilise the region and then work some cushy oil deals for themselves.
Blair has had his hand in that tactic, too.
This aint about freedom and democracy... its about oil and money!!
Look at Libya... its an oil rich nation... and the proverbial is about to well and truly hit the fan!
Im all for Gadaffi getting the heave-ho. Im all for people fighting for a democratic country, free of dictatorship. Im just finding this all very suspicious. Its like it is the beginning of the end.
I keep thinking about the ending of Planet of the Apes... where the lead character realises that the human race blew itself up.
The World is about to become a much more scarier, volatile place from now on.
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Let me repeat myself WE-The USA did not have anything to do with this!
As was stated earlier it ALL started in Tunisia by a fruit farmer!
U.S. stocks tumbled as escalating tensions in the Middle East and North Africa sent oil prices soaring.
European markets also declined on the geopolitical turmoil, adding to the previous session's heavy losses. Italy's stock market was closed for most of the day because of what the exchange said was a technical glitch, and stocks fell when trading began in the afternoon. The Stoxx Europe 600 index dropped 0.6% to 285.38.
The Dow Jones Industrial Average slid 178.46 points, or 1.4%, to 12212.79. It was the biggest percentage and point drop since Nov. 16. The Standard & Poor's 500-stock index dropped 2.1% to 1315.44, and the Nasdaq Composite fell 2.7% to 2756.42.
Investors said the U.S. stock market had been ready for a pullback, as major indexes had risen for 16 of the past 20 sessions to reach 2½-year highs on Friday. U.S. markets were closed Monday for a holiday.
Wal-Mart Stores weighed on the Dow, sliding 3.1% after the retailer's fiscal fourth-quarter profit rose 27%, capitalizing on strength in its international business, but its U.S. operations continued to struggle. Wal-Mart posted its seventh consecutive quarter of lower U.S. same-store sales, and fourth-quarter revenue fell short of expectations.
Bank of America fell 3.9% after saying its credit-card subsidiary was restating eight quarters of reports to regulators because it took a $20.3 billion write-down due to deteriorating credit and new regulations over the past two years.
Libyan leader Col. Moammar Gadhafi, in a televised speech, defied protesters seeking his removal and vowed to remain in Libya "until the end." Oil prices jumped on fears that supplies from the country, a major crude exporter, will be disrupted.
Compared with Friday's closing level, crude for March delivery surged $7.37 a barrel, or 8.55%, to $93.57 on the New York Mercantile Exchange, the biggest dollar gain since September 2008.
Energy components were among the few gainers in the Dow Industrials, thanks to the rise in oil. Chevron gained 1.6%, while Exxon Mobil rose 1.1%.
In Milan, the stock market was closed for most of the day due to "a technical issue on the price information systems," Borsa Italiana said. When it opened, the benchmark FTSE MIB index fell 1.1% to 21993.96, adding to Monday's 3.6% slump. Italian stocks are seen as particularly sensitive to the Libyan turmoil given Italy's close ties to the country. Oil company Eni fell 0.9% and lender UniCredit /quotes/comstock/23g!ucg (IT:UCG 1.84, -0.03, -1.82%) dropped 1.8%, following steep falls Monday.
Elsewhere, London's FTSE 100 fell 0.3% to 5996.76, Frankfurt's DAX was marginally lower at 7318.35 and Paris's CAC 40 slumped 1.2% to 4050.27.
Airlines ranked among the hardest-hit stocks because of the spike in oil prices. Air France-KLM dropped 3% in Paris, and easyJet /quotes/comstock/23s!a:ezj (UK:EZJ 366.00, 0.00, 0.00%) fell 2.9% in London.
In London, defense-related stocks fell on fears the U.K. might make further cuts to its military budget. BAE Systems was the biggest decliner on the FTSE 100, down 4.3%, while Rolls-Royce fell 1.5% and Smiths Group dropped 0.9%.
The Swiss franc rose sharply against the dollar as traders sought safety.
The dollar was at 0.9385 franc in late New York trade, down from 0.9471 franc Monday. The euro slipped to $1.3653 from $1.3675.
Gold for February delivery climbed $12.30 per troy ounce, or 0.9%, to $1400.50 on the Comex division of Nymex.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/europe ... 2-22-21600 (http://www.marketwatch.com/story/europes-markets-sink-2011-02-22-21600)
Not to mention that Moamer Kadhafi is INSANE.
Watch his unintelligible speech on CNN.
UHHHHHHHHH!
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Kadhafi is killing his own people. I believe more than ever that he is psychopat. How can this person run a country?? He is not well.
I am waiting to see a response from Iran.
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Ghaddafi is really crazy. :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Yes and the "Democracies" have shaken hands with him not so long ago...
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by Gema » Wed Feb 23, 2011 4:18 am
Kadhafi is killing his own people.
I believe more than ever that he is psychopath.
How can this person run a country??
He is not well.
by diggyon » Wed Feb 23, 2011 4:51 am
Ghaddafi is really crazy.
Lol Gema/diggyon..
let us give the “heroic” Gadhafi a break, you notice Mr. G. did more than run a country for 42 yrs.
There is nothing wrong with “King of Kings” aka Gadhafi,lol. except,that he does not wish to give up his county , to the vultures that are salivating to rush in, and bring in, their so called “democracy”.
Too bad the "old mad dog" maybe getting on in age,and the times too , they are a changing. ;) ..
hmmm, you say he is .
."Killing his own people?" .
Who (what nation? ) isn't killing "his own people?"... Really,think about it pls.
To me Gadhafi is a real revolutionary ala the old giant Gamal A. Nassar, who,btw. was Gadafi's number one hero.
[attachment=0:27f3rwpp]1971-Libyan-leader-Muamma-024.jpg[/attachment:27f3rwpp]
While Gadhafi has a substantial number of enemies within Libya, his use of the county's enormous oil revenues to provide subsidized health care, education and housing to citizens, as well as his willingness to stand up to the West, granted him a reserve of good will that he still draws on today, said Vandewalle.
"This was a young nationalist who stood up to the West, who nationalized the oil companies, who stood up to Great Britain and the United States," Vandewalle said.
"It was highly symbolic and there are a number of people there who still grudgingly respect him for that".
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/02 ... index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/02/21/libya.gadhafi.profile/index.html)
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Supervision, I have no time right now for your brain teasers and debates :lol:
But,....I´ll be back 8-) (a la gemanator :lol: )
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@Gema..
Well...leave your confusion,put your cap on,
..and let's get going already then lol :lol: .
Can't possibly just sit to the side, and let you beat up on a "verified,bonafide, everydayregularrrr " old Hero. ;) :lol: .. :lol:
Peace
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Where to start with this man?
[youtube:evyam51m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTltNNT9Fzs&feature=related[/youtube:evyam51m]
[youtube:evyam51m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwSTru7pA70&feature=related[/youtube:evyam51m]
Up to 7 parts.....
[youtube:evyam51m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5XQtVyeuf8[/youtube:evyam51m]
[youtube:evyam51m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rD5IOPeAbc0&feature=related[/youtube:evyam51m]
His latest speech
[youtube:evyam51m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-u6cppZ1as&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL[/youtube:evyam51m]
[youtube:evyam51m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIrZRpkiMpg&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL[/youtube:evyam51m]
[youtube:evyam51m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJ71B5LU-DU&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL[/youtube:evyam51m]
And the reality
[youtube:evyam51m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeFpfyJK2kk&feature=related[/youtube:evyam51m]
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Thank you all for sharing your thoughts.
Here's some news from Amnesty International:
Security Council and Arab League must act decisively on Libyan crimes today
22 February 2011
AI Index: PRE01/073/2011
Amnesty International has today called on the UN Security Council and the Arab League to launch an immediate mission to Libya to investigate events that have left hundreds of protesters dead.
The call for the investigation, which could lead to prosecutions at the International Criminal Court (ICC), comes as both the UN Security Council and the Arab League meet today for special sessions to discuss the spiralling violence in the country.
The organization also called on the UN Security Council to impose a total arms embargo on Libya, amidst reports that security forces are continuing to deploy a range of weaponry, munitions and related military and police equipment to use lethal force against protesters.
“Colonel al-Gaddafi and his government appear to be prepared to kill as many people as it takes to stay in power. The international community needs to act now to put a stop to this.” said Salil Shetty, Amnesty International’s Secretary-General.
Amnesty International said that the UN and Arab League should send representatives to Libya immediately, either jointly or separately, to investigate the situation on the ground and report rapidly to the Security Council.
The organization said that the recommendations should include a judgement as to whether the scale of the crimes being committed in Libya warrants a Security Council referral to the Prosecutor of the ICC.
UN High Commissioner for Human Rights Navi Pillay yesterday said that the Libyan authorities’ actions against protesters may amount to crimes against humanity.
Saif al-Islam al-Gaddafi, Colonel al-Gaddafi’s son, said in a televised speech on 20 February that the army would “play a big part whatever the cost” to end anti-government protests and that the Libyan authorities will “fight to the last man and woman and bullet”.
“It is an outrage that al-Gaddafi’s son feels able publicly to announce the readiness to massacre Libyans in order to maintain his father’s hold on power.
“The international community must immediately make it clear to all those in the Libyan government, military and security apparatus that they and those carrying out their orders will be held to account for crimes under international law, such as those now being reported,” said Salil Shetty.
Amnesty International warned that reports it had received from hospitals in eastern Libya indicated that some 200 people had been killed by security forces up to 20 February. Hospital staff told Amnesty International that they were struggling to cope with the number of casualties.
The true number of deaths could be much higher as this sample represented only the major hospitals. Some families are also likely to have buried their dead without taking the bodies to hospitals.
“The Security Council must also put an immediate end to the export or transfer of all arms and military equipment to Libya. People are being killed in their hundreds with intent.
“Other states must not be complicit in further killing. All military and police supplies and cooperation with Libya must stop now until the risk of such serious human rights violations is ended,” said Salil Shetty.
In addition to the United Nations and Arab League, Amnesty International also called on the African Union to take action.
“All international bodies that Libya holds membership of need to recognise the gravity of this crisis. The African Union must urgently address the gross human rights abuses being committed in Libya in a special session of its Peace and Security Council,” said Salil Shetty.
Background
The UN Security Council has the authority to refer to the Prosecutor of the International Criminal Court situations that would not otherwise fall under the court's jurisdiction, for example when the state in question is not a party to the statute.
http://www.amnesty.org/en/for-media/pre ... s-today-20 (http://www.amnesty.org/en/for-media/press-releases/security-council-and-arab-league-must-act-decisively-libyan-crimes-today-20)
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Well Supervision, let me tell you some facts about Gamal Abd El Nasser, since you have mentioned his name, saying he was Mr. G's no. one!!!
Gamal Abd El Nasser was the Egyptian President after a revolution in 1952. He was a socialist. He promised the Egyptian people freedom after the Kingdom that was in Egypt before the revolution was exploiting the people as usual. This man had good intentions at first. He was following the Communist model as he was a socialist himself. He started to let the government build the factories to give hope to the people. Everything belonged to the country. The Russians were his friends. So we have seen what happened in Russia to the Communism! That's exactly what the people in Egypt were suffering from durig that time. Plus: those who were opposing his regime were brutally tortured and murdered. People were spying on each other. Family member where spying on each other. People were dragged from their homes in the middle of the night to secret places and disappeared forever. This is the time of Abd El Nasser, Mr. Ghaddafi's no. one!!May be at the beginning of the revolution his intentions were good. But time changes people!!! Power changes people as well. Power is a curse in my opinion!!! Even Nasser's followers in Egypt became his enemies because he tortured them psychologically!!!!
Let's come to Mubarak. He was a general in the army. He took part in the war between Egypt and Israel in 1973. He was a hero to the Egyptians like all army generals were, when Egypt defeated Israel and gained back the Sinai that was invaded by the Israeli army during that time. Mubarak's time was different. He was more into Capitalism! He saw that the people were suffering from Nasser's time because the government owned everything! So he started to sell everything to the businessmen!!!!! Even the national factories, the Egyptian lands... just everything. He Americans were his friends. At the beginning the people liked him!!!!! But then the =y felt the corruption everywhere in the land. After years from selling the national properties the country became a private property of the businenmen. People started to hate him. Elections were forged. Those who wanted to speak were also tortured and murdered. In the middle of the night people were dragged from their homes and disapperd without a trace!! Just like in Nasser's time!!! Is this a life??? Mubarak ruled for 30 years!!! Which European president ruled for 30 years?? The police was also very aggressive. They had orders to shoot people directly if they just start to open their mouth!!!! Didn't we talk about Mubarak, the war hero??? Now we are talking about Mubarak, the dictator!!! And as I said before: Time changes people and power changed people as well. And even money changes people!!!!!!His good history is forgotten now, just like Nasser's good history ... just for what he did to his own people....
May be Ghaddafi was one day a good leader who wanted a better life for his people after a revolution he lead in his country. But what can we say after 42 years?? He is doing exactly what the leader before him was doing to his own people and made him lead the revolution against him!!!!In the news we can see people saying he is the decision maker in his country!! No one has the right to oppose him. Those who oppose him go to prison.
The people are poor.... and so on and so on. No he is killing them with canons because they oppose him!!!! Is this normal??? Canons???????????????????????????????????
The history repeats itself. Power changes people!
Peace
peace
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Whoever started it... whichever leader is in the right or in the wrong.... at the end of the day, i dont suppose it matters.
What matters is that innocents will suffer.
I am reminded of Michaels words and music, yet again.
So i will let Michael remind us all..... :)
[youtube:2r3rkwwo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvjy6MQr6fE[/youtube:2r3rkwwo]
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Whoever started it... whichever leader is in the right or in the wrong.... at the end of the day, i dont suppose it matters.
What matters is that innocents will suffer.
I am reminded of Michaels words and music, yet again.
So i will let Michael remind us all..... :)
[youtube:f31ligq6]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvjy6MQr6fE[/youtube:f31ligq6]
I entirely agree!
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Athens:
Police officer set on fire.
http://news.sky.com/skynews/Article/201009115939532 (http://news.sky.com/skynews/Article/201009115939532)
(This is what i do not like. People against people like this. Its like the World has been wound up to a point of no return now)
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@DancingTheDream
The song and video We've Had Enough fits very well here in this topic. Thank you.
When innocence is standing by
Watching people loosing lives
It seem as if we have no voice
It's time for us to make a choice
It is a strong and intense song of Michael.
We've Had Enough by Michael Jackson
Love was taken from a young live
And no one told her why
Her direction has a dimlight
From one more violent crime
She innocently questioned why
Why her father had to die
She asked the men in blue
How is it that you get to choose
Who will live and who will die
Did god told you you could decide?
You saw he didn't run
And then my daddy had no gun
In the middle of the village
Within a distant land
Lies a cool boy with his broken toy
To young to understand
He's awaken, ground is shaking
His father grabs his hand
Screaming crying, his wife's dying
Now he's left to explain
He innocently questioned why
Why his mother had to die
Why did these soldiers come here for?
If they're for peace why is there war?
Did god say that they could decide
Who will live and who will die?
All my mama ever did
Was try to take care of her kids
When innocence is standing by
Watching people loosing lives
It seem as if we have no voice
It's time for us to make a choice
Only god could decide
Who will live and who will die
There's nothing that can't be done
If we raise our voice as one
Did god hear it from me?
Did god hear it from you?
Did god hear it from us?
We can't take it
We've already had enough
Did god hear it from me?
Did god hear it from you?
Did god hear it from us?
We can't take it
We've already had enough
Thank god I care for me
Thank god I care for you
Thank god it came from you babe
We can't take it
We've already had enough
Deep in my soul baby
Deep in your soul and by your side
Deep in my soul
It's so big and i'm still alive
Did god hear it from us?
We can't take it
We've already had enough
It's going down baby
Just let god decide,
It's going on baby
Just let god decide
Deep in my soul baby
We've already had enough
Did god hear it from me?
Did god hear it from you ?
Did god hear it from us?
We can't, we can't
We've already had enough
http://www.lyricstime.com/michael-jacks ... yrics.html (http://www.lyricstime.com/michael-jackson-we-ve-had-enough-lyrics.html)
L.O.V.E.
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This is an incredibly powerful song - I don't know why it never made it to one of his main albums. I hope you won't be offended if I alter some of the lyrics that I think aren't quite right:
We've Had Enough by Michael Jackson
Love was taken from a young live (life)
And no one told her why
Her direction has a dimlight
From one more violent crime
She innocently questioned why
Why her father had to die
She asked the men in blue
How is it that you get to choose
Who will live and who will die
Did god told you you could decide? (Did God say that you could decide?)
You saw he didn't run
And then my daddy had no gun (And that my daddy had no gun)
In the middle of the village
Within a distant land (Way in a distant land)
Lies a cool boy with his broken toy (a poor boy)
To young to understand
He's awaken, ground is shaking
His father grabs his hand
Screaming crying, his wife's dying
Now he's left to explain
He innocently questioned why
Why his mother had to die
Why did these soldiers come here for? (What did ....)
If they're for peace why is there war?
Did god say that they could decide
Who will live and who will die?
All my mama ever did
Was try to take care of her kids
When innocence is standing by (We're innocently standing by)
Watching people loosing lives
It seem as if we have no voice
It's time for us to make a choice
Only god could decide
Who will live and who will die
There's nothing that can't be done
If we raise our voice as one
Did god hear it from me? (They've gotta hear it from me)
Did god hear it from you? (They've gotta hear it from you)
Did god hear it from us? (They've gotta hear it from us)
We can't take it
We've already had enough
Did god hear it from me? (They've gotta hear it from me)
Did god hear it from you? (They've gotta hear it from you)
Did god hear it from us? (They've gotta hear it from us)
We can't take it
We've already had enough
Thank god I care for me (They've gotta hear it from me)
Thank god I care for you (They've gotta hear it from you)
Thank god it came from you babe (They've gotta hear it from you baby)
We can't take it
We've already had enough
Deep in my soul baby
Deep in your soul and by your side (Deep in your soul and let God decide)
Deep in my soul
It's so big and i'm still alive (It's up to me and I'm still alive)
Did god hear it from us? (They've gotta hear it from us)
We can't take it
We've already had enough
It's going down baby
Just let god decide,
It's going on baby
Just let god decide
Deep in my soul baby
We've already had enough
Did god hear it from me? (They've gotta hear it from me)
Did god hear it from you ? (They've gotta hear it from you)
Did god hear it from us? (They've gotta hear it from us)
We can't, we can't
We've already had enough
http://www.lyricstime.com/michael-jacks ... yrics.html (http://www.lyricstime.com/michael-jackson-we-ve-had-enough-lyrics.html)
L.O.V.E.
-
This is an incredibly powerful song - I don't know why it never made it to one of his main albums. I hope you won't be offended if I alter some of the lyrics that I think aren't quite right:
We've Had Enough by Michael Jackson
Love was taken from a young live (life)
And no one told her why
Her direction has a dimlight
From one more violent crime
She innocently questioned why
Why her father had to die
She asked the men in blue
How is it that you get to choose
Who will live and who will die
Did god told you you could decide? (Did God say that you could decide?)
You saw he didn't run
And then my daddy had no gun (And that my daddy had no gun)
In the middle of the village
Within a distant land (Way in a distant land)
Lies a cool boy with his broken toy (a poor boy)
To young to understand
He's awaken, ground is shaking
His father grabs his hand
Screaming crying, his wife's dying
Now he's left to explain
He innocently questioned why
Why his mother had to die
Why did these soldiers come here for? (What did ....)
If they're for peace why is there war?
Did god say that they could decide
Who will live and who will die?
All my mama ever did
Was try to take care of her kids
When innocence is standing by (We're innocently standing by)
Watching people loosing lives
It seem as if we have no voice
It's time for us to make a choice
Only god could decide
Who will live and who will die
There's nothing that can't be done
If we raise our voice as one
Did god hear it from me? (They've gotta hear it from me)
Did god hear it from you? (They've gotta hear it from you)
Did god hear it from us? (They've gotta hear it from us)
We can't take it
We've already had enough
Did god hear it from me? (They've gotta hear it from me)
Did god hear it from you? (They've gotta hear it from you)
Did god hear it from us? (They've gotta hear it from us)
We can't take it
We've already had enough
Thank god I care for me (They've gotta hear it from me)
Thank god I care for you (They've gotta hear it from you)
Thank god it came from you babe (They've gotta hear it from you baby)
We can't take it
We've already had enough
Deep in my soul baby
Deep in your soul and by your side (Deep in your soul and let God decide)
Deep in my soul
It's so big and i'm still alive (It's up to me and I'm still alive)
Did god hear it from us? (They've gotta hear it from us)
We can't take it
We've already had enough
It's going down baby
Just let god decide,
It's going on baby
Just let god decide
Deep in my soul baby
We've already had enough
Did god hear it from me? (They've gotta hear it from me)
Did god hear it from you ? (They've gotta hear it from you)
Did god hear it from us? (They've gotta hear it from us)
We can't, we can't
We've already had enough
http://www.lyricstime.com/michael-jacks ... yrics.html (http://www.lyricstime.com/michael-jackson-we-ve-had-enough-lyrics.html)
L.O.V.E.
Thanks and no I don't feel offended, I copied&pasted it from lyricstime.com. I agree this song deserves much more attention. In fact it should be rereleased again.
-
The key to African: Gaddafi and the "oil blow" CIA Libya
In Libya, the key objective of attempting to overthrow Gaddafi is petroleum. Great mobilizing dynamics of military invasions, wars and regional conflicts, and internal shock of the CIA worn leaders and Presidents who already not "closed" hegemonic strategic control of the imperial power of the capitalist system is the seizure of the markets and natural sources of "black gold". A resource key (and endangered) for the future survival of the central powers.
By Manuel Freytas
IAR News - February 23, 2011
African oil key
The Libya was sung. It is the Grand Prize on the Board of the "popular revolts" armed and organized by the CIA, Mossad and services "allies" in Africa and the Middle East.
After starting a "democratic" remodeling project expelling their worn dictators allies in Egypt and Tunisia, U.S. goes by Libyan oil and a strategic location on the device of military geopolitical control in Africa.
For U.S. and global imperial power centres, Africa is a continent safe oil supply that contrabalancea conflict instability of an explosive Middle East, and a Central Asia in ongoing dispute between Russia axis and the "Western" block EU-USA.
Within the "cold war" energy with China and Putin Russia, American imperial power and its multinationals try to turn Africa into a sort of security against an explosive energy mattress Iran and the Middle East crossed by military conflicts.
The importance of Africa as a supplier of oil to the central powers is key. Already produces around 12% of consumed worldwide and 25% of what consume us, most of the latter imports from Saudi Arabia.
From the geopolitical and strategic framework of the "war on terrorism" USA, locomotive power of the capitalist system and its partners in the major European powers, advance in their conquest of Africa project to position in control of their energy and mineral reserves.
This project responded Bush create Administration decision the "The United States Africa Command (AFRICOM), a command of"counter-terrorism war"which began to operate actively in the region in 2008"
Geopolitical and military control of the African continent, which produces between 12 and 14 million barrels per day of oil (estimates by 2012), gives us the room for manoeuvre and sufficient security which justify the military in these countries interventions.
African Governments controlled by oligarchs and "warlords" funded and protected by Washington, are increasingly more powerless to control armed nationalist movements that hinder looting of TNCs, as it is the case of Somalia and the Horn of Africa.
In this scenario, and following the new doctrine in the quadrennial defence February 2006 revision, the Pentagon began to develop military operations in high level throughout Africa, mainly in their energy regions and key Southern and northern mining, creating specialized units dedicated to education and training of local in the "fight against terrorism" troops.
Operational strategy includes meetings between staffs of regional countries with official and Pentagon officials, maneuvers and joint exercises of the troops, systematic flights of aircraft recognition, location of photos taken by U.S. military satellites and provision of arms and technology of high precision to the forces involved in the "war on terror".
The Pentagon on Africa strategy responds to a double objective, geopolítico-militar and economic.
In addition to the business that provides the armamentistas and the service contractors from Pentagon increased military operations against "terrorism" in the region, it is estimated that Africa and its regions will provide, in just one decade, 25% of the crude oil which will consume us in 2015.
Control access to these sources has become a central strategic goal for Washington and its corporations protected by the Pentagon.
The role and mission of new military command USA for Africa, is the monitor and control African energy sources, as well as its global distribution (pipelines, tankers, and routes) systems.
And that is what American troops and Government puppets "associated" such as Nigeria and Yemen (among others) using justified rebels and population mass extermination under the argument of the fight against "terrorist groups" are doing.
This primary mission of the imperial troops was stated in the beginning, by President Jimmy Carter in January 1980, when he described the oil flow from the Persian Gulf and Africa as a "vital interest" for the United States.
Carter, then selected Nobel "paz" award, said us should use "any means that would be necessary," including military force to deal with and neutralize any attempt by a "hostile" power to block these strategic resources.
With the creation of the new unified command for military operations in Africa (AFRICOM), announced by Secretary of Defense, Robert Gates in February 2007, Washington and its oil corporations, behind the façade of the "counter-terrorism war" began a totalizado scheme of control and seizure of oil and the strategic resources of the black continent.
In this scenario you have to read the events of "popular revolts" organized by the CIA in Africa and the Middle East, and the bloody internal coup running against Gaddafi in Libya.
-
The "oil coup" in Libya
Unlike the rest of the processes of "popular in the Arab World Islamic protest" infiltrated by the CIA and "Allied" intelligences, Libya falls in operating patterns of the "Orange revolutions" in the Soviet space or "Buddhists in Tibet and Burma, shock" or "reformist" rebellion to overthrow the ayatollahs in Iran, framed in the new "cold war" areas of influence (military and commercial) that keeps the capitalist axis Russia with the capitalist axis USA-EU-Israel.
The coup against Gaddafi is seizure of Libyan oil, whose control (as happened with Iran in 1979) lost with the advent of Gaddafi Libya leadership in 1969.
Libya, Member of the Organization of producers of petroleum countries (OPEC), is the fourth largest producer of oil in Africa, Nigeria, Algeria and Angola, with about 1.8 million barrels per day and has reserves evaluated in 42,000 million barrels.
American (EIA) energy information agency Libya was in 2009 the fourth largest producer of oil in Africa with a production of 1,789 million barrels per day, behind Nigeria (2,211 mbd), Algeria (2,125 mbd) and Angola (1,948 mbd).
Libya also wants to develop its natural gas production, sector which has reserves estimated at 1,540 trillion cubic meters, according to the Organization of petroleum exporting countries (OPEC).
The country has doubled nearly exports of natural gas annually, according to OPEC statistics in three years of 5,400 million m3 in 2005 to more than 10,000 million m3.
Libya exports most of its oil to the countries of Europe, including Italy, Germany, Spain and France, and although they participate in the business, American oil companies have hegemony in extraction and marketing of crude oil in that country.
This data is key to understand the internal blow that CIA released mounted Libya in the facade of the "Arab riots" against "dictatorial regimes in Africa and Middle East"
In the same way as trafficking to destabilize Iran with the same operational methodology for infiltration and political orientation of the "outcry" Washington takes this scenario to launch an internal movement oreintado to overthrow Gaddafi, an "unstable" ally that favors relations with Europe and bankrupt countries within the "axis of evil".
The arrival of Colonel Gaddafi to power in 1969, oil, mainly American companies extracted Libyan soil more than 2 million barrels per day.
But very quickly, the Libyan leader nationalized oil, limited production, stripped the hegemony of extraction and marketing at American Octopus and created the national carrier of petroleum (NOC), which launched ventures with minority participation of foreign companies.
After over twenty years of isolation, Gaddafi regime reopened the energy resources and oil Libyan West, to the voracity of the oil companies mainly from the European Union.
Former British Prime Minister Tony Blair was the first to shake hands with the "old enemy" of the West in Tripoli. In doing so, he began to lead Libya outside of financial marginality and releasing it into the arms of Royal Dutch/Shell and BAE Systems, listed on the London Stock Exchange.
Visit Blair to Libya in 2004, the first of a British leader since 1943, was marked by a partnership established between Shell and the Libyan State oil company, some 30 years after the Anglo-Dutch firm produce modified in Libyan soil.
Since 2003 Libya installed the Italian company ENI, French TOTAL, Spanish REPSOL YPF and angloholandesa Royal Dutch Shell. Usamericanas Chevron and West had to wait three years for us to lift their trade sanctions login in Libyan oil cake.
In 2010, from January to November, the European Member countries of the Organisation for co-operation and economic development (OECD) bought an average of 1.06 million b/d of Libya, said the International Energy Agency (IEA).
In this scenario on "postponement" (participation in Libya isn't hegemonic) American oil consortia in relation to Europeans brand Central leading line of current operations destabilizing and coup against Gaddafi in Libya.
The current repressive scenario in Libya, checks the presence of well-known international actors and coup USA operations repeated as a calque globally with different names, like "Orange revolutions" in the former Soviet countries, "Buddhist rebellion" in Tibet and Southeast Asia, and the recent so-called "revolts Arab Islamic" which propagate through Africa, Middle East and threaten to spread to China, Russia and former Soviet countries.
On the one hand Gaddafi and his regime more than 40 years closed its borders to international press and suppressed in bloody form with military force to "opposition" groups armed and funded by the CIA and the "Western services".
And on the other, "democratising" block with USA, EU, UN and NGOs in the CIA creates internal and international conditions to finish with Gaddafi and install a "democratic Government" controlled by Washington.
Old strategies, old operations, and old well-known actors. The strategic objective is always the same: control geopolitico and regional military, Government control, control of strategic resources and control markets.
In Libya, the key objective of attempting to overthrow Gaddafi is petroleum.
Great mobilizing dynamics of military invasions, wars and regional conflicts and internal shock of the CIA worn leaders and Presidents who already not "closed" hegemonic strategic control of the imperial power of the capitalist system is the seizure of the markets and natural sources of "black gold".
A resource key (and endangered) for the future survival of the central powers.
http://movimientoantinwo.wordpress.com/ ... #more-4603 (http://movimientoantinwo.wordpress.com/2011/02/24/egipto-tunez-y-libia-revoluciones-inducidas-por-la-cia/#more-4603)
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Above 100 us per oil barrel :shock:
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@ diggyon » Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:19 am
@ everlastinglove_MJ » Wed Feb 23, 2011 7:20 am
@ Gema » Wed Feb 23, 2011 6:39 am
Hello all you guys, thanks for all your feedback, I wish I could answer each one of you separately, but, lol, I am still cleaning my computer ...makes it kind of cumbersome..
But anyway, "all I got to say is" ... a la the beautiful MISS Paris.. :lol: .
"The Peoples' Revolution" was a more than a bit of a farce people.
Wake up people,....
and don't forget , we on this forum are to look deeper into the Media reports to see what is fact and what is lies
..well, I already had a good idea what was really going on, but now I am in the know for real..check it out for yourself...
...
Lies , Lies and more Lies LOL. :roll: .
I really recommend, for all who are interested on this subject, to read to the finish.
will put them in two separate posts..enjoy. :)
New America Media, News Analysis, Yoichi Shimatsu, Posted: Feb 23, 2011
America's Next War Looms in Libya
In what country have Americans fought more wars than in any other?
The runners-up include the two wars in Iraq; a pair for Germany; Britain twice in the Revolution and 1812; and Cuba, a double-header if the covert Bay of Pigs operation is included.
The invasions of Canada don't count since it was still a British colony. These worthy foes fall short by half. The U.S. Marine Corps ditty about the "shores of Tripoli" provides a clue.
The answer was given away by Muammar Gadhafi in his defiant comeback speech on Feb. 22, accusing the U.S. of instigating the current rebellion against his regime.
His head wrapped in a saffron turban, he gave a rousing, if rambling, account of surviving dozens of U.S. bombs that blasted his desert encampment, wounding him and killing more than 40 aides in 1986.
The correct answer then is Libya, with four wars and counting. The two Barbary Wars of 1805 and 1815 were the first expeditionary campaigns for the newborn American republic.
Storming across the Sahara in 1943, Gen. George Patton led the Allied attack on Rommel's Afrikacorps. Libya was then a colony of Mussolini Italy, one of the Axis powers.
Later in 1986, President Ronald Reagan ordered air strikes against Gadhafi's tent in a near-miss assassination attempt.
Now a chorus of human rights activists are calling for the U.S. military to impose a no-fly zone over Libyan airspace, as was done over Kosovo during the NATO campaign to partition Yugoslavia in the late 1990s.
In the Balkans case, the no-fly policy led to shoot-downs followed by an invasion of ground troops.
Gadhafi's fiery pledge "to die as a martyr" is a signal that he is anticipating the Fifth American-Libyan War.
President Barack Obama, with ongoing conflicts in Afghanistan and Iraq and his own record of civilian casualties, has so far not escalated beyond covert support for America's newfound allies among Islamic extremists and terrorists.
Triple-Dealing in Tripoli
Libyan exiles and defectors deem Gadhafi to be out of touch with reality. Diplomats at the United Nations are shocked by his use of abusive language, with outright threats to kill rebels.
They're not the first to be outraged. Reagan, in a fit of righteous anger, called Gadhafi a "mad dog,” a term traditionally used for Englishmen.
Yet in 1993, Gadhafi was hailed by the West as a model of virtue and sanity in the Mideast for his pledge to forsake weapons of mass destruction. The Rabta chemical weapons facility was converted into a pharmaceutical plant.
Relations with Washington and London were normalized and soon Western oil companies including Chevron, Occidental, ConocoPhillips, Marathon and BP were exploring and drilling for oil and gas in Libya.
Following the 9-11 attacks, Libya became a key ally in America's war on terror, particularly in the hunt for Osama bin Laden, who escaped to the Saharan region at the start of the Afghan War, as I was told by sources from the Taliban while war reporting at that time.
The Pentagon has since established a special forces base in the southwestern region of Fezzan. Under a $165 million contract, General Dynamics provided high-tech communications for Libya's mobile elite forces.
Thus for the Libyan strongman to renounce his new ties with the U.S. and accuse Washington of instigating protests cannot be mad ravings but must have some basis in fact.
As shown in U.S. diplomatic cables, the U.S. intrigues against Gadhafi involve covert ties with religious extremists, including the Islamic Fighting Group, or al-Jamaa al-Islamiyya al-Muqatilah, which is on the State Department list of terrorist groups.
Most people around the world assume that the war on terrorism since the 9-11 attacks definitively ended any American and British support for Islamist insurgents. It didn't. Washington isn't just double-dealing; it's been triple-dealing in Tripoli.
Oil and Religion
In possibly his last televised speech, Gadhafi described himself as a child of the desert, a "Bedouin revolutionary" who dared to challenge the colonial powers and their regional puppets. He disparaged the protesters as "greasy rats" and "terrorists" who aim to divide the country into "emirates" under the flag, not of revolutionary Libya, but of the old colonialist-backed monarchy.
His words are something more than a dictator's rant.
They ring true in the light of the Libyan revolution of 1969, which established the principle of Jamahiriya or the State of the People.
Libya sits on a reserve of more than 30 billion barrels of light sweet crude, remarkably low in sulfur, acid and tar. Libyan petroleum, with its low refining costs, is premier grade as Petrus is to wine. Americans have always desired that oil, and in World War II, planted Wheelus Airfield on Libyan soil to claim those reserves for Esso (today's Exxon-Mobil).
The U.S. backed the 1951 enthronement of Libya's first and last monarch, King Idriss. His claim to royalty arose from his prior position as the Emir of Cyrenaica, awarded to him by the Italian colonialists and affirmed under the British occupation of eastern Libya, which lasted through World War II to 1951.
In 1969, the young Colonel Gadhafi launched a military coup to oust the puppet king. His first decision, as recalled in the recent speech, was to "expel five American military bases," including the Strategic Air Command's Wheelus Airfield, closed in 1970.
In the late-1960s, Gadhafi created the National Oil Corporation, which wrested control of exploration away from Esson (EXXon today) (.
The deposed king's base in Cyrenaica, or Barqa in Arabic, with its major cities of Benghazi and Derna, is at the center of the current "democracy" rebellion.
Also known as Sheikh Sidi Idriss, he was leader of the Senussi sect, which was affiliated with the ultra-orthodox Salafi movement in the Arabian Peninsula and, more recently, with the Muslim Brotherhood in next-door Egypt.
Fanaticism Posing as Reason
Given the orthodox climate in Cyrenaica, it is not surprising then that the senior cleric of the Muslim Brotherhood, Yusuf al-Qaradawi, has just issued a fatwa against Gadhafi, urging Libyan soldiers to fire on their commander in chief.
This is not the first time that the 84-year-old Egyptian scholar has been involved in such threats against secular political leaders. Following an assassination attempt against Egypt's first president Gamal Abdel Nasser, the cleric was prohibited from speaking in public.
After the murder of President Anwar Sadat by Brotherhood-linked assassins, Qaradawi gave his last Friday sermon in Cairo in praise of the killers and then went into exile in Qatar.
Just prior to the outbreak of the Libyan riots, Qaradawi finally revisited Egypt to a joyous reception by more than 1 million supporters at a victory celebration in Cairo's Tahrir Square.
This aged religious scholar is promoted by human-rights groups as a voice of democracy and pluralism. Yet in the next breath, this "democrat" advocates "defensive" suicide bombings and the mandatory death penalty for homosexuals.
Qaradawi owes this popularity among an audience of 40 million Muslims to his televangelism over the Qatar-based Al Jazeera network, which is also the main international news source out of North Africa.
Not by coincidence, when confronted by Libyan officials, Al Jazeera producers admitted to broadcasting faked tapes, for example, of jets flying (in daylight) over protesters (in nighttime darkness). That admission of falsified images could back the regime's claims of atrocities against civilians were exaggerated and sometimes fabricated.
Al Jazeera is financed and owned by the royal family of Qatar.
Just two weeks prior to the first Cairo protests, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton spend three days in Doha, Qatar, to establish a special "partnership" with Qatar. She spoke at the Forum for the Future alongside Qatari Prime Minister Sheikh Hamad bin Jassim Al Thani
Gadhafi in his televised address appealed to Qatar, saying that he could not understand how a "brother could turn against one of his brothers."
Fratricide is not uncommon, not since Cain and Abel.
Cyrenaica, the center of the "democracy" protests, remains a hotbed of Islamist extremism ripe for turning against the Gadhafi regime with a bit of guidance from the US, according to a confidential Embassy cable, dated June 2, 2008.
In the message titled "Die Hard in Derna,” Charge d'Affairs Chris Stevens described his visit with a Libyan subordinate to eastern Libya to meet with Islamist radicals who, like the Bruce Willis character, "stubbornly refused to die quietly."
Unofficially in the east for a visit t an American-sponsored archaeology dig, Stevens’s actual mission was to retrace the trail of foreign jihadists in Iraq. "A large number of Libyan foreign fighters (were) identified in documents captured during September's Objective Massey operation in Iraq."
A local activist confirmed those military intelligence findings. "(He told us) it was well-known that a large number of suicide bombers—invariably described as 'martyrs'—and foreign fighters in Iraq hailed from Derna, a fact in which the town 'takes great pride.’”
The informant showed the embassy intelligence official "a number of small, discrete mosques tucked away in side alleys, noting the profusion of 'popular mosques' complicated effective monitoring by security forces."
Following the 1993 thaw in U.S.-Libya relations after Gadhafi pledged to cease production of weapons of mass destruction, "many easterners feared the U.S. would not allow the regime to fall and therefore viewed direct confrontation with the government of Libya as a fool's errand.
At the same time, sending young Libyans to fight in Iraq was 'an embarrassment' to Gadhafi. Fighting against U.S. and coalition forces in Iraq represented a way for frustrated young radicals to strike a blow against both Gadhafi and against his perceived American backers."
As the cable indicated, the government was well aware that the Cyrenaica-based Islamist movement is led by "afghanis,” veteran jihadists who fought the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan.
Despite the cover story about visiting ancient ruins, Libyan security had picked up on the surreptitious contacts with terrorists in Derna and later Benghazi.
At least five "emboffs,” jargon for embassy officials, were later prevented by airline security and police from traveling to meet dissidents in Benghazi, Berber areas west of Tunis and to the southern Fezzan district populated by Tuaregs.
American spies must have gotten around the travel bans since by March 9, 2009, as indicated in another cable, U.S. Ambassador to Tripoli Gene Cretz was quite upbeat about the prospects of Gadhafi's imminent political demise.
The sharp rivalry between the al-Gadhafi children could play an important. . . . role, in whether the al-Gadhafi family is able to hold on to power after Muammar al-Gadhafi exits (one way or another) the political scene." In hindsight, the term "one way or another" has dire consequences.
Causes of Clandestine War
The insurgent's use of weapons in the Benghazi and Derna uprisings should put to rest the media myth of "peaceful protests."
In Cairo as well, foreign residents have told me that insurgent squads cut off electrical power and torched nearly every police station in the city center.
The physical beating and sexual assault on a female ABC reporter was not done by the police but by the "peaceful protesters" who controlled Tahrir Square.
Asian domestic workers fleeing Cairo reported that many foreign women were gang-raped in public view.
What is happening across the Magreb, or North Africa, is a U.S.-sponsored Islamic uprising, similar to the bloody Muslim coup against Indonesian independence leader Sukarno.
Barack Obama spent his formative years in the tutelage of his stepfather, an Indonesian military intelligence official involved in the massacre of 2 million supporters of the ousted president.
The covert alliance between the White House and religious extremists, including the powerful Muslim Brotherhood and the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group is not a local affair in Egypt, Libya or Tunisia.
The secret pact s are part of a regional strategy for North Africa on an issue important enough to allow Islamic radicals who supported the 9-11 attacks to gain state power.
The issue in one word is uranium.
Hosni Mubarak was pushing for a crash program for Egypt to develop a nuclear capability to restrain Israeli aggression in Gaza and Lebanon.
The obvious supplier of uranium is Libya.
Gadhafi has in the past obtained uranium ore in the Aozou Strip a , disputed territory between Chad and Libya.
In 1987, French paratroops disguised as Chadian soldiers drove the Libyan army out of the area.
That source of uranium could again become available due to a French-Libyan agreement to jointly build a civilian nuclear power plant, proposed during President Nicholas Sarkozy's visit to Tripoli in July 2007.
A European-approved nuclear facility would give Gadhafi the green light to resume his role as a uranium supplier while maintaining his claim of renouncing weapons of mass destruction.
Meanwhile, Libyan-Chadian uranium could be quietly routed to Egypt via BenAli's Tunisia.
Thus an Arab nuclear capability to deter Israeli adventurism could be realized through North African cooperation.
Washington, as the protector of Israel's nuclear monopoly over the Mideast and Africa, went for a takedown of all three regimes.
Beyond presidential resignations, however, this task could prove daunting.
In Algeria's counterinsurgency campaign in the 1990s against jihadists led by returnees from Afghanistan, up to 200,000 people were killed.
The other problem is that a Brotherhood -led government in Egypt cannot be trusted not to build atomic bombs, since Qaradawi's daughter is a nuclear physicist.
Instead of managing a transition to a regional deterrence system, Washington has opened the gates of a historic catastrophe.
Yoichi Shimatsu, a former associate editor of Pacific News Service and editor of the Japan Times Weekly, reported on the rise of the Islamist extremist movement in North Africa in the 1990s.
http://newamericamedia.org/2011/02/amer ... -libya.php (http://newamericamedia.org/2011/02/americas-next-war-looms-in-libya.php)
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Last Act in Cairo:
Did U.S. Help the Egyptian Military Stage a Coup?
http://newamericamedia.org/2011/02/last-act-in-cairo- (http://newamericamedia.org/2011/02/last-act-in-cairo-)
did-us-help-the-egyptian-military-stage-a-coup
.php
New America Media, News Analysis, Yoichi Shimatsu, Posted: Feb 18, 2011
While television cameras focused on Cairo these last few weeks, the U.S. military was busy redeploying four Navy carrier strike forces and sending Marine landing assault crafts into the Red Sea—thus reinforcing what was, in fact, a military coup in Egypt.
The redeployments were ostensibly for the rescue of American citizens if the protests in Cairo were to turn violent. But the actual objectives were quite different: first, to back up the White House's unsubtle hints for the removal of President Hosni Mubarak and his budding nuclear program, and second, to seize the Egyptian military's chemical and biological weapons in the event of a general uprising.
After the overthrow of Tunisian leader Ben Ali, the USS Enterprise moved away from Carthaginian waters, past the shores of Tripoli and toward the Suez Canal.
But as protests spread to Cairo, this behemoth of the 5th Fleet halted its progress to stay in the Mediterranean off Alexandria.
Meanwhile, the nuclear supercarriers Carl Vinson and George Washington broke away from the 7th Fleet's exercises with Japanese destroyers against North Korea and rushed to the Gulf of Aden. The USS Abraham Lincoln pulled back from the Iranian coast and moved into the Arabian Sea. Marine landing assault craft—each carrying dozens of helicopters—headed into the Red Sea.
This significant deployment of U.S. military might wasn't just a response to the recent demonstrations. It was rooted in the long relationship between the U.S. and Egyptian militaries —
a relationship whose true nature has been obscured by Western media representations of Mubarak as a despot and cooperative underling to the U.S. government's demands.
In reality, Mubarak was a nationalist who pursued investment in civilian infrastructure and economic development projects.
His son Gamal was behind a drive to liberalize the Egyptian economy
. And the rampant corruption in Egyptian military circles was rooted in U.S. aid stipulations that all military investment in Egypt be in American defense contractors, rather than homegrown industries.
Nuclear Fishing
President Hosni Mubarak was never comfortable with chemical or biological weapons, according to an Egyptian nuclear physicist who served as a technical adviser to him.
"Chemical weapons are a poor man's deterrent, " the physicist explained recently over lunch in Dubai. "Mubarak wanted nothing to do with these, since he strongly believed that Egypt should be second to none when it comes to technology."
Another, more practical problem is that nerve gas must be periodically replenished.
This gives rise to the temptation to either sell the stuff or to use it, as happened in Saddam Hussein's wars with Iran.
As "an Air Force manMubarak considered a nuclear capability and ballistic missile program as the only appropriate deterrence between equall.
Mubarak's nuclear quest was kindled at the end of the 1990s by the NATO drive to partition the Balkans.
"The president had a premonition that the Western powers would soon do the same to the Arab world," spurring destabilization to gain control of the region's oil resources, the scientist explained. Mubarak's instincts were soon proven correct by the U.S. effort to partition Iraq into weak Kurdish, Shiite and Sunni nations.
Mubarak approached leaders in Moscow and Beijing but was met with gloomy silence.
"The president smoldered inside from those rebuffs; he took things personally," the physicist said. Russia and China were preoccupied by NATO's eastward expansion into the oil-rich Caspian Sea region, and neither wanted to give Washington a pretext for a second invasion of Iraq.
Contrary to the Western media's Orientalist cliche of Mubarak as a despot, the physicist's portrait revealed a technocrat who aimed to reform and modernize a stagnant economy and overhaul a backward social outlook.
Mubarak’s early commitment to technological innovation, quite unorthodox in a bureaucratic military, won favor from President Anwar Sadat.
The mainstream army's Frontier Corps, in contrast, is firmly based on the now-conventional desert-warfare tactics pioneered by the German general Arwin Rommel in North Africa. The romance of battle tanks whirling in the sand was, in turn, rooted in the long tradition of cavalry.
Chemical Trails
The chemical weapons in Egypt are among the stockpiles the Pentagon secretly provided to Arab states to counter Iran, ,..
as told to me by a Marine who uncovered a trove of American-made nerve gas bombs during the invasion of Iraq in 2003.
On the first platoon to enter the gigantic warehouses at an Iraqi military base north of Baghdad, he discovered "20-foot-long rectangular bombs, each with three flaps." The contents, he recalled, were identified as "VX" produced by "ConocoPhillips." VX is an organophosphate nerve gas similar to sarin but longer lasting.
The bomb casings bore a delivery date soon after the first Gulf War of 1991-92, indicating their role in a covert deal between the administration of George H.W. Bush and a defeated Saddam Hussein. Hussein was to resume his role as guardian of American petroleum interests in the Arabian Peninsula against Iranian expansionism.
The missing VX payload was mentioned in a 2003 report by the UN chief weapons inspector Hans Blix. The Marine inspector said that an Army disposal team eventually arrived to load the chemicals weapons onto trucks for air shipment to "another Mideast country." The only trustworthy ally with sufficient technical expertise outside of the immediate Iraqi theater was Egypt.
Colin Powell and his critics were therefore both correct: There were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq; and then there were none.
The American origins of the weapons of mass destruction prevented disclosure to Congress, much less to the press. George W. Bush was put into serious jeopardy by his father's sins.
A Desert Fox
Mohamad Hussein Tantawai, the general who deposed Mubarak and is now the acting head of state, is quite the opposite in temperament from his former commander, according to an embassy cable from then Ambassador Francis Ricciardone.
Dated March 16, 2008, and titled "Tantawi resistant to change in Egypt," the U.S. envoy asserts: "He is frozen in the Camp David paradigm and uncomfortable with our shift to the post-9/11 GWOT [global war on terror]."
Following Anwar Sadat's near-victory in the Yom Kippur War of 1973, Washington brokered the peace treaty between Israel and Egypt.
The Egyptian tank corps shifted from deep-penetration mobile warfare into dug-in positions to defend the recaptured Sinai Peninsula. Sadat and later Mubarak pursued a policy of limited military expenditures, investing instead in civilian infrastructure and economic development projects.
Ricciardone, who has a background in foreign intelligence, then discussed a major shift away from peacekeeping.
"We nonetheless should urge Minister Tantawi towards a broader and more flexible partnership based on shared strategic objectives, including border security, counter-terrorism…. Egyptian effectiveness in preventing arms smuggling into Gaza is essential to stopping Palestinian rocket fire into Israel. When the Secretary (of State Condaleeza Rice) pushed hard on smuggling in October 2007, the Egyptians finally got serious…."
Brother Against Brother
The cable indicates that the United States was quietly supplying the Egyptian military with seismic monitors and acoustic receivers to detect cross-border tunnel-boring.
The U.S. insistence on proactive Egyptian intervention against fellow Arabs was obviously grating the nerves of the Frontier Corpsmen, whose sole priority was holding their own territory of Sinai. The prevalent attitudes, besides sympathy for the beleaguered residents, was: "What happens in Gaza stays in Gaza." Palestinian matters are ultimately up to the Palestinians.
"EGIS Chief Omar Suleiman has the lead on negotiations with Hamas but Tantawi will also likely urge that Rafah [border crossing] be opened to ease humanitarian pressures in Gaza," the cable continued.
Ricciardone expressed concern that Tantawi's emotionalism was putting civilian lives in Gaza ahead of suppressing Hamas.
In contrast, the intelligence service boss Suleiman— later to become Mubarak's vice president—is presented as a hard-nosed professional. As disclosed by Seymour Hersh, Suleiman's special operations team in 1998-99 provided home addresses in Gaza of the more radical Hamas executives to the CIA, which in turn targeted the buildings for Israeli air strikes.
The U.S. envoy's conception of "reforming" the Egyptian military, then, was to prod it away from peacekeeping and toward becoming spotters and assassins for Israel.
"We should broaden the discussion to maritime interdiction efforts and also addressing the weapons trail, which starts in Yemen and Sudan," the cable continues. A year later, Israeli drones bombed a truck caravan in northeast Sudan, apparently to interdict rockets being smuggled to Gaza. Among the hundred victims killed were some 60 migrant workers from Ethiopia and Somalia.
The embassy cable also suggests a covert American role in the ongoing clashes inside Yemen.
The Revolution Will Not Be Televised
"On economic reform, Tantawi believes that Egypt's economic reform plan fosters social instability by lessening GOE [Government of Egypt] controls over prices and production," the cable continues.
Herein lies the dilemma for Washington's Egypt policy: The so-called "revolution" was actually a reaction against market reforms.
The drive to liberalize the Egyptian economy was led by Gamal Mubarak, a Western-educated investment banker. His coterie of upstart capitalists pushed to privatize and upgrade state-owned and military-run factories. The young tycoons were motivated by the dramatic modernizing efforts of the Gulf States, Lebanon and even Saudi Arabia.
Gamal Mubarak urged an end to consumer subsidies to fight inflation and prompt Egyptians to adapt to a market-based price system, which then would stimulate farmers and industries to raise efficiency, output and quality.
The reformers, as is so often the case in the developing world, angered consumers who had grown soft on subsidies, workers accustomed to wages delinked from profit, military officers protective of their privileges, and mullahs intent on preserving the old ways. The whirlwind of globalization has been stopped cold by the sheer weight of tradition.
As for corruption on a large scale, it arose from a U.S. aid package that requires Cairo to purchase solely from American defense contractors, including GE, Lockheed Martin, L3 and Raytheon.
Kickbacks are nothing exceptional when it comes to defense contracts. In the private sector, “consulting fees” for telecoms and Internet-providers to obtain licenses are also an omnipresent feature of global operations, regardless of Google's posturing as the political spark for the youth movement.
What about the youth movement and its demands for change? A couple of young activists, along with a spokesman for the Kefiya party, which is favored by Washington, stated flatly to Al Jazeera that an independent youth movement never really existed.
The initial protesters on Tahrir Square mostly came from the youth wings of long-established political parties. Now that the protests are winding down, the politicians are back in the smoke-filled rooms, haggling over thumb-sized cups of coffee. The media myths out of Cairo were as humongous as the towering statues of Ramses.
The Last Act
As his enemies gathered like foxes around a wounded gazelle, Mubarak was thrown a lifeline from Riyadh on day 17. In counter-thrust to a congressional threat to cut off U.S. aid to Egypt, Saudi King Abdullah offered Cairo a dollar-per-dollar subsidy. Behind the scenes, Gamal Mubarak had pulled out all stops for a bailout from Arab oil producers, which were finally awakening from the dizzy dream cast by Al Jazeera.
Instead of announcing his resignation as planned for a late-night speech, Mubarak showed defiance against the treachery of his Western allies. By then, it was too late.
A Saudi-Egyptian partnership independent of the West is, of course, intolerable for a Washington fearful of genuine Arab power. With four U.S. carrier strike groups closing in, the Egyptian military had to pull the carpet out from under their war hero and patriarch, Hosni Mubarak.
What remains is not a libertarian democracy, just the pyramids — the institutional hierarchies of Egyptian society — and perhaps with the coming elections, an Islamic order.
Yoichi Shimatsu, former associate editor with Pacific New Service and with the Japan Times group, has reported extensively on North Africa and the Persian Gulf region.
http://newamericamedia.org/2011/02/last ... a-coup.php (http://newamericamedia.org/2011/02/last-act-in-cairo-did-us-help-the-egyptian-military-stage-a-coup.php)
peace
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Above 100 us per oil barrel :shock:
That's how they lie to us.
Libya is only representing about 5% of petrol resources.
That's a fly in a cup.
Yet they pick it just as another excuse to steal our money.
Libya is about WATER not Petrol.
Libya has built a several thousand miles network of water supply - The Great Man-Made River Project is meant to "greenify" the desert and open the fertile soil to two crops per year.
130,000 hectares of land were to be irrigated for new farms.
As a result, Libya is now a world leader in hydrological engineering, and it wants to export its expertise to other African and Middle-Eastern countries facing the same problems with their water.
(http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41462000/gif/_41462932_libya_water3_map416.gif)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4814988.stm
Forget about the fairy tales about the Arab world. They are much smarter than the western world would like them to be.
While officials keep the known stories about Arabs up like they were decades ago, they themselves, hidden behind that fairy tale fog, steal petrol from Angola, Brezil and the Mexican Gulf and nobody notices this.
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Above 100 us per oil barrel :shock:
That's how they lie to us.
Libya is only representing about 5% of petrol resources.
That's a fly in a cup.
Yet they pick it just as another excuse to steal our money.
Libya is about WATER not Petrol.
Absolutely!
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@Supervision>
Very long posts!
What are you trying to prove here?!
Sorry, i didn't get your point! :?:
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by diggyon » Fri Feb 25, 2011 1:20 pm
@Supervision>
Very long posts!
What are you trying to prove here?!
Sorry, i didn't your point!
Well, diggyon, those posts were articles were long to be sure, but they really help decipeher the "news" and do point to the real”facts” about wht is really going on in LIBYA and North AFRICA.
I do not know if you or any here read them, but I dumped them here for all to read and come to their own conclusion about all the media lies, and so called "unacceptable Human Rights Abuse...that we are now told/ hearing about perpertrated by LiBYa's "mad man Gadhafi", , when more than prolly, those peaceful “protesters’ were armed and ready from the beginning, and were there to overthrow the sovereign nation of Libya per the agenda long prepared to be executed.
That sort of thing then is a planned aggression and not a “revolution” by peaceful protesters, to which imo. Mr. G has every right to stand up to and is, btw. trying his best to do so valiantly..
.
The post may be long, because it is an article I really wished people would read to help me explain what I was saying about MR. G. being a hard headed "revolutionary" for his people...etc etc..
so if you take your time to read it , it explains everything. Otherwise,if it is tooo long for you to read, pls. just skip it.
As for your question what I am trying to prove, well, I am not trying to prove anything to you or any here.
All have eyes to see, and ears to hear and make up their own political views in the end.
And no, I do not agree in the least,that, the UN should fly the old” colonial” flag of Libya , when Libya is still a sovereign nation as we speak,..
and it’s leader of forty years, has vowed to fight ‘till the last drop of his own blood" to preserve his nation's UNITY, and try to fight those,who have come to his door, armed and ready to take it over with force.
Peace to you.
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Some are wondering to where those protests that have arisen both Egypt and Libya are born in genuine social unrest or are mere manipulation of infiltrated agitators those by overthrowing governments engaged in instigating the masses to create a reaction chain culminating in uncontrolled mass movements to achieve its objectives? They are manifestations caused by citizens or are the result of the agitation of infiltrators in order to change Governments in favour of foreign powers and their interests? Is there a global agenda of anarchy, turmoil and global violence to justify the advent of a new world order which will use extreme methods of control over the people?
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The recent developments do not astonish me at all.
Many issues in the world go unnoticed by the western world being suppressed by national news.
Just looking at statistical and demographics evidence should be enough to open eyes why the people of North Africa are raising their voices now.
It comes down to a high rate of young folks, having a bad or no education and having no or a miserably paid job, living at 30 at their parents home and being deprived of any hope for a better future. A large number among them cannot even marry because they could not afford an apartment on their own. What do you expect a young man in such a situation to do?
Why do they enter boats to cross the Mediterranean Sea and risk their lives?
The following is being published by the Population Reference Bureau in Washington:
Underweight Children Age <5 (%)
Algeria 10
Egypt 5
Libya -
Morocco 10
Tunisia 4
Canada -
USA 1
EU -
Undernourished Population, 2002-2004 (%)
Algeria 4
Egypt 4
Libya <2.5
Morocco 6
Tunisia <2.5
Canada <2.5
USA <2.5
EU -
Youth Ages 10-24 (% of total pop.) 2006
Algeria 33
Egypt 31
Libya 31
Morocco 30
Tunisia 30
Canada 20
USA 21
EU -
Motor Vehicles per 1,000 Population, 2000-2005
Algeria 91
Egypt 39
Libya 137
Morocco 60
Tunisia 86
Canada 584
USA 787
EU -
Child Mortality Rate (deaths per 1,000 children under age 5), 2005
Algeria 48
Egypt 48
Libya 23
Morocco 52
Tunisia 26
Canada -
USA -
EU -
Population Living Below US$2 per Day (%)
Algeria 24
Egypt 18
Libya -
Morocco 14
Tunisia 13
Canada -
USA -
EU -
For comparison:
Yemen 47
Haiti 72
Mali 77
Niger 86
http://www.prb.org/Datafinder/Geography/MultiCompare.aspx?variables=92%2c23%2c22%2c24%2c25%2c6%2c7%2c82%2c19%2c135%2c134%2c110%2c109%2c17%2c1®ions=9%2c120%2c71%2c10%2c173%2c92%2c11%2c26%2c12%2c28%2c129%2c130%2c67%2c14%2c72%2c135%2c
As to education:
Literacy Rate, Ages 15-24, 2000-04, Female (%)
Algeria 86
Canada -
Egypt 67
European Union -
Libya 94
Morocco 61
Tunisia 91
United States -
Literacy Rate, Ages 15-24, 2000-04, Male (%)
Algeria 94
Canada -
Egypt 79
European Union -
Libya 100
Morocco 77
Tunisia 98
United States -
This goes for all Africa but it is very significant for the north as well:
Youth Unemployment and Underemployment in Africa Brings Uncertainty and Opportunity
by Eric Zuehlke
(February 2009) From the recent riots in Greece to increased unemployment in urban China to anxiety over the prospect of more protests by young people throughout Europe, youth unemployment and underemployment is increasingly recognized as a potential trigger for social instability in other world regions. Africa in particular faces demographic challenges as its population of young people ages 15 to 24 increases and access to secure jobs continues to be problematic. In addition, the global financial crisis threatens to further strain labor markets and exacerbate a tenuous situation for Africa's youth.
Beyond economic costs, high rates of youth unemployment and underemployment have social ramifications. Some youth with few job prospects and little hope of future advancement may see little alternative to criminal activities or joining armed conflicts. "Unemployed and underemployed [youth] are more exposed to conflicts and illegal activities—many of them fall prey to armed and rebel groups," says Jorge Saba Arbache of the Office of the Chief Economist, Africa Region at the World Bank. In addition he says, "Youth unemployed and underemployed are more exposed to economic cycles," making them vulnerable to job instability.
The World Bank's Youth and Unemployment in Africa: The Potential, The Problem, The Promise report, released in December 2008, investigates the nature of Africa's youth demographics and recommends policies to give its youth access to stable employment. It argues that creating viable jobs for young people is a recondition for Africa's poverty eradication, sustainable development, and peace; and in countries emerging from conflict, access to employment for youth is integral to peace-building processes.
Africa's Unemployed Youth and Demographic Challenge
Africa has the fastest-growing and most youthful population in the world. Over 20 percent of Africa's population is between the ages of 15 to 24 and, since over 40 percent of Africa's population is under 15 years of age, that number is expected to grow significantly in the coming years. According to the International Labour Office, youth make up as much as 36 percent of the total working-age population and three in five of Africa's unemployed are youth.
"The [high] total fertility rate is Africa's biggest demographic challenge," says Carl Haub, senior demographer at PRB. "For 30 years, 45 percent of most African countries' population has been below age 15. So, a constantly rising number entering the labor force ages is one of Africa's biggest challenges." The combination of population growth associated with high fertility rates and the slow pace of job creation in Africa presents challenges to its youth. Despite annual economic growth rates of 6 percent or more in sub-Saharan Africa in recent years, there has not been a sufficient increase in stable employment opportunities for young people. With current demographic trends, the pressure to create new jobs will only increase over the coming decades.
Migration patterns put further strain on urban areas and labor opportunities. Young people are more likely than other age groups to migrate from rural to urban areas. According to Arbache, "Empirical analyses show that rural youth migrate to urban areas to find better educational and work opportunities and a way out of poverty. Unemployment and underemployment in urban areas are associated with rural-urban migration. Young migrants often earn less than their counterparts in urban areas, but more than those in rural areas." Despite increased rural-urban migration however, over 70 percent of the African youth population still lives in rural areas. In fact, a major finding in the World Bank report is that the average young person in Africa is not an urban resident who migrated from a village. The average young person is a poor, literate, but out-of-school female living in a rural area.
Unemployed and Underemployed
Focusing solely on unemployed youth overlooks the fact that many young people may be working but are underemployed, working shorter hours than they would like, or reaping little economic gain. In addition, in areas with few formal employment opportunities, many are left to fend for themselves in the informal economy, often beyond the scope of official employment statistics. The problem is that underemployment is difficult to measure.
"What economists call 'underemployment' is so difficult to define and measure because the standard of comparison, 'fully employed', is itself difficult to define and measure," says Bill Butz, president and CEO, of PRB. "So is a person 'underemployed' if he or she is working fewer than 52 weeks in the year, or fewer than 40 hours in a week, or just fewer weeks or hours than he would like to work, or else less intensively than he might be able if well nourished and healthy? All four standards of comparison are used…and all are arbitrary. Each yields a different level of measured underemployment."
http://www.prb.org/Articles/2009/youthunemployment.aspx
(http://www.prb.org/images09/YouthEmplAfrica.gif)
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@supervision,
IDK how come i did not see your post :? I am going to read it and reply later when I am free.
I´ll be back 8-)
Gemanator
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I do not know if you or any here read them, but I dumped them here for all to read and come to their own conclusion about all the media lies, and so called "unacceptable Human Rights Abuse...that we are now told/ hearing about perpertrated by LiBYa's "mad man Gadhafi", , when more than prolly, those peaceful “protesters’ were armed and ready from the beginning, and were there to overthrow the sovereign nation of Libya per the agenda long prepared to be executed.
You have a point here regarding "human rights"
Some hypocrisy is there. Weapons are being sold from UE and USA. All boils to $ and power. No morals there.
Back to Lybia and Gadafi, he was in the past quite of a charismatic man, coming from a very humble family who put that child to study and became who he became leading a country, being just 27 when his coup d´etat took place but with intelligence also come other profiles, may be narcissism and hints of psychopathy. His reaction to stop his citizents from manifestating has been way too over the top.
Surely all countries kill each other or themselves, and, observing the events in these later cases, there is no door open to negotiation, it is take it or leave.
"Power" needs to be renewed because times change and interests as well ;) But if "your leader" is absolut and is not willing to listen to his people, what leadership is that?
That sort of thing then is a planned aggression and not a “revolution” by peaceful protesters, to which imo. Mr. G has every right to stand up to and is, btw. trying his best to do so valiantly..
His response has been out of proportion and reading the subtitles of his speech, in one part he said "I will prosecute you as the rats you are". Priceless :lol:
His ideas about how people have been drugged with coffein drinks got me in to tears.
He is the leader of a country, some protocol is expected (and the same applies to Chávez btw).
He proclaimed himself as the Kings of Kings...
Would he be abl to keep up with the responsability of leading a country for the best?
May be he did a good job in the past, but fresh blood is needed.
And no, I do not agree in the least,that, the UN should fly the old” colonial” flag of Libya , when Libya is still a sovereign nation as we speak
and it’s leader of forty years, has vowed to fight ‘till the last drop of his own blood" to preserve his nation's UNITY, and try to fight those,who have come to his door, armed and ready to take it over with force. [/b]
I agree with you on this looking from that perspective.
It is a bit confusing what´s going on now. Gadafi ,imo, is a funny guy speaking his mind out, but his decisions are more of a PR than a serious leader.
He has been shaking hands with Obama and we know that many of the Middle East countries are consedered to be "puppets" of USA, something Gadafi also was critic about yet he may be was not awared that he is inside the circle as well ;)
The videos I posted "show" his mind speaking, making sense if you look one at the time, but if you look at the whole set, what do we get?
I am just waiting to see which country is going to be the next :|
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@Supervision,
what if all these articles are just another try to manipulate the people!? I never heard that Libya has anything to do with uranium!Otherwise the USA would have interferd immediately?!
Aren't the people in any country allowed to overthrow their president? Why is it always the NWO or the Agendas that are involved here!! What if all that happened without the involvement of the NWO!?! What if they never expected that!?!? And now they are saying: oh yes, actually we planned the whole thing in the Middle East.... just watch us now.
I thought the Egyptian president was supported by the Elite, as the article mentioned. He was following the American orders and he was a good ally! So why would these people suddenly want to get rid of him? They cannot guaranty who will take over! His son was in the circle as well. But now no one is. May be the Muslim Brothers can take over! Would the USA risk something like this and try to overthrow Mubarak to let the Muslim Brothers rule the country that is a neighbor of Israel? I doubt!!!!!!
By the way....I learned something here in that forum: Never believe the Media.
They just lie and they are manipulating the people to scare them and to let them believe fake new for some reasons. So that's why I never believe what's written in the newspapers or in the magazines. That's what Michael taught us!
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by diggyon » Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:55 am
@Supervision,
what if all these articles are just another try to manipulate the people!? I never heard that Libya has anything to do with uranium!Otherwise the USA would have interfered immediately?!
pls. take a look, an excerpt from Time mag.
Saif al-Islam, called in U.S. diplomats to complain about the U.S. relationship and explain the Libyan decision to stop the shipment of Highly Enriched Uranium (HEU) out of the country, which Gaddafi had agreed to with the Bush Administration.
Saif al-Islam explicitly linked Libya's decision to halt the HEU shipment to its dissatisfaction with the U.S. relationship.
Saif said the shipment was halted because the regime was “fed up” with the pace of the relationship and what it perceived as a backing-out of commitments to bilateral cooperation.
Read more: http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2011/02 ... z1F6GRxfBW (http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2011/02/24/understanding-muammar-gaddafis-view-of-obama-through-wikileaks/#ixzz1F6GRxfBW)
So, now, if we really observed, The U.S. A. never ever rested from not only interfering but giving LIBYA its marching orders to shut down any and all attempt to build any sort of WMD, as they did to Sadam ,in Iraq, who, btw, really did not have any weapons like that at all, all just a fabricated pretext , but nevertheless the God less Bush, went in to do what he wanted to do, with the support of the world “coalition”.and the rest is still making history....
.Really. it is all too much like a joke for it to be accepted as real, but we know it really happened and is still happening, no end in sight...
As in regards Lybya,..don’t you recall how far MR. Reagan went to bomb that country, and really actually sent the bomb there to kill The Mad Dog himself?
But his child was killed instead in that bombing. I know that must have hurt MR. G. even though he himself was/is a hot headed fellow and tried to give as much as he got, against these giant of Superpowers no less.lol.
. I mean you got to give this guy a grudging respect ,lol,
, the nerves the man had , and seems still to have lol. “I will die in Libya as a martyr” I will fight to the last drop of my blood. :( .etc ..
..Say what you will, but the man is basically a nationalist, the last of his breed, in this changing world of materialism, but this guy does really love his country,even though he is a bonafide dictator,
and that , imo, more than we could say for most leaders today,even the so called "democratic' leadership, who are, imo.,mostly there just to line their own pockets ...
Greed you know is the thing that they most perfect while they profess to care for the people, at least most of them are like that it seems.imo. ;)
So, getting back to the subject of the URANIUM, that has always been the sore point with U.S.A. ...since Uranium is to be found btw . Chad and Libya border.
As you know France also is a Nuclear power, and wishes to get there hand on that as well, which is why, now France is , one of the biggest proponents in asking for a fasssst, resolution, to send yours truly to the Hague,for ‘Crimes against HUMAnITY” :roll: :roll:
..gee, how sickening and hypocritical that sounds in the ears and hearts of some honest observers and witnesses. lol.
And also on the push is this sort of fakers, pressing in SC/and even Nato, to go rushing, into LIBYA to do what ever they wish to do, including dividing the country there, so that it will be weaker to manipulate and exploit in all sorts of ways..
.
Aren't the people in any country allowed to overthrow their president?
You are absolutely correct.
In a real democracy , that should be the case, but as you and I know, it is not the people at all who rule , even in advanced democracies such as the U.S.A.etc.,
but the same elite who have hijacked all the infrastructures , that bring out the smoke screen mirrors, every four yrs, to let folks come out and VoTE.
i,e....come in and “voice” their choices.
But, really, and honestly speaking, is there much difference between the so called parties that are presented there for the people’s choice?
viz. the crucial points for a real change that may be needed in the real world to benefit the people more than the corps.etc.
Even the TEA Party(U.S.A.), challengers, went only so far. .
The status quo is always maintained , no matter which party the people vote into administration.
Ha ha...may be all the REAL REVOLUTION have already taken place , and there is no more to be expected. Not here not anywhere.
The invincible power/FORCE, is entrenched and hard to budge. What do you think?
Now a days with this so called "Revolution",even then there really is no guarantee wht true change people could expect to see, after “rivers of blood" has been shed “ , and, you and I must ask ourselves, for what shall we go through all this?
perhaps, just for the same thing to start all over again? :roll:
Well, it is a true thing to say, I think , it is man himself that has to make the change within himself, if he truly wishes to see some positive change in his WORLD..
. Well, as our MIKE stressed in . MAN in the MIRROR....
. That may be the ultimate solution. Imo.
Why is it always the NWO or the Agendas that are involved here!!
Because unfortunately it is , even if one chooses not to believe it.
All modern governments ('super power"), have their agenda already well mapped out, for years and years ahead basically, as to where they wish to go, or rather where they wish to take the world at large.
And this so called “revolution” in the Arab world , is imo. a part of the whole program.
The GREAT WORKS of the AGES.
An ongoing AGENDA planned long ago.. :?
What if all that happened without the involvement of the NWO!?!
No. Never.IMO.
I tell you. Spies Spies and more spies lol.
. Day and night and non stop and everywhere.Up and down, and sideways too. :lol:
See what I am saying?,
Electric eyes ...as Mike said.
What if they never expected that!?!?
No. all was known believe me to the initiators, no one can convince me otherwise,
. The folks that did not know, were old dictators like Gadhafi, who just very recently was lauded as a poster boy of Arab moderate,“leaders” an ally in the fight of “terrorism”...
but, Mr. G, I guess, maybe believed in his own PR a little too much, lol, :lol: and maybe he forgot his politics too, and did not realize, he also is not indispensable, and here we are..... :o .
And now they are saying: oh yes, actually we planned the whole thing in the Middle East.... just watch us now.
No , they are not saying it out loud.
But, any seasoned political analyst and an honest one, knows what is really going on in reality about this new wave of declaration of thirst for “democracy” in the Arab world in particular, the middle east and North Africa.
It is a step of creating a sham change, where the same old “allies” will come back in , after changing their suit and putting on a new mask, more or less, (or so it is hoped?).
I thought the Egyptian president was supported by the Elite, as the article mentioned. He was following the American orders and he was a good ally! So why would these people suddenly want to get rid of him?
Well, if you noticed, the man (Mubarak) wanted to build the forbidden fruit...=nuclear bomb, as the article suggests :shock:
A three way plot the article suggests..
Gaddhafi has the Uraniam, Tunis would be the route used to get the thing over to EGYPT...so the reasoning goes, ...so all three of these very important STATES ...were “attacked” and gone are the old “dreamers” ;)
.well at least for a while, cause, it will now hoped, that this “revolution “ of the people, would send a political “new” fresh message of Democracy seekers, choices that the people themselves are making,without the push of the "DEMOCRACIES",and the ARAB people are saying, enough, we do not wish to be governed by autocrats/theocracies and Islamist.
.
That is,if it works,like killing two or three birds with one stone. Do you see?
They cannot guaranty who will take over!
Hmm, we will have to wait and see, but really it is not a mystery. The military is in charge in Egypt now as you know, and the old boys there, work hand in glove with the people who put them there. And no that is not the kids from the social medium twitters and FB who are not defense contractors who will gain on big item sales of WEAPONRY..etc.
His son was in the circle as well. But now no one is.
This is not quite true imo.. Prolly, Just gone under cover is all.
May be the Muslim Brothers can take over!
Would the USA risk something like this and try to overthrow Mubarak to let the Muslim Brothers rule the country that is a neighbor of Israel? I doubt!!!!!!
You got a point there, but as I have said it is a revolving door Revolution”.
..Did you hear that the same folks are now there in the Military “transitional” government in Egypt, and they actually slapped the “peaceful protesters” hand with “violence” just the other day, for demanding that the old corrupt goats would go elsewhere and never come back. :lol: .
By the way....I learned something here in that forum: Never believe the Media.
Exactly my point. They are all owned by the same people.
Very few people own the whole media of this world.
Ultra Elite folks near the top of the Masonic pyramid.
They just lie and they are manipulating the people to scare them and to let them believe fake news for some reasons.
Well, they are not doing this for their health imo..
But, rather they know they have to throw the sheeple some kind of “entertainment” or a fake “reality show” ..you understand what I mean?
. Otherwise, Jane and Joe publick, would not agree to send their sons and daughters to shed their blood in defense of “democracy”...here and everywhere.
So that's why I never believe what's written in the newspapers or in the magazines. That's what Michael taught us!
I say Amen to that,that is what is called the AWAKENING.
Mike knew what time it was .
He was one smart fellow our Mike,ya know.. :) .
Peace.
@Gema will try to address you next,if I can, but really I wrote much, and the above could serve as answer to your post as well
. I can see, from your post, that you absolutely grasped the situation correctly.
And yes I agree "new blood " is needed in LYBYA, but not through a forced "RAPE/bloodshed/division" of the country,..
.at least I hope it would not happen that way.
Peace
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@Supervision
i like the way you interpret the whole scenario in the Middle East. But what makes you so sure that it is all planned long before? Is it written somewhere in the newspaper or is it only your personal opinion? Since I mentioned personal opinion, how do you think this whole uprise in the Middle East will end?
Somehow I feel that you are not optimistic at all! So what do you think will happen to Europe next?! Because of that uprise the European economy has been directly affected. I bet some Elite are facing some economic problems as well. So was that whole scenario necessary in the first place :?:
I guess no dictator would like to step down and leave, other wise he will be killed by his opposers. I think I read somewhere that Mubarak owns more than 70 billion $. So would he give this money to the Egyptians? Ghaddafi's fortune is even bigger as he ruled longer than Mubarak. lol. If someone has 130 billion $ abroad and is about to be overthrown by his own people and is a dictator, then I wouldn't expect to hear something else from him, because he knows what might happen to him if he stepped down on his own: he will be imprisoned, and maybe killed as well. So why die alone? Let the people suffer a little, exactly the way he is suffering. He doesn't want to die in vain. These are not the words of a hero but rather the words of a criminal who is about to be caught by the police. He kills the hostages and fights till the end.This is not new!
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Just looking at statistical and demographics evidence should be enough to open eyes why the people of North Africa are raising their voices now.
It comes down to a high rate of young folks, having a bad or no education and having no or a miserably paid job, living at 30 at their parents home and being deprived of any hope for a better future. A large number among them cannot even marry because they could not afford an apartment on their own. What do you expect a young man in such a situation to do?
The situation just 14km from the marrocoan coast is the same pathetic. In Spain low salaries and a huge load of over educated people with no jobs. Some people hold 2 university degrees, masters of all kinds, courses, speak languages. Emigration happens.
Why do they enter boats to cross the Mediterranean Sea and risk their lives?
Some countries, as Spain, have plans supporting inmigrants.
Feels like the poor helping the poorer to survive, but seems to be the best option.
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Reading all well written opinions and gathered news on this topic, the bottom line is that the human rights in Libya are severely repressed, we no longer do not tolerate this, it’s time for justice and it’s about time to ACT.
UN: Security Council Refers Libya to ICC
Resolution Aimed at Stemming Violence and Bringing Justice
February 27, 2011
United Nations Security Council diplomats vote on a resolution during a meeting on Libya at UN headquarters in New York on February 26, 2011.
(New York) ¬¬– The United Nations Security Council’s unanimous resolution referring Libya to the International Criminal Court (ICC) sends a strong signal to Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi and his commanders, as well as other governments in the region, that the international community will not tolerate the vicious repression of peaceful protesters, Human Rights Watch said today.
The resolution adopted on February 26, 2011, referred the crisis in Libya to the ICC, imposed travel bans on key Libyan leaders, and froze their assets.
“The Security Council has risen to the occasion and given notice to Gaddafi and his commanders that if they give, tolerate, or follow orders to fire on peaceful protesters, they may find themselves on trial in The Hague,” said Richard Dicker, director of the International Justice Program at Human Rights Watch.
Human Rights Watch said the Security Council’s referral to the ICC appears aimed both at bringing justice to the Libyan people and avoiding more victims.
“The United Nations is showing concerted international resolve to pressure Gaddafi and his henchmen to end their murderous attacks on the Libyan population,” said Dicker.
The UN General Assembly is expected to consider a resolution this coming week to suspend Libya from the Human Rights Council, following last week’s condemnation of Libya at a special Human Rights Council session.
“The Security Council action shows that justice awaits Libyan security commanders who unlawfully attack people to stay in power,” said Dicker. “It is the clearest possible directive to Gaddafi and his cohorts to end the killing.”
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2011/02/27/u ... -libya-icc (http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2011/02/27/un-security-council-refers-libya-icc)
[youtube:3qhkpwyk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0EAxJdRd_8[/youtube:3qhkpwyk]
“It appears to be a criminal desperate effort by a criminal desperate regime to prevent people from exercising their rights to protest”
This is exactly what is going on in Libya. Because of the fact that this criminal regime is desperate gives them NO RIGHT to deprive the people’s freedom and right to protest! This is a serious crime.
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Now Tunisia is also moving.
If the oil is not sold "we" (EU, USA) are going to have a hard time. Those countries moving towards something better gathers a lot underneeth :|
Let´s hope that their manifestos are productive, because the next one taking power can be just as bad. Democracy is what they want but they don´t have a reference nor experience about what real democracy is. Hope the outcome is not as a 2nd Yugoslavia :|
Anyway, not all is so bad, some fun came out of it ;) or t least, music...would this be the next hit?
[youtube:10u0rylg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERqPuKocHlU&feature=related[/youtube:10u0rylg]
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What's going on there is I think very subtile in the sense that it is not a bad thing when a dictator leaves but problem is that the dark side wants to take advantage/control over the situation and direct the flow of the revolutions for the benefit of their agenda. What's happening in these countries was coming anyway because of the bad treatment these populations have had to endure throughout the years with the help of the western world who are only demonstrating their tremendous hypocrisy and are only making a mockery of what democracy really should be.... there is a limit maybe that cannot be crossed. Gaddafi was okay before but now the truth is too apparent so they prefer to disengage totally and point their fingers. So the same with Mubarak they really had a hard time to stop backing him up and remember what happened with Saddam. I wonder why is Al Quaeda so silent? They don't care about the people is the real truth and i don't doubt that everything that is happening in the world right now has to do with the cleansing of the earth before the new coming age. Evil always destroys itself because of that hidden force that always comes into play when humanity is on the brink of collapse. Certain things are not allowed to happen if you will. The NWO is not all powerful.
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What's going on there is I think very subtile in the sense that it is not a bad thing when a dictator leaves but problem is that the dark side wants to take advantage/control over the situation and direct the flow of the revolutions for the benefit of their agenda. What's happening in these countries was coming anyway because of the bad treatment these populations have had to endure throughout the years with the help of the western world who are only demonstrating their tremendous hypocrisy and are only making a mockery of what democracy really should be.... there is a limit maybe that cannot be crossed. Gaddafi was okay before but now the truth is too apparent so they prefer to disengage totally and point their fingers. So the same with Mubarak they really had a hard time to stop backing him up and remember what happened with Saddam.
I could have written that myself. I totally agree with your view Sarahli.
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Now Tunisia is also moving.
If the oil is not sold "we" (EU, USA) are going to have a hard time. Those countries moving towards something better gathers a lot underneeth :|
Let´s hope that their manifestos are productive, because the next one taking power can be just as bad. Democracy is what they want but they don´t have a reference nor experience about what real democracy is. Hope the outcome is not as a 2nd Yugoslavia :|
Anyway, not all is so bad, some fun came out of it ;) or t least, music...would this be the next hit?
[youtube:37bjqr2n]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERqPuKocHlU&feature=related[/youtube:37bjqr2n]
Wow, he sings better than he rules :lol: :lol:
I agree, I hope it will not end up in a civil war, Gadaffi's son is warning about.
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I am dancing to the tune :D I found more remixes! :lol: Zanga zanga rocks!
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well, here is an assorted answer to some of the post I read here by various posters, reposting excerpts to help me express/answer/suggest, what I am saying about the issue of LYBYA
...it's a long post once again, :roll:
so, pls. all are welcome to read all or skip, if not interested :)
by everlastinglove_MJ » Sun Feb 27, 2011 8:28 am
This is exactly what is going on in Libya. Because of the fact that this criminal regime is desperate gives them NO RIGHT to deprive the people’s freedom and right to protest! This is a serious crime.
The Power Brokers speak:
“The UN Human Rights Council has vigorously asserted its role in defending human rights by at long last deploring the rogue regime of Muammar Gadhafi for its brazen violence,” said AJC Executive Director David Harris.
“The Libyan regime’s flagrant human rights abuses deserve the fullest investigation and punishment by the world body.”
WE Turn the page back ...
Libya was elected for a three-year term on the Council just under a year ago, with a majority of 155 of 192 members of the voting in favor of the African country's admission.
page forward:
UN: Security Council Refers Libya to ICC
U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said on Sunday the United States was reaching out to Libyan opposition groups seeking to oust longtime leader Muammar Gadhafi.
Word/comment from the Gaddafis...in their own defense.
The Colonel speaks[/size]
[attachment=0:1a31gpwx]73133685-muammar-algaddafi.jpg[/attachment:1a31gpwx]
In a telephone interview with Serbia's Pink television station, he said Saturday's United Nations Security Council vote imposing travel and asset sanctions on him and close aides was null and void.
"The UN is not allowed to meddle in the internal affairs of other countries, unless a country is attacking another state," Gadhafi told the Belgrade-based station.
Media witchhunt implicated:
It said he had been speaking from his office in the Libyan capital Tripoli.
Gadhafi accused the world body of "making decisions on the basis of news reports" and said a UN commission should investigate the situation in Libya.
The Son..and heir apparent? :? Seif Gaddhafi:?
A defiant Saif Gaddafi says most Libyans aren't up in arms against his father and he blames the media for broadcasting false reports
Interviewed by Christiane Amanpour on America's ABC network - he was asked for his reaction to #FF0000]calls from the Obama administration for his father to go[/color]
.
SAIF GADDAFI:
First of all, it is not American business.
That is number one.
Second, do you think this is a solution? Of course not.
He says:
there's a big gap between reality and media coverage; and rejects reports of air-force pilots firing on protesters.
http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2011/s3150311.htm (http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2011/s3150311.htm)
by everlastinglove_MJ
Reading all well written opinions and gathered news on this topic, the bottom line is that the human rights in Libya are severely repressed, we no longer do not tolerate this, it’s time for justice and it’s about time to ACT.[/size
“It appears to be a criminal desperate effort by a criminal desperate regime to prevent people from exercising their rights to protest”
. Because of the fact that this criminal regime is desperate gives them NO RIGHT to deprive the people’s freedom and right to protest! This is a serious crime.
UN: Security Council Refers Libya to ICC
What really is going on in LYBYA..
A historical background to the Libya "Revolution"[/b]
Question we must ask to get a clearer picture:
Who is behind the demonstrations in Libya? Who forms the opposition to Gadhafi?
Exerpt from a Libyan Jew..Historian:
I attach great importance to the hatred and antagonism that exists between the two parts of that country - between the region of Cyrenaica which covers a little more than one half of the area of Libya and has Benghazi as its capital, and the region of Tripolitania with its capital, Tripoli.
The focus of the unrest is in Cyrenaica where they still remember that Gadhafi overthrew King Idris I who was born in the region.
In addition, Libya has a problem that is similar to the one we saw in Egypt, and that is unemployment.
There is tremendous unemployment in Libya despite the oil reserves and despite the huge water projects that the regime has introduced.
But the thousands of people with an academic education who graduate every year from the universities have no work, and the unskilled jobs in agriculture and construction are taken by refugees from other African countries, and this creates bitterness.
Another opposition element is the Islamists who exploit the mosques.
There is a great deal of disinformation on both sides.
There are also reports that policemen have defected to the side of the protesters but that is typical mainly of the Cyrenaica region.
For the time being, it seems that the army and the revolutionary guards are standing behind Gadhafi.
On Friday he headed a procession to show that he is in control of the situation and to give backing to his supporters.
But Libya also does not resemble Egypt from the point of view of its government. It has a very special regime that is locked up in its own ideology.
http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/fe ... d-1.344718 (http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/features/libyan-historian-ya-akov-hajaj-lilof-how-will-the-anti-gadhafi-protests-end-1.344718)
by Gema » Sun Feb 27, 2011 2:12 pm
Now Tunisia is also moving.
If the oil is not sold "we" (EU, USA) are going to have a hard time. Those countries moving towards something better gathers a lot underneath
Let´s hope that their manifestos are productive, because the next one taking power can be just as bad. Democracy is what they want but they don´t have a reference nor experience about what real democracy is. Hope the outcome is not as a 2nd Yugoslavia
The real issue about everything Libya=OIL/Uranium other issues of importance of the land imo...
Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin warned that volatility in international oil markets as a result of the instability in Libya posed a "serious threat to the world". London oil prices inched close to $120 on Thursday, a level not seen since mid-2008.
A call for Justice and humane values vs. Opportunistic self interest and the abuse of POWER etc i.e the SANCTIONS against GADDAFI.
Turkey's PM speaks out against Libya sanctions
We call on the international community to act with conscience, justice, laws and universal humane values — not out of oil concerns," he said[/colo.
An old ally of LYBIA speaks about the nitty gritty issue re: this so called revolt for democracy in Lybya"
You can agree or not with Gadhafi,” Castro said. “The world has been invaded by all sorts of news … We have to wait the necessary time to know with rigor how much is fact or lie.”
But he did urge protests of something says is planned: A U.S.-led invasion of the North African nation aimed at controlling its oil
.
“The government of the United States is not concerned at all about peace in Libya and it will not hesitate to give NATO the order to invade that rich country,[/size]
perhaps in a question of hours or very short days,” Castro wrote.
“An honest person will always be against any injustice committed against any people in the world,” Castro said. “And the worst of those at this instant would be to keep silent before the crime that NATO is preparing to commit against the Libyan people.”
http://updatednews.ca/2011/02/22/fidel- ... -of-libya/ (http://updatednews.ca/2011/02/22/fidel-castro-says-us-plans-nato-invasion-of-libya/)
my notes:
the issue of a current and ongoing human rights abuse against civilians, a very small sample..where is the outrage of human rights abuse ... :?
Afghan gov't: NATO op killed 65 civilians
http://www.sify.com/news/afghan-gov-t-n ... pdabeh.htm (http://www.sify.com/news/afghan-gov-t-nato-op-killed-65-civilians-news-international-lc1pbpdabeh.htm)
What people are saying re: the LYBYA issue: ...collected comments YT and elsewhere...
Another country going to be destroyed by mobs, all the strength of Arabia/Africa is being drained out by the CIA and the dumb people think it is revolution....
What a shame.
Think for yousleves, why is Gaddafi hated by the west and why are these uprisings causing so much delight in the west?
You foolish, foolish sheep.
· There are more than 200 countries in the world. Libyia is 44-th by GDP per capita does it mean, that Libyan people live in poverty?
I don't think so... If Libya has to remove regime what have to do other 166 nations? People are used by external powers to exploit Libya, so stop hypocritical grieve about people's fate and human rights abuse!!!
Muammar Gaddafi is a real man, real leader, real patriot of his homeland and a father of his nation!!!!!
Libya is being sabotaged, infiltrated, manipulated and destroyed by foreign agents lead by the CIA.This is an orchestrated and staged coup by western intelligent agencies which is stirring up young people to protest who don't understand what's at stake nor do they value their country's sovereignty and independence.
USA has bought off government officials,(LYBIAN deplomats/defectors at UN and/or US and where ever, handed out protest signs in English and mass produced the former royalist flag.Foreign agents are opening fire to blame the Lybian gov.
by Sarahli » Sun Feb 27, 2011 2:57 pm
Gaddafi was okay before but now the truth is too apparent so they prefer to disengage totally and point their fingers. So the same with Mubarak they really had a hard time to stop backing him up and remember what happened with Saddam.
I wonder why is Al Quaeda so silent?
They don't care about the people is the real truth and i don't doubt that everything that is happening in the world right now has to do with the cleansing of the earth before the new coming age.
[/quote]
@RSCII Very well said,whoever can't see what's really going on must be dumb,I smelt a rat a couple of days into the Egyptian "revolt" everything seems too convenient,I think it has too do with peak oil or "they" want WW3 but my only Q is why the sudden rush??
bet my ass that the fucking international parasite is behind the turmoil in Libya
. There is no evidence whatsoever of any air attacks on Tripoli.
A Finnish eyewitness.
who has eyesight from his hotel haven't seen any air attacks on the alleged places. There must be somekind of footage of it. But sure everything that the Jewish owned msm says are truth for the idiotic masses of the west.
suutari13 5 days ago
How is Libia bad? They are miles ahead of the other African countries, they take nice $ for their work, the law is strict. WTF? He's making the same mistake as Sadam - want's to sell petrol for euro !
US is bond to petrol sales, if petrol started to trade in euro the dollar will die, so US is again doing what they do - war's , start with "civil" one go to full scale one
.
Support for Mr. Gaddafi from around the world..
trini2thebone ..Totally agree whith you..Mr. Gadaffi is a very intelligent person and a man of honour.
Why are all the speeches not properly translated like fi. foreign movies?? and we have to listen to a manipulated translation by somebody who is not speaking Arab at all (i suppose).
Here in the Netherlands we are with you mr Gadaffi!!! stay stron
Full support of Gaddafi! Colonel, hold out until the final victory! Do not allow to you these CRAZY people from USA and UK break up your country . ALL SERBIA IS WITH YOU
@judyroodi Exactly. Gadhafi was a saint compared to the reign of Hussein's terror. While the rise in commodities (denominated in US dollars) and inflationary food prices is mostly to blame.
It is also copycat revolts, provocateurs from intelligence agencies of the more powerful nations, and an information war aimed at stirring the pot intentionally.
Conclusion: IMO
These uprisings are no accident, and the global power structure (banking oligarchy) wants to create their order out of this renewed chaos[/color]
My note: .
..NWO long standing plan/MOtto= Order out of CHAOS..
Peace..
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I wish to be wrong but looks like all these new situations will be another excuse for UN and/ or USA to "take over to put order" in those countries.
I don´t want to experience a WW3. Those countries, as I said, gather a lot underneeth and other countries around te corner gather nuclear power.
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by diggyon » Sat Feb 26, 2011 5:21 pm
@Supervision
i like the way you interpret the whole scenario in the Middle East. But what makes you so sure that it is all planned long before?
Because, that is basically how government operates...short term and very very long term plans.
The longest plan in general, as I had mentioned already is the Magna Charta .
.the Great Works of the AGES...
i.e. an 'ideal" plan , constructed for the progressive leadership of humanity / the whole Globe if you will.=NWO.
Is it written somewhere in the newspaper or is it only your personal opinion?
No it is not an personal op,per se, just a historical fact in the history of civilization/s
. ...do a bit of research,if you will, to ascertain for yourself, how things work in the political arena, and you perhaps will come to the same conclusions as I.
Since I mentioned personal opinion, how do you think this whole up rise in the Middle East will end?
Well, if things go well, then, new “puppet pseudo democracies” will be set up for the now “democracy loving Arab people” , while, if that were to take effect, then, there will automatically follow a consolidation of resources in the hands of the elite power brokers, ...
i.e. in this instance would be petrol, as well other minerals materials and even the strategic location of the lands themselves as a strategic points of control.
Egypt is very important in this area/ it's location being very Close to Israel, while she is pretty much considered a foe of Israel by and large.
So, for that and other reseans, it is important for the U.S.to have Egypt under it's control.
As for the Islamist, they also, as quiet as it is kept are a part of the high Elite, in other words with pretty much the same agenda in the end???.
It is/may not be transparent to the believers of Islam, but really nevertheless, it is quite true, I am afraid.
It is only an appearance of opposites, at times, but not always in reality , the way I assess it has to work, for the final showdown to be realized...i.e. NWO..
Somehow I feel that you are not optimistic at all!
Well, the optimism I dare to hold lies in that, that, first of all, I believe in an Almighty God that is over all this man made much ado,....
after that, the way I see it, if the world will accept it’s fate, and keep on churning according wht the planners say do, then, there should not be much of a problem, ;) :lol:
that is to say, for the ones that would still be alive and kicking , the rest will be eliminated systematically through various methods.=Population reduction as planned.[/size]
As for running around seeking "revolutions", well, in the end, really, there will not be too many direction left to run to . imo. :(
All centralized governance , with a dictatorial type edicts running the show, covert and overt.
If you are a Christian like me, those times then, would be called the reign of the AntiChrist, spoken of in the Bible.
So what do you think will happen to Europe next?!
Well, Europe is a block now, so it will breathe together as one with the U.S. ...the free trade agreements were put together to form blocks ....that would form and define, the few designated divisions of power on the whole globe, the way I see it ,and a very needed thing for now, when you stop and consider the giant China .
Because of that uprise the European economy has been directly affected. I bet some Elite are facing some economic problems as well.
Yeah, the elite have real real big problems, and I am all hearts...ha ha.
:lol:
And the real huge problem they got, that I see, is, how they can best pass the lie as truth through their propaganda, and numb the people of this world to believe one thing, while they go on and do another, like the how they would swindle these rich countries like Lybya, out of their natural wealth.,
and in this and other acts like it,they, no doubt will come to enjoy, one more scramble for AFRICA, like the one in the old days in a different version of it,...a modern day Slavery if you will,
the only difference this time will be, the majority of all the peoples of the world are also invited to participate, black /white/green purpule does not matter much anymore,
all would be ideally, as modern "slaves" of the ruling organ.
So was that whole scenario necessary in the first place
Yes..a long term plan on it's way to coming to fruition..One world currency, NWO , you know the story.. ;) .
I guess no dictator would like to step down and leave, other wise he will be killed by his opposers.
No, imo. lol. a dictator is usually a power crazy person, and usually never steps down, it is not just the money they can steal or the power that they enjoy that keeps them on the spot, but actually, it is a sort of a mental disease. Lol. :lol:
Other wise a lot of them will just steal and go become beach bums... for the rest of the lives. :lol:
I think I read somewhere that Mubarak owns more than 70 billion $. So would he give this money to the Egyptians?
No, of course not. Do the American politicians return the money they make in kick backs, back to the people? That would be the day lol. :lol:
All politicians are uniquely positioned to enrich themselves, and most of them do take advantage of their position.
They usually have both feet in the whole pic.
One foot they got in government making policy, while they also sit on the boards of the multi billion dollar corps. ;)
Again, a revolving door is what goes on in the most democratic set ups too.
So as you can see,it is not just dictators who steal and rob their constituency , the corruption is/may be present or is even worse in the so called democratic states, like the U.S and the politicians here for instance.
It is the case of the pot calling the kettle black, to tell the truth ;) .
Ghaddafi's fortune is even bigger as he ruled longer than Mubarak. lol.
Ghaddafi, to my knowledge,has been accused of many things except corruption, Never.
The man really does believe in his “third way ideology” as I understand him , and by and large ;)
.
as for corruption,$$$$, I can not say what is what with his sons though,having being raised/schooled in the modern ideologies of me first type of Greed..
If someone has 130 billion $ abroad and is about to be overthrown by his own people and is a dictator, then I wouldn't expect to hear something else from him, because he knows what might happen to him if he stepped down on his own: he will be imprisoned, and maybe killed as well.
No Gaddahfi could have taken the route of Mubarek,or other even worse "killer dictators" , and stepped down and gone into the night, with all his fortune in tact more or less, and nothing would have happened to him at all.
Have you not heard the old corrupt goat, Duvalier of Haiti, is actually back in Haiti, since the earth quake,with ambitions to try to get back in office again? :roll: lol.
I mean the saga of the Duvaliers was as shameful as it was ridiculous as the Marcos’s in the Philippines..
So why die alone? Let the people suffer a little, exactly the way he is suffering.
Not it has nothing to do with letting the people suffer,per se, in most cases, except where there is tribalism going on, like it is in Lybya now or in RAWANDA, or UGANDA,
In LYBya's example, The East LIbyans , the socalled “protesters" are of a different tribe, and do not like the GADDFas ..from which Gaddafi originates, and still has his loyal supporters as we speak..
So, if they frail to come together, after they already having seen the carrot stick of "independance" these past few days,Lybya perhaps will become like it was in RAWANDA, God forbid..you know what I mean?
A tribal Civil war.
Soooo, to conclude, in my view, that is what is happening in Libya ,and the hands of the Americans and the west is no doubt in it,all achieved perhaps, by triple dealings with the other factions within the ARAB community at large, including Al Quiada.
Yes al Quiada..lol. :o
He doesn't want to die in vain. These are not the words of a hero but rather the words of a criminal who is about to be caught by the police.
No, Gadhafi,imo. is no more a criminal,imo. than the police force, who are pretending to be the police as you describe them here. :roll:
They, just about all of them, are also are criminals of one sort or another,if you will, who are lying through their teeth to take advantage of the situation they themselves created for their own benefit..
All is about power and economic gains. .. they could not give a S...t about human rights .Sorry if you believe otherwise,and I will respect your op.
But...Pls. believe me when I tell you. No one cares too much about that sort of thing the way they profess to do,, all part of the whole make believe show to a great extent.. :?
The people who really care about human suffering are other "regular" humans, people like me and you.
The Govs ????
...nahh...they certainly,don’t care ,at least not the way the average citizen thinks they do or would, all is expendable if it comes to a choice of interest vs. conscience etc.imo.
He kills the hostages and fights till the end.
The "protesters" are not hostages, they are a group that is seeking to secede , since we already see them busy setting up a side government, and are actually trying to get recognition by the world at large in just a few weeks "protest". :roll:
This whole thing is stinking up to heaven...lol[/size]
This would then be a Civil War, if GADhafi can hold out, which I don’t know how he can.
He seems to be pretty hemmed in now, and I do so hope, if he in the end will be on the loosing end, bloodshed would be avoided.
This is not new!
.
Well, the new thing is , the Powers that be want to make Gadhafi a poster boy, or a quick precedent for war crime criminal/against humanity ;) ,
which such one voice condemnations,set a precedent,
and could later be used or applied to all sorts of other "rogue: nations, if they even dare to breathe, let alone make any sort of "trouble" against the wishes of the Masters of the UNIVERSE ;)
. All of those pointing fingers at Colonel Gaddhafi now, for crimes agains humanity, bla bla bla,...almost without exception, are all "honorable" holders of, perhaps more grave records in human rights violation.
Now that is what is new, ;)
the neck breaking speed in which these "humanitarian heart throbs" gathered together to do the dirty deed without so much of a pretense of double checking to see what really went down in the "demonstrations" in Tripoli , LIBYA . Imo.
I hope this helps. :)
Peace.
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The following Article is one of the few Venezuelan journalists more or less impartial, in this case i agree with him.
The news of Libya
Eleazar Díaz Rangel | Sunday, 27 February 2011 09: 24 am
I price as one of Latin Americans who have most studied the movement of news in the region. In my book "International information in Latin America" show how the news agencies (that since 12 May 1876, when they signed a treaty to spread worldwide, for the first time included Latin America) are running their information policies in line with the geopolitical interests of their respective countries. What is good for us is good for the AP and CNN; It can be repeated with England and the Reuters, France and the AIA and the majority of agencies. Course changes in world politics is have been reflecting on the interests of agencies and services. Why Senator Hiram Johnson could say in 1917, during World War I, the first victim of the war was the truth. Truth that is still valid to this day, and that the events of return to demonstrate
Almost all information that we transmit these events, especially the first days was oriented to affect the image of the Government of to the Gaddafi and favor those who have rebelled. Not these correspondents has private effort to disseminate the reality of what was happening. They spread rumors without any confirmation and species. Find and write the truth wasn't the ethical standard of many of these journalists and media.
Where they released the news that "military aircraft libios…bombardearon several places" Tripoli, as reported Arabiya TV Monday 21 and that "at least 250 people had been killed in the capital in the bombing of the air against the manifestantes… force" as transmitted on the same day to the Jazira? Not presented any image of the effects of the bombing, and five days later not had been able to offer them. Any agency explained that loyal to Gaddafi had cleaned up the streets and hidden debris! And how is it that no building is damaged? Everything that I had said "witnesses" unidentified, of course
These "news" were retransmitted by all agencies and have been published in hundreds, thousands, say, media from around the world, and they read or heard millions, tens or hundreds of millions of people in all countries, and were "analyzed" by articulistas and TV and radio commentators.
In the same vein of inventing the news very British Chancellor Willian Hage said Gaddafi had flown to Venezuela, and other "not identified, but all credible sources" invented the kind of Cubans piloting the aircraft the Libyan military refused to do so to continue shelling the civilian population. (And regarding bombing, the agencies have not remembered in 1986, executed by aircraft USA, which caused) (60 deaths, including a daughter of Gaddafi).
In Libya there has been an important reaction against the Government of Gaddafi, that after 40 years it has against the wall, and at least three important cities in the East of the country, close to oil wells and oil and gas pipelines, have been taken by the rebel forces. In Tripoli there is apparently a calm situation as Telesur has been reflected in their transmissions, but information remain unclear. Until Friday, despite the exhortations of the son of Gaddafi, seems that had not entered foreign journalists. Its absence hinders the movement of information to better understand the situation. I don't know if to you, but we were surprised and confused over the own Gaddafi announced publicly the presence of Al Qaeda in the area controlled by the rebels and the Taliban.
Of course there are complex domestic and foreign factors are not alien to the chaotic situation affecting that country with the largest reserves of oil from Africa and major supplier of USA and Europe. The role that should be playing some of the powerful tribes in that area is not clear. Not sure how can be aligned some son of Gaddafi as Seif Al-Islam, nor who control oil production. These eastern cities and the role that can be playing Al Qaeda who dominate
Washington Consulting peers from the European Union to take joint action. The EU adopted some but unaware of military order. Already oriented actions from UN and just read statements by heads of the most powerful countries to know where are the shots. It speaks the Libya Division into three pieces.
The fall of Gaddafi, with or without foreign military intervention, with the presence or not of the UN seems possible. If this happens, the dam greater Libyan oil, one of the lighter world, coveted by the Western powers. Soon they have valid calls to make the Libyan people that resolved this enormous crisis
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What's happening in these countries was coming anyway because of the bad treatment these populations have had to endure throughout the years with the help of the western world who are only demonstrating their tremendous hypocrisy and are only making a mockery of what democracy really should be....
Yes, Sarahli, indeed, most European leaders preferred a carpet crawler perspective and one of a shut mouth and "hurray, long live the regime".
That is a truth that many are not aware of.
This is diplomacy by intelligence, resource exploitation and weapon sales and not diplomacy by statesmen.
As to resources, this is an interesting link:
http://www.africa-energy.com/html/Public/PUBLIC_CURRENT_ISSUE.html
As to Russia's Gazprom interests and projects (just one of the key players and working on a 4200 km gaz pipeline from Nigeria to the Mediterranean Sea):
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/21c401c2-00ea-11dd-a0c5-000077b07658.html#axzz1FH9a9MZB
http://www.entrynews.com/article/49580.html
http://www.gazprom.com/ (marketing / PR focus)
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/28/gazprom-italy-idUSLDE71R27A20110228 (recent developments with regards to Libya)
It is also true that tourist business was of similar colour as to "keep your eyes off and your mouth shut". Hundreds of thousands of tourists should have known better but did not care.
I hope that some minds will be changed after all.
God bless those fighting for their freedom.
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@Supervision
thank you for this post. I bet it took you a very long time to explain every detail!
I also believe in God and I believe that the Antichrist will show up one day!
This means the end of the world is near. I don't know if it is going to be 21.12.2012 or not!
But anyway God can change all these devilish plans of the elite. God is our only hope!!
P.S. How come you know so much about the NWO and their plans?!?!?
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Supervision wrote:
Egypt is very important in this area/ it's location being very Close to Israel, while she is pretty much considered a foe of Israel by and large.
So, for that and other reseans, it is important for the U.S.to have Egypt under it's control.
Mubarak was the perfect puppet and appreciated by Israel because he helped greatly to maintain the inhumane Gaza blockade for example. So Israel/USA, the NWO powers, etc. surely would have prefered that Mubarak had stayed safely in power, they already controlled Egypt. There's no denying that he was a dictator oppressor of its people. So i really don't understand what would be their point in making Mubarak fall. Obviously Israel was pissed off and tried as well as others to maintain him despite the people's rejection. Of course the NWO plan is in march but i feel like what happened has shaken a little bit their arrogance and this situation will surely make them hasten their plan to take control over the world (as if it was possible) but i'm sure that they will make a lot of mistakes and self destroy. Maybe yes that it is the end of this world and maybe that invisible beings have been busy stamping some people on their foreheads.
Israeli president defends Mubarak as peacemaker, warns against Muslim Brotherhood
JERUSALEM - Israel's president said Saturday that Egypt's embattled leader, Hosni Mubarak, will always be remembered for preserving three decades of peace between the two nations.
Israel is deeply worried about the prospect that Mubarak could be forced to step down by the unprecedented street protests in Egypt and that a less friendly government will emerge. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has warned that any new government must maintain their 1979 peace deal — Israel's first with an Arab nation.
On Saturday, President Shimon Peres delivered an impassioned defence of Mubarak, crediting him with saving both Arab and Israeli lives by preventing war in the Middle East.
"His contribution to peace, as far as I'm concerned, will never be forgotten," Peres said in an address to hundreds of visiting members of the European Parliament.
During the three decades Mubarak has been in power, he has consistently enforced the peace treaty signed by his predecessor, and he has mediated between Israel and the Palestinians.
Peres warned against the possibility that Mubarak's ouster would bring the Muslim Brotherhood, Egypt's best organized opposition movement, to power, saying the fundamentalist group won't bring peace.
"We're very worried about having a change in government or a change in the system of elections without introducing a change in the reasons that brought this explosion, this bitterness," Peres said.
He appealed for foreign investment to bring technology, development and openness to Egypt.
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/israeli-presid ... 8-858.html (http://ca.news.yahoo.com/israeli-president-defends-mubarak-peacemaker-warns-against-muslim-20110205-133558-858.html)
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Great posts, people! :)
What has been very odd about this situation is the domino effect in a number if arab countires. How come so many countries are cracking simultaneously? Hmm....
The western vultures are circling above waiting for enough reason to enter.
Here we go, another move on the chess board:
"U.S. repositions military forces around Libya"
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/28/us-libya-usa-idUSTRE71K6D520110228
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Great posts, people! :)
What has been very odd about this situation is the domino effect in a number if arab countires. How come so many countries are cracking simultaneously? Hmm....
The western vultures are circling above waiting for enough reason to enter.
Here we go, another move on the chess board:
"U.S. repositions military forces around Libya"
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/28/us-libya-usa-idUSTRE71K6D520110228
That's the one million dollar question! :lol:
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The following article explains a bit whoever is behind these " revolutions " and the way to defeat,..a little difficult
Win the Revolution in the Comfort of your Own Home
Many people who visit this site ask “What should we do about this?”. Some criticize those who spend time seeking information, blaming them (even calling them cowards) for not taking part of a violent revolution. While I used to believe that taking the streets and shoving police in riot gear was the epitome of change, I’ve understood that it is not. Real revolution can happen while you’re sitting at home, wearing sweatpants and petting your cat. Is there something less threatening than a person in sweatpants petting a cat? No. But if this person understands the system’s traps and pitfalls, it can become the elite’s worst nightmare. Here’s an article that perfectly puts into words this concept
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-35RUfr_Y-rI/TWmiCMqTe0I/AAAAAAAAHKI/ZAPGTLR6Qi0/s320/Revolution.jpg)
Believe it or not, growing your own food or visiting your local farmers market is more revolutionary and constructive than burning down your own city and killing security forces
As Washington plunges the Middle East and North Africa into chaos, and city by city collapses into the hands of globalist stooges, many have mistakenly interpreted this “change” as a positive transformation.
On the contrary, the regimes that will replace the embattled nationalistic dictators in each nation the globalists despoil will interface not with the national governments in the service of their people, but will interface with the “civil society” underlay the Western backed NGOs have meticulously built up over decades. This “civil society” will in turn answer to corporate serving globalist institutions, like the IMF, WTO, World Bank and the UN, instituting crushing economic “liberalization.”
We have been given a prepackaged ideal of what “revolution” is supposed to look like. So when we see people in the streets battling security forces, waving flags, all within the backdrop of their burning society, we are satisfied that “revolution” is taking place. But the reality is, this is not a revolution by any stretch of the imagination. It is a high-tech, high-speed invasion and subjugation, a corruption of the sovereign state similar to what Tacitus described in Roman conquered Britannia.
From HistoryWorld.net:
‘His object was to accustom them to a life of peace and quiet by the provision of amenities. He therefore gave official assistance to the building of temples, public squares and good houses. He educated the sons of the chiefs in the liberal arts, and expressed a preference for British ability as compared to the trained skills of the Gauls. The result was that instead of loathing the Latin language they became eager to speak it effectively. In the same way, our national dress came into favour and the toga was everywhere to be seen. And so the population was gradually led into the demoralizing temptation of arcades, baths and sumptuous banquets. The unsuspecting Britons spoke of such novelties as ‘civilization’, when in fact they were only a feature of their enslavement.’
Tacitus Annals of Imperial Rome, translated Michael Grant, Penguin 1956, 1975, page 72
As we can see, “civil society” is not a new idea, nor is the concept of lulling a population into decadence and complacency while rolling them into a corrupt, exploitative domineering empire.
Real revolution will take place when people realize what indeed is really happening, who is behind it, and then no longer paying into their corrupt system. This translates into boycotting the corporate combines behind the very policies we deplore, and replacing “their” system that benefits only them, with our own system that solely benefits ourselves.
The following lists contain the corporations and institutions that constantly turn up behind the most heinous atrocities unfolding today. From the millions murdered in the misadventure in Vietnam, to the millions dying or maimed in the global “War on Terror,” and of course the the chaos unfolding during the premeditated reordering of the Middle East and North Africa that will indefinitely affect millions of lives and their future, these are the people responsible:
CFR Corporate Membership
Chatham House Major Corporate Membership
Chatham House Standard Corporate Membership
International Crisis Group Supporters
Movements.org Supporters
Some may be skeptical of whether or not boycotting and replacing the elitist system that currently domineers mankind is even possible, however it is already taking place. The alternative media is one such example, where people fed up with being lied to by obnoxious propagandists have decided to turn off the TV and report the news themselves. It has become a self-sustaining industry with exponential growth, where reputation and accuracy is replacing the slick graphics and 500 dollar suits that used to represent “legitimacy.”
The alternative media offers people accurate information. Accurate information is essential when making life decisions. Hearing the truth allows us to make decisions that benefit ourselves and our community. This stands contra to the current corporate owned media who would have us living our lives to benefit their shareholders, even to our own detriment.
We can and we must translate the success of the alternate media to all aspects of our life. The globalists have this unwarranted power because we have continuously paid into the corrupt system they have created and monopolize.
If young men became local deputies instead of joining the army, if we stopped shopping at Walmart (CFR), drinking Pepsi (CFR), eating at all the corporate owned junk-food restaurants, canceled our credit cards, canceled all but our internet connections, and basically boycotted all globalist corporations in general – along with replacing them with our own local system, where would the globalists get their manpower? Their money? Their legitimacy?
They need us, we don’t need them. That’s the big secret. We get our freedom back as soon as we take back our responsibilities for food, water, security, the monetary system, power, and manufacturing; that is independence. Independence is freedom, freedom is independence. We’ll never be free as long as we depend on the Fortune 500 for our survival.
Fixing these problems unfolding overseas starts with fixing the problems in our own backyards. Boycott the globalists, cut off their support, undermine their system, and they lose their ability to commit these atrocities. That will be a real revolution and it can start today. Not burning cities and masked rebels waving flags, but communities no longer dependent and fueling a corrupt system we all know must come to an end.
Source: Activist Post
http://vigilantcitizen.com/?p=7117 (http://vigilantcitizen.com/?p=7117)
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@supervision
All is about power and economic gains. .. they could not give a S...t about human rights .Sorry if you believe otherwise,and I will respect your op.
The people who really care about human suffering are other "regular" humans, people like me and you.
I appreciate your ops a lot. That I don’t always react doesn’t mean I’m not with you, it means that I don’t know all the facts, although I try to keep up with the news (when I got the time ;) ). It’s a serious matter which deserves all the attention. The political and economical controversies are based on own national profits as a priority, though human rights are down below the priority list, that’s the reality. I agree, I am a “regular” human who really cares about human suffering, but that doesn’t make me an idealist. I’m now even more determined to plead and fight for human rights, because people who stand up for freedom, to fight for a better life like you and me, deserve to be protected, specially in this battle for power. Of course I have a personal political opinion, yet I find that less important than human rights at the moment.
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Great posts, people! :)
What has been very odd about this situation is the domino effect in a number if arab countires. How come so many countries are cracking simultaneously? Hmm....
The western vultures are circling above waiting for enough reason to enter.
Here we go, another move on the chess board:
"U.S. repositions military forces around Libya"
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/28/us-libya-usa-idUSTRE71K6D520110228
That's the one million dollar question! :lol:
together with who is TS and when is MJ coming back! :lol:
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Gadafi´s assets have been frozen, as with Mubarak.
A lot of cash everywhere and it is said that it is stolen money from the state.
Let´s count the days untill "Pax Americana" steps in, what will create an anarchy.
At the end Lybia will be a land where tribes will be fighting to each other and radical muslims with the rest.
Gadafi, after seeing his response to people, is not behaving according to his Yamahiriya :|
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Desperate refugees surge over Libya-Tunisia border
Credit: Reuters/Zohra Bensemra
By Douglas Hamilton
RAS JDIR, Tunisia | Tue Mar 1, 2011 2:10pm EST
RAS JDIR, Tunisia (Reuters) - Soldiers fired into the air in an effort to subdue a wave of Egyptian laborers desperate to escape Libya on Tuesday, as the refugee crisis created by the rebellion against Muammar Gaddafi escalated.
Aid workers threw bottles of water and loaves of bread over the wall to a sea of men surging forward toward the safety of Tunisian soil, in a futile attempt to calm them.
Young Tunisians with branches torn from the trees kept them from clambering over the wall between border posts.
Tunisian officials were processing entrants as fast as they could, as medics plucked fainting men from the heaving mass sweeping over the chest-high steel gate.
Panicking migrants passed their bulging suitcases, rugs, and blankets overhead at the gate where soldiers with sticks tried to hold them back. A Tunisian officer with a loud hailer shouted reassurances that they would be let in.
Order looked close to collapse at one brief point in the overflowing border compound on the Tunisian side, where throngs of men jostled and long lines of exhausted migrants in torn jackets and headcloths queued for water, food, and toilets.
Troops fired warning shots in the air and white-faced officers unholstered their automatic pistols.
THOUSANDS YET TO COME
Many tens of thousands more are expected to flee west from the violence that has consumed Liby as Gaddafi's regime teeters on the verge of collapse.
"We can't see beyond that building on the Libyan side but we think there are many more waiting to come through, " said Ayman Gharaibeh, team leader for the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) at Ras Jdir.
"The numbers are daunting," he said. The last couple of days had seen an upsurge and refugees were now crossing at a rate of up to 15,000 a day, he said.
There was no one to coordinate relief and establish order on the Libyan side and the UNHCR judged it was not safe to go over there. Medecins sans Frontieres and the Red Cross-Red Crescent were trying to liaise with the Libyans to slow the flow.
"It looks like it's going to get worse ... They are going to break down the wall in the end," said Gharaibeh grimly.
In the mass of people behind the wall on the Libyan side, Bangladeshis held up a sheet with the words: "Help Help Help." In the Tunisian compound, a few hundred Vietnamese squatted stoically, waiting their turn to be bussed out and home.
PLANES AND SHIPS NEEDED
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/ ... 1N20110301 (http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/01/us-libya-tunisia-border-scene-idUSTRE72061N20110301)
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What's happening in the Middle East is really sad!!!!
The chaos is everywhere!!!!! I wonder what will happen next?!?!?
May be it's about time for MJ to show up, when it gets really worse!!!!!
I wonder...............................
I know this is off topic but i was always thinking that the come back of MJ is related to some kind of disaster!!!! Well, we have chaos now in some countries of the Middle East!!!
May be the worst is yet to come>>>>> :(
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Gadafi´s assets have been frozen, as with Mubarak.
A lot of cash everywhere and it is said that it is stolen money from the state.
Let´s count the days untill "Pax Americana" steps in, what will create an anarchy.
At the end Lybia will be a land where tribes will be fighting to each other and radical muslims with the rest.
Gadafi, after seeing his response to people, is not behaving according to his Yamahiriya :|
At the end Lybia will be a land where tribes will be fighting to each other and radical muslims with the rest.
[/b]
and the bloodshed will continue.. will it ever stop?! :(
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well thanks you all for your answers/posts
..here are some updates on this issue.
it seems like the West is backing up a bit except the UK belligerent Cameroon who is gun ho about bombing the hell out of Libya,
..Hillary is now seems to back up a bit too, and to say it may be counter productive for U.S to have direct intervention in Liby's internal affairs.
The Russians already said they will veto a non-fly zone option as did China and Venezuela , Turkey countries ,among some who may also try to block the rush rush "blitzkrieg move" as intimated by the Americans and the Brits etc,. ...
...
the backing up rhetoric may have come in now, since they fabricated most of the things they were reporting from the beginning imo. ,i.e.
about how Tripoli is falling sooon, and citing the human abuse thing also against the Gadhafi regime,etc. , but now may not really have much to show the world what is really going on there. :?
.
i.e. the truth may expose that, MR.Gadhafi may have more supporters in his Country, than was reported through the usual suspects the corporate media.
[attachment=0:3mqdnp7h]gaddafi-followers-tripoli- gather to cheer their leader.jpg[/attachment:3mqdnp7h]
anyway here is a few updates: and a link to the vid of Chavez speech in support of Gadhafi and Lybia..
The plot to stage insurrection by the State Dep.U.S.A..
The difficulty however, mainly in Libya, is to find conditions for holding demonstrations against Khadafy, considering that their own intelligence services (CIA) have already informed Washington that the Libyan government has popular support and the total population has in mind the bombings carried out by the Reagan administration where dozens of Libyans were murdered in cold blood by U.S. attacks, including a daughter of Khadafy.
On Thursday (17), Ashur Shamis, a Libyan opposition activist living in London and recruited by British intelligence (MI6) and American (CIA) was given information passed by the U.S. embassy in the United Kingdom and admitted, in an embarrassing form, that they have been using images of the protests in Bahrain and Yemen as if they were held in Tripoli and Benghazi, Libyan major cities, which unmasked the action mounted by the media and organs of communication who are working together against Libya and Iran
The U.S. Congress authorised the White House to double the amount approved in the 2011 budget for expenses related to propaganda, disinformation and media against leaders who oppose U.S. interests worldwide, as is the case with Muammar Khadafy Mahmoud Ahmedinejad, Hugo Chavez, Evo Morales, Rafael Correa, Raul Castro, Daniel Ortega, Cristina Kirchner, Fernando Lugo, Kim Jong II.
Resources would be used to buy space in the media of these countries ruled by these leaders in newspapers, radio, magazines and television networks.
They should always refer to them as dictators and always receive directions from the Press Attachés in their respective countries or if there is a snag in any diplomatic relations with them, from CIA agents in the country.
The total project budget is one billion dollars, but to Brazil only 120 million were allocated for such action.
Last week there was a joint meeting between representatives of the CIA.
The Central Intelligence Agency, State Department and Defence Department agreed that besides the funding for the actions against Khadafy and Ahmedinejad in their respective countries, millions of dollars would be transferred to opponents to allow them to organize demonstrations and start a world media campaign against the two and also seek to involve their Latin American allies to bring opposition parties to support U.S. positions.
The use of worldwide media images of demonstrations in Bahrain, where the U.S. Fifth Fleet is parked, and Yemen, another ally of the White House, as though the demonstrations happened in Tripoli and Benghazi, which happened, but to support the government of Khadafy in Libya, partly burned the U.S. plan against Libya.
Yesterday Libyan students around the world decided to organise demonstrations in support of Khadafy and the Libyan government.
The secret services of the U.S. and other countries decided to infiltrate agents to create provocations and disrupt them.
And as a way to undo the demonstrations, the CIA and the Press Attachés in U.S. embassies were responsible for spreading news with counter propaganda, publicising in the media of the world that students are being forced to support Khadafy under penalty of losing their scholarships to study, thereby initiating the plan that is coordinated by the White House itself.
Photos and images disseminated by means of alternative communication and a group of European students who are returning from Libya in the World Social Forum in Dakar, Senegal, support and show the veracity of statements by the Libyan government and Khadafy, considered a threat to the North American system.
Starting with the power the student movement and Libyan youth exert, they virtually run the country's universities after Khadafy pursued his Cultural Revolution.
The United States also accuses Khadafy of being behind the demonstrations, prohibited from being spread in the U.S. by Patriotic Decree, carried out daily for forty (40) days in Puerto Rico by students who demand freedom of expression and public education in that almost State which ended up becoming a North American colony.
Media B.S.
The control of news in the West about what is happening in the Middle East is so great that in all the demonstrations, from Tunisia and Egypt, U.S. flags, pictures of Obama and also George Bush are burned, but all these images are withdrawn by news agencies and television networks, controlled by the White House.
Photo shows support from the Libyan people to the government of Muammar Khadafy in TRIPOLI and used by the Western press as if it were contrary to Khadafy.
Photo: Mahmoud Turki / AFP
Venezuela's Hugo Chavez defends friendship with Muammar Gaddafi - video
Venezuelan president Hugo Chavez says international mediation should be deployed in an effort to seek a peaceful solution to the uprising against his ally Muammar Gaddafi of Libya
Support for the Colonel seeping in drop by drop,perhaps frustrating the "blitzkrieg plan Hillary/the Obama admin. was entertaining perhaps?...?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2 ... dafi-video (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2011/mar/01/venezuela-hugo-chavez-muammar-gaddafi-video)
Chávez, no stranger to rhetoric, went on to accuse the US and much of Europe of "rubbing their hands over Libya's oil".
The United States has said it is ready to invade Libya, and almost all of the European countries are condemning Libya.
What do they want?
They are rubbing their hands over Libya's oil. [/color]
Of course, that is what interests them.
So why don't they condemn Israel for bombing Fallujah [sic] and killing children and women?
This is done in public view and with evidence to back it up. Why don't they condemn Israel?
Who will condemn the United States for the more than 1m deaths in Iraq, in Afghanistan and throughout the world?[/size]
Who will condemn the United States?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/blog/20 ... e#block-32 (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/blog/2011/mar/01/libya-uprising-gaddafi-live#block-32)
News from Washington" re: no fly zone
"My military opinion is that it would be challenging. You would have to remove air defense capability in order to establish a no-fly zone, so no illusions here.
It would be a military operation – it wouldn't be just telling people not to fly airplanes".
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2 ... dafi-video (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2011/mar/01/venezuela-hugo-chavez-muammar-gaddafi-video)
The convoy was met with a small pro-Gaddafi demonstration as it made its way out of Tripoli.
"God, Gaddafi, Libya and that's it," chanted the demonstrators.[/hr]
Chaves speaks vid link below:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2 ... dafi-video (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2011/mar/01/venezuela-hugo-chavez-muammar-gaddafi-video)
Peace.
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Venezuelan president Hugo Chavez says international mediation should be deployed in an effort to seek a peaceful solution to the uprising against his ally Muammar Gaddafi of Libya
Support for the Colonel seeping in drop by drop,perhaps frustrating the "blitzkrieg plan Hillary/the Obama admin. was entertaining perhaps?...?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2 (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2) ... dafi-video
Chávez, no stranger to rhetoric, went on to accuse the US and much of Europe of "rubbing their hands over Libya's oil".
The United States has said it is ready to invade Libya, and almost all of the European countries are condemning Libya.
What do they want?
They are rubbing their hands over Libya's oil.
Of course, that is what interests them.
So why don't they condemn Israel for bombing Fallujah [sic] and killing children and women?
This is done in public view and with evidence to back it up. Why don't they condemn Israel?
All this is true, Chavez said, and i must recognize that i do not agree with Chavez in some things, but when he says these things i support.
United States, Israel and its allies in Europe are preparing the ground with all this misinformation for inavasion.
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March 02, 2011
Witness: In fiery speech, Gaddafi says will not surrender
Maria Golovnina
TRIPOLI (Reuters) - Basking in the adulation of hundreds of adoring supporters, Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi in a fiery speech Wednesday pledged to crush an escalating uprising against his rule.
Mixing paternalistic notes with furious anti-Western rhetoric, he told a people's congress in Tripoli that Libyans would die by the thousands if foreign powers intervened in the crisis, and blamed "armed gangsters" for the unrest.
"We put our fingers in the eyes of those who doubt that Libya is ruled by anyone other than its people," he said as delegates chanted "God, Muammar, Libya, only."
"We will enter a bloody war and thousands and thousands of Libyans will die if the United States enters or NATO enters," Gaddafi added as I and other journalists sat on the floor just 10 m (yards) away from the man who has ruled Libya for 40 years.
He was given a hero's welcome as he arrived at the heavily guarded complex driving at the head of his motorcade in a tiny golf cart and waving at cheering crowds.
When he entered the building, the crush of people trying to reach him knocked a state television camera broadcasting the speech off the air.
Gaddafi, who has lost swathes of territory and whole cities to rebels, repeated defiantly that he would not step down as leader of the oil-producing North African nation.
"There is a conspiracy to control Libyan oil and to control Libyan land, to colonize Libya once again. This is impossible, impossible," he said, wearing his trademark turban and a flowing white robe.
"We will fight until the last man and last woman to defend Libya from east to west, north to south," he said.
At times he appeared almost aloof, sometimes sad, and the overall tone was more conciliatory than usual.
He spoke at length about his family, government reform and promised to give people loans at zero interest.
His three-hour speech was interrupted regularly by frantic applause and he was given a standing ovation several times. Some delegates were wearing baseball caps with a picture of Gaddafi.
He made long pauses and listened to the applause with a stony face. Sometimes he tapped on the microphone to signal his impatience with the cheering.
One woman shouted from the audience: "You will not go and you will never leave! You are all that is good!... You are a sword that does not bend!"
Others chanted "We will die for Gaddafi."
FORGIVE CONFUSED YOUNG PEOPLE
At times the Libyan leader showed a softer side, saying he was ready to forgive what he described as confused young people with Kalashnikovs who had been misled by bandits and al Qaeda.
"My assets are human values, the nation, glory, history," he said. "These are assets that are eternal."
The delegates said they loved Gaddafi -- a sentiment that appears to dominate in Tripoli, Gaddafi's last significant stronghold in an unprecedented two-week-old popular uprising against his rule.
"I am happy he is here. We all love him. This is a celebration," said Bashir Zimbil, a university professor.
"The U.S. and Britain are trying to interfere. The West wants our oil. They want to divide and conquer. They will not succeed. Our leader will protect us."
Diplomats from the few countries which have maintained a presence in the country, among them Malaysia, North Korea, Russia and Ukraine, listened and looked a bit uncomfortable.
In the back of the hall, despite the noise, some people slept.
(Editing by Michael Roddy)
http://www.realclearworld.com/news/reut ... ender.html (http://www.realclearworld.com/news/reuters/international/2011/Mar/02/witness__in_fiery_speech__gaddafi_says_will_not_surrender.html)
My assets are human values
hmmm... how to interpret..?
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[youtube:2mivpdwp]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNO1HeixovQ[/youtube:2mivpdwp]
Shout - Michael Jackson
Ignorance of people purchasing diamonds and necklaces
And barely able to keep the payments up on their lessons
And enrolled in a class and don't know who the professor is
How low people go for the dough and make a mess of things?
Kids are murdering other kids for the fun of it
Instead of using their mind or their fist, they put a gun in it
Wanna be a part of a clique, don't know who's running it
Tragedy on top of tragedy you know it's killing me.
So many people in agony, this shouldn't have to be
Too busy focusing on ourselves and not His Majesty
There has to be some type of change for this day and age
We gotta rearrange and flip the page
Living encased like animals and cannibals
Eating each other alive just to survive the nine to five
Every single day is trouble while we struggle and strive
Peace of mind's so hard to find
I wanna shout, throw my hands up and shout
What's this madness all about?
All this makes me wanna shout
You know it makes me wanna shout
Throw my hands up and shout
What's this madness all about?
All this makes me wanna shout, c'mon now
Problems, complications and accusations
Dividing the nations and races of empty faces, a war is taking place
No substitution for restitution, the only solution for peace
Is increasing the height of your spirituality
Masses of minds are shrouded, clouded visions
Deceptions and indecision, no faith or religion, how we're living
The clock is ticking, the end is coming, there'll be no warning
But we live to see the dawn
How can we preach, when all we make this world to be
Is a living hell torturing our minds?
We all must unite, to turn darkness to light
And the love in our hearts will shine
We're disconnected from love, we're disrespecting each other
Whatever happened to protecting each other
Poisoned your body and your soul for a minute of pleasure
But the damage that you've done is gonna last forever
Babies being born in the world already drug addicted and afflicted
Family values are contradicted, ashes to ashes and dust to dust
The pressure is building and I've had enough
I wanna shout, throw my hands up and shout
What's this madness all about?
All this makes me wanna shout
You know it makes me wanna shout
Throw my hands up and shout
What's this madness all about?
All this makes me wanna shout, c'mon now
[ From: http://www.metrolyrics.com/shout-lyrics ... ckson.html (http://www.metrolyrics.com/shout-lyrics-michael-jackson.html) ]
Problems, complications and accusations
Dividing the nations and races of empty faces, a war is taking place
No substitution for restitution, the only solution for peace
Is increasing the height of your spirituality
Strong lyrics, so true, they express how I feel sometimes, that I wanna shout. Love the vid btw, watch till the end ;)
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everlastinglove_MJ wrote: My assets are human values hmmm... how to interpret..?
Well, in accounting an asset is the whole of tangible or intangible that owns a company, i believe that Gaddafi does not speak of material goods, spoke of human values.
Honesty, gratitude
Sincerity
Generosity
Family, honesty
Decency, solidarity
Sensitivity, sacrifice
Retinal detachment
Compassion, love
Patient, understanding
Simple ,goodness
Friendship, loyalty
Respect , forgiveness
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Retinal detachment
here I use the translator, was a dirty game :lol:
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more updates and links to some interesting articles..pls. read more on link if interested..
http://mylogicoftruth.wordpress.com/201 ... -military/ (http://mylogicoftruth.wordpress.com/2011/03/02/airstrikes-in-libya-did-not-take-place-russian-military/) ..(video link pls. click and view)
Airstrikes in Libya did not take place – Russian military
OOOPPsss?... :?
Now what, I wonder? :?
RE: 9/11..and present day "crisis" and as it relates to a long planned advance of agenda of American Hegemony in the Middle east and throughout the world..
re" through destabilization /balkanization of the middle east, with a paramount concern of stealing its economic resources=Oil=Libya.
9/11 and the Conquest of Iraq
http://mylogicoftruth.wordpress.com/201 ... t-of-iraq/ (http://mylogicoftruth.wordpress.com/2011/03/01/911-and-the-conquest-of-iraq/)
Make up your own Mind
9/11 and the Conquest of Iraq
http://dprogram.net (http://dprogram.net)
March 1st, 2011
“It’s a system that lies automatically, at every level from bottom to top – from sergeant to commander in chief – to conceal murder.” Daniel Ellsburg, Secrets, (Viking, 2002)
“Beneath all the fakes and lies and all the mental aberrations, however deeply hidden or wildly deformed, the truth still breaks through, still glitters, still breathes.”
(Mihail Sebastian, Romanian playwright, as quoted by Nickolson Baker, Human Smoke, Simon & Schuster, 2008)
Lies run sprints..but the TRUTH runs marathons. Michael J. Jackson
Unverified Misreporting on Libya
http://www.uruknet.info (http://www.uruknet.info)
by Stephen Lendman
http://mylogicoftruth.wordpress.com/201 ... -on-libya/ (http://mylogicoftruth.wordpress.com/2011/03/02/unverified-misreporting-on-libya/)
March 1, 2011
America’s media, Britain’s state-controlled BBC, other Western sources, and Al Jazeera are spreading unverified or false reports on Libya’s uprising.
On February 25, writer Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya, a Middle East/Central Asian specialist, based on reliable in-country contacts, headlined an important article, : Is Washington Pushing for Civil War to Justify a US-NATO Military Intervention?”
For greater readership, this article covers key information in it. Its entirety explains much about what’s ongoing – what major media accounts misreport or suppress, especially television reaching large audiences, presenting distorted managed news. It shouldn’t surprise. Representing powerful interests, carefully filtered sanitized reporting substitutes for the real kind.
Western powers, especially America, gladly support despots.
They only fall into disfavor by forgetting who’s boss. Mubarak forgot. So did Gaddafi, long targeted for removal despite rapprochement with America and Western nations.
As a result, in-country reports lack credibility without verifiable proof. Much of it is lacking.At issue is removing an outlier while keeping his regime intact, one friendly to Washington and Western interests
.
Acquiescence assures support for the world’s most ruthless tyrants.
Straying gets them in trouble.
Gaddafi strayed, leaving him vulnerable for removal.
Henry Kissinger once said: “to be an enemy of America can be dangerous, but to be a friend is fatal.”
If balkanization is planned, friends and foes alike may be targeted, if thought unreliable. Libya’s chaos also affects Europe and global energy issues, including price, for oil heading over $100 a barrel and maybe much higher, threatening fragile economies with deeper crisis.–
Washington wanted Gaddafi replaced for years.
– Libyans should be wary. America and Western powers play hardball against popular interests throughout the region.–
[attachment=0:15o33bat]300px-Muammar_al-Gaddafi- Sanctions and travel ban].jpg[/attachment:15o33bat]
“Actions of opposition to Gaddafi are strong, but there is no strong organized ‘opposition movement.’
The two are different.” Moreover, no opposition force wants democracy.–
Serious discussion suggests a Yugoslav-type “humanitarian intervention.”
A “no-fly” zone is mentioned, an act of war if imposed, giving Western powers the right to intervene militarily the way Iraq was bombed in the 1990s.
Invasion and occupation, in fact, could follow to replace the already weakened regime. Libya’s assets would be plundered, its people left with one despot replacing another.
Comparing Yugoslavia to LibyaIn the 1990s, “pack (or) advocacy journalism” substituted for the real kind, including by promoting the 1999 US-led NATO war of aggression to complete Yugoslavia’s long-planned balkanization, characterized as “humanitarian intervention,” the same theme repeated now.[/size]
Libyan Analysis in Bullet Points–
Unlike Tunisia, Egypt, and other regional allies, “upsetting (Libya’s) established order is a US and EU objective,” by replacing one despot with another.
– the West “seek(‘s) to capitalize on the revolt” for new leadership it controls.– Heavy weapons are coming in.–
Destabilizing Libya affects its vast energy reserves and neighboring states, perhaps the entire region.
– Major media reports, including by Al Jazeera, “about Libyan jets firing on protesters in Tripoli and the major cities are unverified and questionable….
No visual evidence of the jet attacks has been shown.” Gaddafi, in fact, controls cities reported to be occupied by opponents.
Moreover, some accounts of violence are spurious.
Stories are invented to “justify no-fly zones,” perhaps heading for war led by America and NATO.
Libyans must now liberate themselves, independent of Western powers wanting to exploit them for their own self-interest.
I pray for all these "devilish" orchestration of evil,would pass over a bridge to build peace, soon and very soon, without the terrible blood shed that could be avoided, if and when higher morals would exceed the lust and greed of these warmongering elite powers.
peace.
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@by everlastinglove_MJ
thanks for posting the first hand report by journalist Maria Golonina.. at least this journalist, was actually there in Tripoli.... firsthand, and it seems she gave the truth her best shot?. ;)
by paula-c wrote:
All this is true, Chavez said, and i must recognize that i do not agree with Chavez in some things,....
but when he says these things I support.
United States, Israel and its allies in Europe are preparing the ground with all this misinformation for invasion.
sure you are right on target, about the west laying the ground works, with it's misinformation propaganda blitz, but nevertheless, a few more " minor roadblocks and frustrations" for the wests' nefarious plans could be cropping up slowly ?
..re: Chavez follows up his talk of Peace, with a phone conference with Gaddhafi..
re: Peace Effort:
Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez and Libya's embattled leader Muammar Gaddafi have discussed plans for an international peacekeeping mission to mediate the crisis in Libya, say officials.
"We do confirm that Comandante Chavez had a conversation with Gaddafii yesterday (Tuesday) on a Peace Commission for Libya proposal," Communications Minister Andres Izarra tweeted.
http://www.smh.com.au/world/chavez-in-t ... 1bg3m.html (http://www.smh.com.au/world/chavez-in-talks-with-gaddafi-to-seek-crisis-mediators-20110303-1bg3m.html)
re: the peaceful pro democracy protests in Libya
The so called 'Peaceful Protesters " who are armed to the teeth by "foreign instigators" are now, actually asking to have their cake and eating it too lol.. ;)
The bizarre/weaselly request:
Libyan rebels who control part of the country's east called on the United Nations to order air strikes against mercenaries fighting for the 68-year-old leader, who seized power in a 1969 coup.
By invoking the UN, the revolutionary council in Benghazi, made up of lawyers, academics, judges and prominent figures, sought to draw a distinction between the air strikes and foreign intervention, which the rebels emphatically oppose. ;)
Word from the Colonel:
But speaking live on state television, Gaddafi warned that the "battle will be very, very long" if there is any intervention by foreign powers.
[attachment=0:1xzugeb2]Can any army defeat these beauties too much destraction lol.jpg[/attachment:1xzugeb2]
The Arab league/AU.. a further possible frustration for the West plans..? ;)
The 22-member Arab League appeared to offer an Arab and African alternative to Western intervention, saying it would consider backing a no-fly zone with the African Union.
But it ruled out supporting any direct foreign military intervention in Libya.
Peace
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everlastinglove_MJ wrote: My assets are human values hmmm... how to interpret..?
Well, in accounting an asset is the whole of tangible or intangible that owns a company, i believe that Gaddafi does not speak of material goods, spoke of human values.
Honesty, gratitude
Sincerity
Generosity
Family, honesty
Decency, solidarity
Sensitivity, sacrifice
Retinal detachment
Compassion, love
Patient, understanding
Simple ,goodness
Friendship, loyalty
Respect , forgiveness
Thanks, to be honest I was doubting what Gaddafi really meant by human values, because in his speech he stated:
"We will fight until the last man and last woman to defend Libya from east to west, north to south," Well, I understand that he's up in arms with his army, but it doesn't give him the right to decide for the Libyan people, which he considers as "his people". Though, in this situation he has no choice to defend himself.
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@ Supervision
Comparing Yugoslavia to LibyaIn the 1990s, “pack (or) advocacy journalism” substituted for the real kind, including by promoting the 1999 US-led NATO war of aggression to complete Yugoslavia’s long-planned balkanization, characterized as “humanitarian intervention,” the same theme repeated now.
Yes, I’m afraid that the statement “humanitarian” intervention will be used as an excuse by the US and NATO to justify their intervention acts in Libya.
Libyans must now liberate themselves, independent of Western powers wanting to exploit them for their own self-interest.
Exactly!
@by everlastinglove_MJ
thanks for posting the first hand report by journalist Maria Golonina.. at least this journalist, was actually there in Tripoli.... firsthand, and it seems she gave the truth her best shot?.
I try to be selective in searching for first hand reports from sincere sources like i.e. http://www.realclearworld.com (http://www.realclearworld.com) and Reuters, and not only concerning this matter.
Can any army defeat these beauties too much destraction lol.jpg
:lol: :lol: A typical remark of a man. I’ve to admit though that this must be a strategic plan, specially when they'd use their brains instead of weapons. That would be intelligent and humanitarian combined with beauty, great strategic plan with diversity ;)
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3 Dutch marines held in Libya after failed rescue
By MIKE CORDER, Associated Press Mike Corder, Associated Press – 1 hr 9 mins ago
THE HAGUE, Netherlands – Armed forces loyal to Moammar Gadhafi captured three Dutch marines and their helicopter during a botched evacuation mission near a stronghold of the Libyan leader, the Defense Ministry said Thursday.
Libyan authorities are still holding the marines five days after they were seized Sunday by armed men after landing near Sirte in a Lynx helicopter from the navy ship HMS Tromp. The ship was anchored off the Libyan coast to help evacuations from the conflict-torn country, spokesman Otte Beeksma told The Associated Press.
Two Europeans, one Dutch and one whose nationality was not released, were also captured. They were handed over unharmed to the Dutch embassy in Tripoli early Thursday and have left Libya, the ministry said.
Prime Minister Mark Rutte said his government authorized the mission.
Dutch officials are in "intensive negotiations" with Gadhafi's government to secure the marines' release, he said.
"We have also been in contact with the crewmen involved," Beeksma said. "They are doing well under the circumstances and we hope they will be released as quickly as possible."
Dutch state news cited the consulting firm Royal Haskoning as saying the Dutch man the captured soldiers had been trying to rescue is an engineer for their firm, but it did not give any information about the other. The company could not immediately be reached for comment.
Defense Minister Hans Hillen welcomed the news that the two Europeans were safe and had left Libya. "Everything is being done to also get the crew safely out of the country as soon as possible," he said in a statement.
Rutte said news of the men's capture was kept quiet to assist talks on their release. Dutch daily De Telegraaf first reported their capture in its Thursday edition.
"These are situations that benefit from total secrecy because then you can carry out discussions in peace to ensure these people get home safely," Rutte told national broadcaster NOS.
"It is terrible for the crew of the Lynx helicopter," he said. "Everything is being done to make sure the crew gets home."
The marines' identities were not released.
On Wednesday, Gadhafi warned the U.S. and other Western powers not to intervene in the chaos enveloping his country. He vowed to turn Libya into "another Vietnam," and said any foreign troops coming into his country "will be entering hell and they will drown in blood."
Military expert Christ Klep from the Clingendael think tank said the marines' capture was a coup for Gadhafi, who could possibly use them as bargaining chips in negotiations with the West.
"Yes, that is a very serious consideration. They are in military uniform," he said. "It's an easy situation for Gadhafi to exploit."
____
Associated Press writer Toby Sterling in Amsterdam contributed to this report
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110303/ap_ ... rines_held (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110303/ap_on_re_eu/eu_netherlands_libya_marines_held)
Dutch daily De Telegraaf first reported their capture in its Thursday edition.
thank you tabloid Telegraaf...again not thinking about the consequences :x
a worrying situation, I hope the marines will be treated well and that they will be released soon
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@ Supervision
Comparing Yugoslavia to LibyaIn the 1990s, “pack (or) advocacy journalism” substituted for the real kind, including by promoting the 1999 US-led NATO war of aggression to complete Yugoslavia’s long-planned balkanization, characterized as “humanitarian intervention,” the same theme repeated now.
Yes, I’m afraid that the statement “humanitarian” intervention will be used as an excuse by the US and NATO to justify their intervention acts in Libya.
I so agree! With this they shut mouths of anyone who thinks differently. Like, "We're here purely with humanitarian motives, how DARE you think we're here with any other motive! (like oil, natural resources, privatizing i.e. owning the country etc.)". It's like a shield. Just like priesthood has protected several child molestors.
The more I've listened / read the mainstream news, with all the repetitive rant of how crazy Gadaffi is, the more clear it is that we're only presented one side of the coin.
Libyans must now liberate themselves, independent of Western powers wanting to exploit them for their own self-interest.
Exactly!
I doubt they manage to do that, though. Even if they technically made the change, I don't think they can avoid the western exploitation.
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But was Gaddafi a good leader? It seems not... so believing that Gaddafi is better than the West's oppression is like telling the Lybian people that they only have the choice between the worse and the less worse.
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LIBYA ON U.S. CRISIS SUMMIT SET FOR MARCH 11
Wednesday, 02 March 2011 6:15 Newsroom Staff
By: Eliane Portillo
Latin Daily Financial News Latin Financial News Daily
European Union leaders are to gather on March 11 for a special summit convened to respond to the crisis in Libya as well as to the turmoil sweeping Arab nations in Europe's Mediterranean backyard. European Union Leaders Are to gather on March 11 for a special summit to convene Respond to the crisis in Libya as well as to the turmoil sweeping Arab Nations in Europe's Mediterranean backyard
"In light of Developments in the EU's southern neighborhood, and Especially in Libya, I convene an extraordinary European Council" U.S. President Herman Van Rompuy said.
Europe's 27 heads of state and government will meet ahead of a same-day long-planned summit of the 17 nations that share the euro, gathering in Brussels to finalize a debt crisis game-plan. Europe's 27 heads of state and Government Will Meet ahead of a same-day-long summit of the 17 Planned Nations That share the euro, gathering in Brussels to finalize a game-plan Debt Crisis.
Also in town as momentum for a military response to Moamer Kadhafi appears to gather speed will be defense ministers from the 28-member NATO alliance. Also in town as momentum for a military response to Moamer Kadhafi Appears to Be defense will gather speed Ministers from the 28-member NATO alliance.
The emergency talks follow a request for a summit from British Prime Minister David Cameron and French President Nicolas Sarkozy, who in a joint statement dubbed Kadhafi's brutality as "totally unacceptable" and urged fresh options "for increasing pressure on the regime." The emergency talks follow a request for a summit from British Prime Minister David Cameron and French President Nicolas Sarkozy, WHO in a joint statement dubbed Kadhafi's brutality as "Totally Unacceptable" and urged fresh options "for Increasing pressure on the regime."
Cameron also raised "the importance of transforming the EU's approach to the region", a reference to a shabby era of upholding despots on Europe's southern flank which has come under sharp attack in past weeks from rights groups, Euro-MPs, analysts and even governments. Cameron Also raised "The Importance of Transforming the EU's approach to the region", a reference to a shabby era of upholding despots on Europe's southern flank Which has come under sharp attack in past weeks from rights groups, Euro-MPs, Analysts and events governments .
"The EU must change its policies, instead of backing the status quo it must support a community of democratic states," said Alvaro de Vaconcelas of the European Union Institute for Policy Studies. "The U.S. Must Change STI Policies, INSTEAD of backing the status quo it Must support a community of Democratic State," Said Alvaro de Vaconcelas of the European Union Institute for Policy Studies.
If EU leaders appear ready to review decades of "failed" policies towards their Mediterranean neighbors, they stand divided on a potential human tsunami stemming from the chaos, an issue expected to feature prominently at the talks. If EU Leaders Appear ready to review Decades of "failed" Policies Towards Their Mediterranean neighbors, Divided They Stand on a human Potential tsunami stemming from the chaos, an issue Expected to feature prominently at the talks.
European states bordering the Mediterranean, notably Italy, are highly concerned by the deteriorating humanitarian situation in Libya and the associated risk of an exodus of refugees and migrants. Bordering the Mediterranean European states, Italy Notably, Are Highly Concerned by the deteriorating Humanitarian situation in Libya and the associated Risk of an exodus of Refugees and migrants.
The numbers massing at Libya's borders with Egypt and Tunisia to escape Kadhafi's wrath were ballooning out of control Tuesday, the UN refugee agency said as warnings mounted of imminent food shortages. The numbers Massing at Libya's borders with Egypt and Tunisia to escape Kadhafi's wrath Were ballooning out of control Tuesday, the UN Refugee agency as warnings mounted Said Imminent food of Shortages.
Up to 75,000 people had fled to Tunisia since February 20, with the situation reaching "crisis-point" as tens of thousands await transport inland. Up to 75.000 people Had Fled to Tunisia Since February 20, with the situation Reaching "crisis" point "as tens of Thousands Await inland transport. With up to 1.5 million would-be African migrants believed harboured in Libya, Italy, at the frontline of migration flows, has warned of a human tidal of "biblical proportions". With up to 1.5 million would-be African migrants Believed Harbour in Libya, Italy, at the frontline of migration flows, have Warned of a human tidal of "Biblical Proportions."
In a televised address to France on Sunday, Sarkozy said that "on the other side of the Mediterranean, an immense upheaval is underway". In a Televised address to France on Sunday, Sarkozy Said That "on the Other Side of the Mediterranean, an Immense upheaval is Underway."
"By setting democracy and freedom against all forms of dictatorship, these revolutions open a new era," he said. "By setting democracy and freedom Against all forms of Dictatorship, These revolutions open a new era," I said. "We should have one goal: to help these people who have chosen to be free." "We Should Have one goal: to help These People Who Have Chosen to be free."
But he also warned Europe could face an "uncontrollable" wave of refugees fleeing North Africa if unrest continues. But I Could Also Warned Europe face an "uncontrollable" wave of Refugees Fleeing North Africa if unrest continues.
"We do not know what the consequences of these events will be for migratory flows," he said. "We Do Not Know What The Consequences of These Events Will Be for Migratory flows," I said.
http://www.latindailyfinancialnews.com/ ... ch-11.html (http://www.latindailyfinancialnews.com/index.php/en/top-news/world/7916-eu-crisis-summit-on-libya-set-for-march-11.html)
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But was Gaddafi a good leader? It seems not... so believing that Gaddafi is better than the West's oppression is like telling the Lybian people that they only have the choice between the worse and the less worse.
WORD
You can be the Lybian's that are rebelling know it and know it deep.
The ones that where rebelling and are now acting like the Love Gaddafi
their insane dictator are in FEAR for their lives.
Gaddafi makes Charlie Sheen look sane.
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by Sarahli » Thu Mar 03, 2011 3:51 pm
But was Gaddafi a good leader? It seems not... so believing that Gaddafi is better than the West's oppression is like telling the Lybian people that they only have the choice between the worse and the less worse.
by RunFaYaLife
You can be the Lybian's that are rebelling know it and know it deep.
The ones that where rebelling and are now acting like the Love Gaddafi
their insane dictator are in FEAR for their lives.
Gaddafi makes Charlie Sheen look sane.
with all due respect, there is no comparison at all to be made, imo, between wht the Libyans will face under western backed pseudo democracy rule, which is basically an “occupation “ of Libya,with that of the GADHAFI Rule. ,
as the imperialists will, no doubt waste no time before they will build their military bases in Libya, as they did before. ;)
Much suitable for all of them to better control the whole region,=protection of Israel and U.S/Europe hegemony,.... and go right back to the old ways of exploitation and plunder ,as before the time when Colonel Gadhafi, after his revolutionary coup, had kicked them all out , and nationalized the oil fields of Libya.
Pls. note, that ,all the major western powers were in Libya doing wht they do best,exploit, ... the U.K as well as U.S as well as Italians and what not :roll: ..
So, after they got kicked out, by the Colonel, they never let him forget about wht they felt about his unheard of "bodacious " moves. ;)
But, Colnel Gadhafi with Russian help in the beginning of his career as leader , did build an impressive economy for his nation, for which he can feel justifiably proud by anyone's standards btw. .
For 40 plus yrs rule that Mr. Gadhafi provided to his people, he fought an up hill battle , to bring Libya to become the first and only country ( South Africa?,) to have the highest GDP in the whole continent of Africa.
Lol do we not all see, just how many millions migrated to Libya from all over the world to find employment there?
If all these foreign national were not there in Libya to begin with, when all this jumped off, they would not now have to be evacuated, or flee the country etc . ;)
As for the Libyans themselves, the Libyans were not exactly starving, far from it, they enjoyed a very high level standard of living, by most standards in the South, or even the west lol.
I agree as does the regime now, as said through Seif as well as Gadhafi himself, that reform certainly should be instituted and a more progressive democratization process should be set up as well, by the Libyans themselves,without western intervention, which Seif his son, has been arguing for with the old guards of the Revolutionary council, for a long time now it seems ;) .
So, going from that, imo.,while all Libyans should have a right to assemble and hold peaceful protest,to make their demands known, there is no way by and large the majority of the Libyans had so much to complain about ,to start a revolution like we saw in Egypt and Tunisia,let alone to have an insurrection with arms etc,which makes the whole thing suspect, about foreign hands being in all of this "revolutions" ;) . .
What is more the West knew this to be fact.
The West already had statistical evidence , that M. Gadhafi had popular support in his country
, which is why, no matter how long and how hard they tried, they were ,even as we speak, not able to get rid of him . ;)
He has escaped so many assassination attempt on his life,it is not even funny, :?
and the heavy and loooong term sanctions slapped on his country by the West, which, he withstood as long as he could take it, and never at any point did ever think leaving his country to these vultures,even though he was “rehabilitated” and undergone a rapprochement with the west,so he believe, wrongly it seems now, since all of them now have turned their faces against him,, when it was just two weeks ago, they were all too happy to sell him anything he ever could want or wish.
As for the Colonel being an "insane dictator" as the poster above suggests, well, every one is entitled to their opinion, but, the real truth maybe though, that Mr. Gadafi is admired in the eyes of millions of peoples in this world, and not just within Libya either.And most important then is that the Libyans themselves do not consider Colonel GAdHafi insane, no matter what the western media wish to depict him as such and some people may wish to believe the fairy tale.
As his son Seif said,regarding this depiction of his father being crazy and insane etc. and ..about the comment made by the U.S UN Ambassador of the US, , Susan Rice, saying that Gadhafi is "delusional" and " unfit to rule"..
Seif ..said ..
"She is not even fit to comment anything concerning Libya, she is not a Libyan. "...good point and I agree..
we must know,that M. Gadhaffi is not like Mubarak in Egpyt, who was basically an imperialist puppet.
NO.The colonel is quite a hero not only in his own country , but also through out the Southern Hemisphere/Latin Americas, as well as in Africa as well. Many a young African kid looks up to the colonel
He is one and only individual/leader in recent history, that the west had to contend with, with a grudging respect, while the rest of the “dictators” throughout the region,,had long sold out their people and the wealth their respective countries too, to the highest bidder in exchange to stay in power.
If M. Gadhafi was such a bad leader, do you think for a minute that anyone will be willing to die for him and go to war for him?
All those so called defectors/diplomats lol. imo. were either paid , to sell over their country ,or they were too eager to secure a position in the coming in regime if Gadhafi falls. Opportunist you know?
So, I do Think about this angles as that is what seems more and more to be the reality in todays Libya, on the ground , and not at all, wht the west's corporate media as well as the Arabic media owned by the Qatar and Saudi aka WEST, is fanning about. :roll:
i.e. lies and major shameful hypocrisies,just seeking to create an opening, to get into Libya, to do their dirty deeds.[/color]
Peace..
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In time of war or revolution the first victim seems to be the truth.
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by NightOwl » Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:08 pm
I doubt they manage to do that, though. Even if they technically made the change, I don't think they can avoid the western exploitation.
Trade Interdependency is unavoidable it is true.
However, there is a big difference btw. a win win type of an “Exploitation” and an outright Occupation/ownership, of the whole country in which it’s people get the much shorter end of the pie,if anything at all..
by paula-c » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:18 pm
re:Europe's 27 heads of state and government will meet
the emergency talks follow a request for a summit from British Prime Minister David Cameron and French President Nicolas Sarkozy, WHO in a joint statement dubbed Kadhafi's brutality as "Totally Unacceptable" and urged fresh options "for Increasing pressure on the regime."
This statement above, by these shameful Rascals, is way beyond what the term Hypocrisy could even reasonably accommodate or describe.
Seems like to me they are ready to do what ever it takes to co-opt this ‘gap “ of a ‘freedom movement” they themselves instigated,,...
seeing how the Colonel was not at all too easy to intimidate , nor did he cave in and cut loose and run ;) ..[/size]
More evil/disguised/misleading/ rhetoric
By setting democracy and freedom Against all forms of Dictatorship, These revolutions open a new era,"
"We Should Have one goal: to help These People Who Have Chosen to be free"
:lol: Oh..why,dear me, do I hear the opposite of this positive sounding message,by these two.. lol :lol:
what I hear is .... like as if they are really saying, ...lol... we must do all we can that these folks do not actually get the crazy idea,nor possibly think they could ever actually be FREEEE of US. :lol: .
[attachment=0:1euuas0k]AngelicColonizationManson note the
shining in the eyes.jpg[/attachment:1euuas0k]
everlastinglove_MJ » Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:53 am
I try to be selective in searching for first hand reports from sincere sources like i.e. http://www.realclearworld.com (http://www.realclearworld.com) and Reuters, and not only concerning this matter.
Thanks for the link..I will check them out do you have any more trustworthy ones? . :)
Yes, I’m afraid that the statement “humanitarian” intervention will be used as an excuse by the US and NATO to justify their intervention acts in Libya.
Yeah, the problem there also is, that Libya is not poor and really does not need ""humanitarian aid.
Mr Gadhafi has already said as much in his speech saying Libya is not DARFUR or SOMALIA...we have plenty of supplies etc etc....
The Colonel said:
"anyone who says otherwise is a liar, and is intent to open the doors to western colonialism".
In fact he said, he went as far as to claim, that he would consider it treason, for anyone to claim that Libya which gives foreign aid to other African and South American Countries is now in need of “humanitarian aid”
, and this would include the east of Libya as well, where there is the most of OIL concentration, where the “free folks are now setting up their new "government" , provided that his forces do not retake it soon .
Note: Pro Gadhafi forces are making a more than clear advance to the east, while I did not hear anything of anyone of the "revolutionary heroes" making advance to Tripoli to “liberate" it :roll:
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everlastinglove_MJ » Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:53 am
I try to be selective in searching for first hand reports from sincere sources like i.e. http://www.realclearworld.com (http://www.realclearworld.com) and Reuters, and not only concerning this matter.
Supervision wrote:
Thanks for the link..I will check them out do you have any more trustworthy ones? .
I must say, I assume the sources are trustworthy and unbiased. We never know for sure. Just think about it, when people are becoming more critical and more aware of the news (at least I hope so!) and search more selective on internet, I expect there will be a hype and overflow of independent sources. These sources claim to be unbiased and independent, but who’ll be the judge of that?
Some links, which I think they are trustworthy. Of course there must be much more..
http://www.projectcensored.org/censorship/news-sources/ (http://www.projectcensored.org/censorship/news-sources/)
http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?cont ... Name=about (http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=section§ionName=about)
http://www.alternet.org/ (http://www.alternet.org/)
http://ipsnews.net/headlines.asp (http://ipsnews.net/headlines.asp)
http://www.moderateindependent.com/index.htm (http://www.moderateindependent.com/index.htm)
http://www.independent.co.uk/ (http://www.independent.co.uk/)
http://english.aljazeera.net/ (http://english.aljazeera.net/)
http://therealnews.com/t2/ (http://therealnews.com/t2/)
http://www.indymedia.org/en/index.shtml (http://www.indymedia.org/en/index.shtml)
http://wn.com/ (http://wn.com/)
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On February 25, writer Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya, a Middle East/Central Asian specialist, based on reliable in-country contacts, headlined an important article, : Is Washington Pushing for Civil War to Justify a US-NATO Military Intervention?”
This has been in the back of my head as well.
Gadaffi is an eccentric dictator, very charismatic (I mean, have you seen his nice looking all fixed up body guards? :lol: I admire this guy, he has humor beyond everything) and I think he got lost within his power. Looks like he feels betrayed from his people but at the same time his people feel betrayed by him. Who will benefit at the end? NON imo. Another "power" is going to take over and explote the resources---->$$$.
Look at Iraq, it is a pure example of "how to get rid of a dictator" and many private companies signing in just to "help rebuilt the country", yeah...sure :roll: plus, imo, Iraq was also a sign of how the extreme muslims know how to press the right buttons to spread over their views by effectively shaking the infrastructures.
It is lke a chain effect. If one shouts for no reason, the rest will also shout not knowing the reason either, but the shouts happen leading to excitement leading to revolution but do they know what for? Who is pulling the strings?
This is just a bunch of opinions of mine, may be with no sense at all, so please, humor me ;) I feel swallen today :lol: :lol:
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The more I've listened / read the mainstream news, with all the repetitive rant of how crazy Gadaffi is, the more clear it is that we're only presented one side of the coin.
True, I know in general the mainstream news isn’t exactly moderate, with the natural reaction that I choose to believe the opposite to nuance it a bit, call it an act of contrariness in order to achieve balance. The best thing is to find and read unbiased and independent news with an equal view on both sides of the coin, which isn’t easy, it's a challenge though :)
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by Sarahli » Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:37 am
In time of war or revolution the first victim seems to be the truth.
Sarahi..a few notes on Libya's economy, since you were asking about Gadhafi's leadership ability etc.
emerging markets; libya; gadaffi; frontier markets | oil
Libya has debt levels to die for and huge amounts of oil,
Robert Tashima, an editor for Oxford Business Group, highlighted the country’s “elephantine” levels of FX reserves, and the privatisation of 80 companies so far, with telecoms and steel sales slated for this year.
Rory Fyfe, an economist with the Economist Intelligence Unit, said he expected the country’s budget to remain in surplus and inflation under control, and pointed to high levels of non-oil growth
,
Charles Gurdon, managing director of Menas Associates, said in his presentation on politics..
that the lack of a designated successor to Muammar Gaddafi, who has led Libya for over 40 years, could lead to violence.
re: your quote about the truth being sacrificed.
a write up, below, all are invited to read if interested:
(long article :roll: but worth reading, imo. ;) )
LIBIA: I funzionari russi chiamano le pretese della NATO un mucchio di bugie.
post pubblicato in damnatio memoriae, il 4 marzo 2011
Libya: Is the West lying again?
02.03.2011
Where is the evidence of the air strikes ordered by Colonel Gathafi against his "unarmed" civilians?
Is this yet another contrived pretext for the USA and its sycophantic allies in NATO to start an invasion?
Why is NATO speaking about enforcing a no-fly zone?
Who started the conflict in the first place?
Russian officials call the NATO claims a bunch of lies.
Let us be perfectly honest here. We are not dealing with well-meaning countries whose own history is flawless.
We are dealing, in many cases, with former imperialist powers which committed massacres, rode roughshod over peoples and laws and lores and cultures and imposed their own will by invading other territories, drawing lines on maps and "civilizing" vast swathes of the world with the Bible and the bullet. What a legacy.
We are dealing with those who launched a savage and illegal attack against Iraq, outside the auspices of the United Nations Organization,
we are dealing with those who lied through their teeth that Saddam Hussein was developing nuclear weaponry because he bought yellowcake uranium from Nigeria (when in fact the country producing it is Niger), an accusation refuted categorically by Mohamed El-Baradei of the International Atomic Energy Agency.
We are dealing with those who insulted Kofi Annan's UNO and his weapons inspectors in Iraq, who failed to find any evidence of an "immediate" threat to the USA and its allies,
we are dealing with those whose foreign ministers/secretaries of state claimed that Iraq had WMD, and that they knew where they were.
·
We are dealing with those who forged a causus belli based upon lies, fabrications and manipulation, cajoling, bullying and blackmail, those who stated that Saddam's WMD was "in Bagdad and Tikrit and north, south, east and west of there" (Rumsfeld),
with those whose officials had received shopping lists from Baghdad's museums already before the invasion,
those who deployed military hardware against civilian structures and then doled out billionaire reconstruction contracts - without tender - to White House cronies.
We are dealing with those who committed war crimes in Kosovo, in Afghanistan and in Iraq, all in the last decade, not to mention a myriad of other countries beforehand.
I.e. The GADHAFI REFERRAL for prosecution as a war criminal etc..
Nobody has yet referred for persecution who is responsible for dropping cluster bombs on civilians, nobody has yet referred who is responsible for acts of torture, illegal detention, strafing wedding parties with rockets, deploying Depleted Uranium against civilians, or indeed phosphorous attacks on schools, to the Hague War Crimes Tribunal, or International Criminal Court, as it is called –
the one that ordered the kidnapping and illegal detention of Slobodan Milosevic before he died in its custody,
God alone knows how.
So now the same clique of warmongers, whose foreign offices and military have been involved in wars ,since time immemorial, accuse Colonel Muammar Gathafi of war crimes, namely bombing his own people with aviation.
Russian officials call these claims a bunch of lies. Russia Today correspondent Irina Galusho interviewed members of Russia's Joint Chiefs of Staff, who claimed "Some of the reports made by western media are not entirely corresponding to the pictures they are getting"
Where are the air strikes, for example, registered by the BBC and Al Jazeera, on February 22, on Benghazi?
The Libyan government has ordered its aviation to strike against arms depots to stop them falling into the hands of the rebels (not unarmed civilians, but terrorists) since then, but the initial statement that the Government was using air strikes against "protesters" fails to produce any evidence. Basically because there isn't any.
And for those who made such claims, in the media and in governments?
Where is the accountability?
These politicians lie and remain in office?
These journalists fabricate evidence and continue to work as if nothing had happened?
Perhaps Colonel Gaddafy should have ordered attacks by predator drones against the civilians, then he may have won a Nobel Peace Prize, like President Obama.
Maybe he should have enticed them into a football match, like the British Black and Tans did with the Irish, and then mown them down with machine guns.
Or how about a Lynndie England style "just having fun" medieval torture chamber, à la Abu Ghraib?
In short, the West is once again fabricating evidence, lying and manipulating the media, as it did in the Balkans, when an absurd image was shown of Bosnian "refugees" in a Serbian "concentration camp", when in fact the images were taken from within a barbed wire perimeter to protect Serbs against marauding terrorists... and as it has done so many times.
Time for the circus to move on, starting with Libya and ending with Iran.
After all, Hillary Clinton represents what?
The will of the people of the United States of America, or AIPAC (American Israel Public Affairs Committee)?
Amid the hype, from the bought western media, no reference to the great contribution Colonel Gadhafi has made, namely in helping to free countless peoples from the yolk of colonialism - without any personal gain,
i.e. Colonel Gadhafi , a real freedom fighter - no reference to the fact that Libya has the greatest Human Development Index in Africa.
Some dictator, eh
?
No mention of the fact that Gadhafi wrote the Green Book, expounding the Third Way of economic theory, and that he has implemented its teachings in Libya, namely the government of Libya by the Libyan people
..
.the quality of life for Libyan is over a hundred times better than it was when he took over in 1969, when he instilled a policy of control of Libyan resources by Libyans for Libyans, then literacy rates rose from 10 to 90 per cent.
Is this a dictator?
Is he any more tyrannical than others who control countries in the Middle East?
And that goes for the behaviour of the USA as well in Iraq...
Timothy Bancroft-Hinchey
Pravda.Ru
http://criticatestuale.ilcannocchiale.i ... chiam.html (http://criticatestuale.ilcannocchiale.it/2011/03/04/libia_i_funzionari_russi_chiam.html)
@by everlastinglove_
thanks for the links, I will check out some of them, but Al Jezeera..has got to be one of the worst Liars on God’s green earth . :lol: .
:lol:
Shame that the Arabs would do this to each other,(Libyan report?), that station is Qatar /Saudi owned and not much more than a propaganda machine for its owners basically the same as all other mainstream media? :roll: .
Also note the link of the above article,if you are interested, seems to carry alternative views, compared to the corporate mouths, like Fox CNN BBC Reuters et.al...
Peace
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by Sarahli » Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:37 am
In time of war or revolution the first victim seems to be the truth.
Sarahi..a few notes on Libya's economy, since you were asking about Gadhafi's leadership ability etc.
emerging markets; libya; gadaffi; frontier markets | oil
Libya has debt levels to die for and huge amounts of oil,
Robert Tashima, an editor for Oxford Business Group, highlighted the country’s “elephantine” levels of FX reserves, and the privatisation of 80 companies so far, with telecoms and steel sales slated for this year.
Rory Fyfe, an economist with the Economist Intelligence Unit, said he expected the country’s budget to remain in surplus and inflation under control, and pointed to high levels of non-oil growth
,
Charles Gurdon, managing director of Menas Associates, said in his presentation on politics..
that the lack of a designated successor to Muammar Gaddafi, who has led Libya for over 40 years, could lead to violence.
re: your quote about the truth being sacrificed.
a write up, below, all are invited to read if interested:
(long article :roll: but worth reading, imo. ;) )
LIBIA: I funzionari russi chiamano le pretese della NATO un mucchio di bugie.
post pubblicato in damnatio memoriae, il 4 marzo 2011
Libya: Is the West lying again?
02.03.2011
Where is the evidence of the air strikes ordered by Colonel Gathafi against his "unarmed" civilians?
Is this yet another contrived pretext for the USA and its sycophantic allies in NATO to start an invasion?
Why is NATO speaking about enforcing a no-fly zone?
Who started the conflict in the first place?
Russian officials call the NATO claims a bunch of lies.
[attachment=0:f58ai3f5]10nf407.jpg[/attachment:f58ai3f5]
Let us be perfectly honest here. We are not dealing with well-meaning countries whose own history is flawless.
We are dealing, in many cases, with former imperialist powers which committed massacres, rode roughshod over peoples and laws and lores and cultures and imposed their own will by invading other territories, drawing lines on maps and "civilizing" vast swathes of the world with the Bible and the bullet. What a legacy.
We are dealing with those who launched a savage and illegal attack against Iraq, outside the auspices of the United Nations Organization,
we are dealing with those who lied through their teeth that Saddam Hussein was developing nuclear weaponry because he bought yellowcake uranium from Nigeria (when in fact the country producing it is Niger), an accusation refuted categorically by Mohamed El-Baradei of the International Atomic Energy Agency.
We are dealing with those who insulted Kofi Annan's UNO and his weapons inspectors in Iraq, who failed to find any evidence of an "immediate" threat to the USA and its allies,
we are dealing with those whose foreign ministers/secretaries of state claimed that Iraq had WMD, and that they knew where they were.
·
We are dealing with those who forged a causus belli based upon lies, fabrications and manipulation, cajoling, bullying and blackmail, those who stated that Saddam's WMD was "in Bagdad and Tikrit and north, south, east and west of there" (Rumsfeld),
with those whose officials had received shopping lists from Baghdad's museums already before the invasion,
those who deployed military hardware against civilian structures and then doled out billionaire reconstruction contracts - without tender - to White House cronies.
We are dealing with those who committed war crimes in Kosovo, in Afghanistan and in Iraq, all in the last decade, not to mention a myriad of other countries beforehand.
I.e. The GADHAFI REFERRAL for prosecution as a war criminal etc..
Nobody has yet referred for persecution who is responsible for dropping cluster bombs on civilians, nobody has yet referred who is responsible for acts of torture, illegal detention, strafing wedding parties with rockets, deploying Depleted Uranium against civilians, or indeed phosphorous attacks on schools, to the Hague War Crimes Tribunal, or International Criminal Court, as it is called –
the one that ordered the kidnapping and illegal detention of Slobodan Milosevic before he died in its custody,
God alone knows how.
So now the same clique of warmongers, whose foreign offices and military have been involved in wars ,since time immemorial, accuse Colonel Muammar Gathafi of war crimes, namely bombing his own people with aviation.
Russian officials call these claims a bunch of lies. Russia Today correspondent Irina Galusho interviewed members of Russia's Joint Chiefs of Staff, who claimed "Some of the reports made by western media are not entirely corresponding to the pictures they are getting"
Where are the air strikes, for example, registered by the BBC and Al Jazeera, on February 22, on Benghazi?
The Libyan government has ordered its aviation to strike against arms depots to stop them falling into the hands of the rebels (not unarmed civilians, but terrorists) since then, but the initial statement that the Government was using air strikes against "protesters" fails to produce any evidence. Basically because there isn't any.
And for those who made such claims, in the media and in governments?
Where is the accountability?
These politicians lie and remain in office?
These journalists fabricate evidence and continue to work as if nothing had happened?
Perhaps Colonel Gaddafy should have ordered attacks by predator drones against the civilians, then he may have won a Nobel Peace Prize, like President Obama.
Maybe he should have enticed them into a football match, like the British Black and Tans did with the Irish, and then mown them down with machine guns.
Or how about a Lynndie England style "just having fun" medieval torture chamber, à la Abu Ghraib?
In short, the West is once again fabricating evidence, lying and manipulating the media, as it did in the Balkans, when an absurd image was shown of Bosnian "refugees" in a Serbian "concentration camp", when in fact the images were taken from within a barbed wire perimeter to protect Serbs against marauding terrorists... and as it has done so many times.
Time for the circus to move on, starting with Libya and ending with Iran.
After all, Hillary Clinton represents what?
The will of the people of the United States of America, or AIPAC (American Israel Public Affairs Committee)?
Amid the hype, from the bought western media, no reference to the great contribution Colonel Gadhafi has made, namely in helping to free countless peoples from the yolk of colonialism - without any personal gain,
i.e. Colonel Gadhafi , a real freedom fighter - no reference to the fact that Libya has the greatest Human Development Index in Africa.
Some dictator, eh
?
No mention of the fact that Gadhafi wrote the Green Book, expounding the Third Way of economic theory, and that he has implemented its teachings in Libya, namely the government of Libya by the Libyan people
..
.the quality of life for Libyan is over a hundred times better than it was when he took over in 1969, when he instilled a policy of control of Libyan resources by Libyans for Libyans, then literacy rates rose from 10 to 90 per cent.
Is this a dictator?
Is he any more tyrannical than others who control countries in the Middle East?
And that goes for the behaviour of the USA as well in Iraq...
Timothy Bancroft-Hinchey
Pravda.Ru
http://criticatestuale.ilcannocchiale.i ... chiam.html (http://criticatestuale.ilcannocchiale.it/2011/03/04/libia_i_funzionari_russi_chiam.html)
@by everlastinglove_
thanks for the links, I will check out some of them, but Al Jezeera..has got to be one of the worst Liars on God’s green earth . :lol: .
:lol:
Shame that the Arabs would do this to each other,(Libyan report?), that station is Qatar /Saudi owned and not much more than a propaganda machine for its owners basically the same as all other mainstream media? :roll: .
Also note the link of the above article,if you are interested, seems to carry alternative views, compared to the corporate mouths, like Fox CNN BBC Reuters et.al...
Peace
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by Gema » Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:37 am
It is lke a chain effect. If one shouts for no reason, the rest will also shout not knowing the reason either, but the shouts happen leading to excitement leading to revolution but do they know what for?
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Who is pulling the strings?
Good question.
Gadaffi is an eccentric dictator, very charismatic (I mean, have you seen his nice looking all fixed up body guards? I admire this guy, he has humor beyond everything) and I think he got lost within his power.
:lol: He did not get lost Gema..they are just trying to put him out to pasture, and the old goat is refusing to go :lol:
Looks like he feels betrayed from his people but at the same time his people feel betrayed by him.
No, the pic is, that Libya is a tribal country ,over 140 different tribes are in Libya,
here is a link an excerpt that gives a clearer pic , if you wish to know more about this Man and his country /people..etc
http://mercurymail.blogspot.com/ (http://mercurymail.blogspot.com/)
Make up your own Mind
Libya and the Colnel:
When Gaddaffi took power he took over a non-country with a large number of tribes composed of a small population on a tremendously big area.
The country was ruled by a king who took the oil revenue as his private income as it was the use amongst the bedu tribes, the chief took all.
Gaddaffi was a very poor boy with a brilliant mind, born in Sirte and his local teachers advised his father to send him to a better school.
His father didn’t have the money and sent Gaddaffi, aged 11/12 on a 250 km donkey trip through the desert from Sirte to an uncle, a chieftain in Misurata. The boy went to school and continued to the military academy.
After he graduated he was confronted with a hopelessly divided extremely poor non-country under the rule of king Idriss.
Idriss was of Cyrenaica origin and a religious leader of the Senussi, a sufi sect. He was born at Al-Jaghbub, near the Egyptian border.
He became the Emir of Cyrenaica with the approval of the Britiish after WWII
When the British made him Emir of Tripolitana he could become king of Libya, with British approval.
This was one more idiotic British decision. Joining Cyrenaica(Benghazi area) with Tripolitana(Sirte and Tripoli area) under a Cyrenaica king was a disaster waiting to happen.
The oil was originally found exclusively in Sirte Basin and the Tripolitana tribes saw their riches disappear in a Cyrenaica pocket, literally, the country got nothing.
When Gaddaffi graduated the country was extremely poor and the oil exploitation was in the hands of American and British companies, which paid royalties to Idriss.
Agriculture, Libya has about 500.000 sq. km. rich agricultural land, was in the hands of Italian families, who had fled during the war but were still owners-in-absentia.
After Gaddaffi took power he invited the Italian families and arranged a payment for the Libyan State to aquire the property.
The biggest property, Al Khadra, was an olive plantation, started by the Italians in the 1930’s and probably one of the biggest and best in the world.
Today, after many pieces of the plantation were developed for modern construction projects, the remaining plantation is still covering 40.000 hectares with 6 milliom olive trees. It has natural irrigation by 6 months rain each year.
Gaddaffi went with 3 Willy’s jeeps to the old palace of the king, who was for medical treatment in Turkey, and took over the country.
He declared immediately that the oil and the riches of the country belonged to all Libyans and reinforced the power of the tribal chiefs.
The old tribal customs were respected and every Libyan, respected as an honest man in his own tribe, could at any time go to his tribal chief for his requests, problems or justice.
This was of course a Libya for the Libyans system.
It has been said that Libya followed the Marxist system of the Soviet Union.
Here you have a young officer,with absolutely no friend in the world, hated by the biggest corporations in the world, which were told to leave the country and the oilfields, and he has no clue what a modern society or country looks like, nor how the Western democracies function.
All he knows about Western democracies is the Italian colonialism, the German and British warfare on Libyan soil and the Libyan deaths it all created.
Talk about values? What values? Exploitation and warfare.
On the other hand the Russians offer a hand in the construction of his country and they are introduced by an Arab hero: Nasser from Egypt.
Of course he accepted Russian help and advise, of course he went his own socialist ways, equality and freedom for all, no kings, the people are sovereign, poor people are having finally a voice.
So Gaddaffi accepted Russian help and advise, and created his own socialist muslim brand.
The only people who were not satisfied were the people from Benghazi, Tobruk and the Egyptians who lost all privileges, Idriss significantly had fled to Egypt and lived in a Cairo luxury home until his death at the age of 93.
Gaddaffi made sure that all Libyans were treated equally and he made it a point of honor that each and every Libyan had direct access to him in case of abuse of power by any other authority.
In the beginning he took tea in the small tea-houses in Tripoli or Sirte together with the common people until the assassination attempts started, all coming from Benghazi and/or Egypt.
He slept in army barracks and had no home of its own
.
The Chief of Air Staff told me the story that one day he came in his room and found the body of a soldier, wrapped in a blanket on the concrete floor, next to his bed.
He kicked the soldier to wake him up and move so that he could go to bed himself, and Gaddaffi unwrapped himself out of the blanket.
The Chief of Air Staff apologized profusely but Gaddaffi told him to shut up, that it was his fault and he apologized to the Chief for using his room.
When the assassination attempts started he constructed himself a fortress in Tripoli, but spent most of his time in a tent in the dessert, moving all the time.
When the Americans bombed his fortress he was in a tent in the dessert
.
Gaddaffi knew that he had a tribal patchwork which had disaster incorporated in it, aggravated by the Beduïn character of the people.
When a Beduin meets another Beduin for the first time they will identify themselves first through the tribe, then the family and afterwards they will look for mutual relations.
This can last normally half an hour :roll:
. After that they will decide if it’s worth continuing talking or not.
A foreigner like me is identified through his Libyan friends. If there are absolutely no connections between the two it’s better not to continue, there will be no trust until such time that there is a connection somewhere.
State structure
Gaddaffi made following structure:
- Every tribe has its own tribe council and tribal representatives who represent the tribal council
- The tribal council representatives are seated in the Revolutionary Council(the Libyan type parliament), which takes all decisions.
- Moammar Gaddaffi is the brother leader who takes and gives advice to the Revolutionary Council.
- We know what that means, but it is true that all projects, claims and complaints are really discussed by that Revolutionary council and Gaddaffi is no fool, he knows when something is false or true, he takes serious notice of everything which is happening in his country at grass-roots level.
- On television, during hours of speeches he really tells his people the truth, he really talks to them like a father and admonishes them.
- Further every province has a local governor-administrator, mostly a very honest old guard general.
The ones I met are normally clad the poorest of the delegation with old battle dresses and open sandals of rough leather.
They are simple Bedu’s who command very serious budgets. (Billions.$$$$$$$$$$$. ;)
read more on link..
http://mercurymail.blogspot.com/ (http://mercurymail.blogspot.com/)
Who will benefit at the end? NON imo. Another "power" is going to take over and explote the resources---->$$$
.
Exactly. That is why,imo. the colonel would be their best bet for now, until they take their time and organize their system for transmission of power , constitution/ laws etc.
Look at Iraq, it is a pure example of "how to get rid of a dictator" and many private companies signing in just to "help rebuilt the country", yeah...sure
Iraq was an outright invasion by the west, you know, for the oil, and to carry more influence in the area as well,protection of Israel is a paramount concern as well.Plus the threat of IRAN etc.
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Gema wrote:
This is just a bunch of opinions of mine, may be with no sense at all, so please, humor me I feel swallen today
well read more on link... re: about the Gadhafi family, the sons and the Lawyer daughter etc .....
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/artic ... -1,00.html (http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,868168-1,00.html)
http://annalsofunsolvedcrimes.blogspot. ... attei.html (http://annalsofunsolvedcrimes.blogspot.com/2010/06/curious-death-of-enrico-mattei.html)
Peace.
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thanks for the links, I will check out some of them, but Al Jezeera..has got to be one of the worst Liars on God’s green earth . .
:lol: just checking, I knew that you would react like this...you're pretty predictable :lol:
No seriously, you wrote "has got to be one of the worst Liars". Although Jazeera's independence has been tested and doubted according to the next article, AJ is still considered as an independent source. Of course it's up to you to consider it as reliable or not.
http://newamericamedia.org/2010/12/wiki ... s-heel.php (http://newamericamedia.org/2010/12/wikileaks-exposes-al-jazeera-achilles-heel.php)
In October, Al Jazeera played a leading role in examining a huge trove of classified American documents released through WikiLeaks. It brought to light important revelations on a wide range of topics, including the killings of hundreds of civilians at coalition roadblocks and the U.S role in Iraqi state torture.
This time, however, as WikiLeaks released more than 250,000 U.S. diplomatic cables extending from the mid-1960s to the present day, Al Jazeera has opted for the back seat.
Its coverage of what the Italian foreign minister called “9/11 of diplomacy” for the most part has been shallow, sometimes based on translated and paraphrased articles from the New York Times and the Los Angles Times — for a very good reason.
This time the subject of the embarrassing leaks involves not only the United States, but also the leaders of Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC) states, including Qatar, Bahrain, Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Oman, and Kuwait.
The leaked U.S. diplomatic cables have shown that Qatar shares the other GCC states’ view that Iran is the primary threat, not Israel.
This is completely contradictory to what the ruling family in Qatar has been saying in public. It is also contrary to Al Jazeera’s own coverage, which presents Israel as the primary threat, not Iran. In fact, Qatar probably boasts the closest ties with Iran of all the GCC states.
Now, the leaked U.S. cables expose Muslim countries backstabbing another Muslim country. That is one of the ugliest acts a Muslim can perform. The Prophet Muhammad, in fact, compared it to “eating the flesh of one’s own dead brother.”
Al Jazeera tried to mitigate the embarrassment by singling out the roles of Saudi Arabia and Bahrain, saying that the two kingdoms strongly urged the United States to strike Iranian military facilities, contrary to what those countries have been saying in public. Al Jazeera conveniently attributed the information to a Los Angles Times article.
What Al Jazeera totally ignored, however, was the role that Qatar played in highlighting the Iranian threat against the United States.
According to one of the leaked U.S. diplomatic cables, the Qatari Emir Hamad bin Khalifa al-Thani told Sen. John Kerry (D-Mass.) last February that, based on 30 years of experience, (to paraphrase) the Iranians will give you 100 words but you should trust only one of them.
The Qatari Prime Minister Hamad Al Thani also told Kerry that Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad had told him: "We beat the Americans in Iraq; the final battle will be in Iran."
Assad Abukhalil, professor of political science at California State University, Stanislaus, who has appeared numerous times on Al Jazeera, strongly criticized the network on the radio show Democracy Now.
During the interview, he said: “I think the extent to which the Saudi government—and all Arab governments in the Gulf—are embarrassed by these leaks is evidenced by the clampdown that is being exhibited throughout the Saudi-controlled Arab media. And even the so-called 'independent' Al Jazeera— which, contrary to its reputation here in the West, is the most serious news organization—is also trying to cover up the embarrassing revelations about the way Arab governments operate vis-à-vis the United States.”
Al Jazeera television not only found itself in an awkward position because its “independence” was tested, but also because the leaked cables raised an important question about its coverage of Iranian affairs, which tends to be more positive than that of other Arab television networks.
For example, Al Jazeera often assiduously covers Israeli violations against Palestinians as well as U.S. violations in Afghanistan and Iraq, while ignoring Iranian violations against Arabs such as the oppression of Arabs in the Iranian province of Khuzestan, bordering the Iraqi province of Basra, and the occupation of the three UAE islands of Abu Masa, Greater Tunb, and Lesser Tunb.
This helps Iran improve its image among Arabs and distracts them from the growing Iranian influence in the oil-rich region in southern Iraq. Iran’s support for the war in Iraq and Afghanistan is also ignored by Al Jazeera.
The question is: Why does Al Jazeera make Iran look good despite the mistrust between the two neighboring countries, Qatar and Iran?
Qatar shares several offshore gas fields with Iran,including al-Shaheen and South Pars, which makes it extremely important to have good relations with its strong neighbor. In fact, Qatar’s livelihood as a nation depends on its good relations with Iran.
"Iran, if it wanted to, could click its fingers and sever Qatar's money,” David Roberts, a doctoral candidate in Qatari foreign policy at Durham University in England, wrote on The Gulf Blog.
However, Qatar also uses U.S. military presence on its territory to deter any possible Iranian infringement on the shared offshore oil fields. According to secret diplomatic cables published by WikiLeaks, “Qatar agreed to pay 60 percent of the upkeep costs for the Al-Udeid airbase, which has already been used by the U.S. military to launch air sorties in Iraq.” It agreed to support its use against Iran as long as the South Par natural gas fields were not threatened.
Qatar’s willingness to host the largest U.S. military base in the Middle East is, in effect, a diplomatic balancing act against the threat of Iran.
According to the Israeli newspaper Haaretz, a WikiLeaks document quoted Mossad chief Meir Dagan saying to American diplomats, "I think that you should remove your bases from [Qatar]…[The Qataris] owe their security to the presence of the Americans]."
Arguably, Al Jazeera’s coverage of the war in Iraq and Afghanistan as well as the Palestinian-Israeli conflict is still superior to that of all other Arab television networks, which explains why it’s still the most watched Arab news source. However, Al Jazeera’s failure to report on the recent U.S. leaked cables highlights its Achilles’ heel: the Qatari ruling family and its powerful neighbor, Iran.
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/02/10/26 ... zeera.html (http://www.kansascity.com/2011/02/10/2645214/todays-the-day-to-demand-al-jazeera.html)
http://www.allvoices.com/news/6014873-a ... d-coverage (http://www.allvoices.com/news/6014873-al-jazeeras-unbiased-coverage)
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Supervision wrote:
When the assassination attempts started he constructed himself a fortress in Tripoli, but spent most of his time in a tent in the dessert, moving all the time.
When the Americans bombed his fortress he was in a tent in the dessert
.
Gaddaffi knew that he had a tribal patchwork which had disaster incorporated in it, aggravated by the Beduïn character of the people.
When a Beduin meets another Beduin for the first time they will identify themselves first through the tribe, then the family and afterwards they will look for mutual relations.
As an open minded person, it's good to read the story behind the story. This background/profile info gives a better view on the man and his acts. Though he IS a dictator and I condemn his acts concerning human rights.
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Op-Ed: Something is going horribly wrong with news reporting from Libya
Massacres, tank battles, murderous bombings, we've seen a flood of news describing these and other events in Libya recently but even a cursory study of the content shows that it consists mostly of second or third-hand accounts which cannot be verified.
I have had an uneasy feeling about the coverage coming out of Libya ever since the fighting began in earnest two weeks ago. Much of it seems to lack solidity and substance and the modus operandi seems to be something between a mix of hyperbole, inappropriate descriptions and unverifiable sources to describe conflicting claims from both sides.
Today's coverage has followed this pattern and here is a look at what has been happening.
The Guardian reported this on its Libya Live feed at 2:53. “Reuters correspondent Mohammed Abbas is within sight of the battlefield in Ras Lanuf. He said: ‘There are lots of flames, thuds and bangs. There is the wailing of sirens and puffs of smoke in the air. More and more rebels with heavy artillery are streaming by to the front-line.’ One could be forgiven that Abbas was describing a WWII battle, complete with battalions of troops and artillery and a flak barrage targeting swarms of fighter planes. But he wasn’t. This was Libya, and he completed his dispatch with the rather more modest assertion that “ ...an anti-aircraft gun mounted on a truck and an anti-tank gun were the latest to go by.” There's a world of difference between the lead-in and the conclusion.
Reuters also filed this today. “rebels trying to retake Ras Lanuf have been firing their assault rifles at helicopters overhead which fired machine guns at the rebel positions.” Or at least that's what the rebels said had happened, because Reuters didn't actually see it. Other reports on that live feed include a claim that one of Gaddafi’s sons was leading an attack on a heavily-defended Zawiyah at the head of a “brigade” of troops. A "pitched battle" was said to be going on. And if one knows that a military brigade comprises anything between 4 and 12 thousand men, had this been the case we would have been seeing hundreds of casualties this evening. But we are not. Fighting was said to have gone on throughout last night too, but there were apparently “no casualties.” "Battles" are said to be "raging" in several places and "bombing raids" have also gone on apparently. I even read somewhere about "random bombardments."
Over in France at Le Figaro we learn that there have been "bombardments" over several days, and there is a video filmed by a French crew in which they interview rebels who have been combating Mig and Mirage fighter-bombers. Meanwhile, The Washington Post says that "Brega was hit Thursday by at least three powerful air-strikes" although the paper does not say where it got that information from. The New York Times quotes someone saying that there had been "a massacre."
France24 carries an interesting story which is also typical of what we've been seeing. The headline reads 'Air Force carries out fresh raids on rebel-held east'. Fine. Except that the reporter says in his video report that he is 'confirming' air raids which were related to him by a member of the site's personnel who had not seen them himself but had heard eye-witness reports from others! And, of course, there's "no damage" because the weapons are said to have fallen outside the compound. Not a bomb or missile crater was to be seen.
There are many other examples of this sort of reporting, which is almost entirely based on second or even third-hand accounts of alleged events which have rarely been filmed or photographed by anyone. One of the only videos I was able to find on the Internet with footage of a bombing was said to have been filmed by an Al-Jazeera crew, but it turns out that is the same one that is at the top of this page, which is by CNN and was brought to my attention by Digital Journal's David Silverberg. There is precious little evidence which bears out the rest of the reports and many of the stories have come to the press from Twitter, FaceBook or email sources which are impossible to verify. Yet they are published in their dozens. Total death tolls in Libya have been put at anything between just a few hundred according to the Libyan government and as many as 6000 by The Libyan Human Rights League.
But there is more than the credibility of press reports at stake here. Moreover, the world's press is hardly to blame for this state of affairs seeing as it has been put under a high degree of controlled surveillance by the regime and seems to be doing the best it can in very difficult circumstances. But because the press's freedom is being abused all we have is a kind of "it is reported that..." journalism which is helping to shape public opinion and even government policy.
How can we know if a no-fly zone should be declared or not, given the paucity of verifiable information? How do we know that our governments are making the right decisions based on corroborated versions of events? Should we trust most of these reports, most of which are either from Libyan rebel or government sources? Who are 'the rebels' exactly? And who are the mercenaries? I ask that last question because at the moment I am about to put this online the BBC quotes (at 18:31) Peter Bouckaert, emergencies director at Human Rights Watch, as saying that many of the claims [concerning their numbers and origin} have been overplayed and that ""Since the beginning, we have been investigating reports of African mercenaries and most of these reports have been untrue."
I simply don't know enough about what is going on in Libya to make up my mind about what should be done, but if you think you do I would be grateful if you could tell me below the comment line where you found the hard and corroborated facts which helped you decide, because I am still waiting to see them.
This opinion article was written by an independent writer. The opinions and views expressed herein are those of the author and are not necessarily intended to reflect those of DigitalJournal.com
Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/3 ... z1FjVhvNSX (http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/304281#ixzz1FjVhvNSX)
"Massacres, tank battles, murderous bombings, we've seen a flood of news describing these and other events in Libya recently but even a cursory study of the content shows that it consists mostly of second or third-hand accounts which cannot be verified." ->which cannot be verified, so not reliable
"seems to be something between a mix of hyperbole, inappropriate descriptions and unverifiable sources to describe conflicting claims from both sides. -> does make you wonder what is REALLY happening there, doesn't it?
"There's a world of difference between the lead-in and the conclusion." -> very well described
claims [concerning their numbers and origin} have been overplayed and that ""Since the beginning, we have been investigating reports of African mercenaries and most of these reports have been untrue." :!:
I simply don't know enough about what is going on in Libya to make up my mind about what should be done -> :? same here
[youtube:1ar3sjrv]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yndS5VOWz7U[/youtube:1ar3sjrv]
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(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-lpZLrC7MvZE/TW1yPSWQEuI/AAAAAAAAHZg/hjGWn1IpIJ4/s400/03.jpg)
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(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-lpZLrC7MvZE/TW1yPSWQEuI/AAAAAAAAHZg/hjGWn1IpIJ4/s400/03.jpg)
That explains it all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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@supervision,
Regarding what lybia is, that is why i made the comment about "tribes fighting".
I read all the posts. To find some "truth" may be one should talk to a Lybian to see if this is really happening in the level is being promoted.
My gosh! a man burned himself in Tunisia and that lead to all this revolutions in a domino effect? :|
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by everlastinglove_MJ » Sat Mar 05, 2011 7:08 am
As an open minded person, it's good to read the story behind the story. This background/profile info gives a better view on the man and his acts. Though he IS a dictator and I condemn his acts concerning human rights.
Gema wrote:
@supervision,
Regarding what lybia is, that is why i made the comment about "tribes fighting".
To find some "truth" may be one should talk to a Lybian to see if this is really happening in the level is being promoted.
Sorry guys, Not much time to post a lengthy one as usual ..but pls check out this vid if you have not seen it, about how the Libyans are responding to this “dictator” who supposedly has violated their human rights...The news is obviously very biased.And the constant vilification of the Colonel,by the mainstream media, is really wearing too thin,and these folks read need a new writer or something to freshen up the same old lies and lines they told in IRAQ about SADDAM. :roll: imo.
in the vid , pls. check out the fact that these people in Libya , are quite far from poor and ragged like the rest of most African countries,
and......Basically they have even enjoy a higher standard of living than even some European countries. ;)
Raw Video: Gadhafi Supporters Pour Into Streets ..in YT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybHYjuFx ... r_embedded (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybHYjuFxd88&feature=player_embedded)
As for the “revolution” .
Comment:
This is a fake revolution. Every Libyan should think carefully and protect the country from its enemies. Libya will be the next Iraq if all Libyans dont stop and think as one. The West has already started stealing Libyan money. This is not a revolution. Wake up Libyan people.
..My take is, that the "revolution" may / has been heavily funded by some “folks” , who are intent on their aim to break up the country in two or more pieces,to better exploit it, and weaken it. Gadhafi is what is holding it all together and that is why they zero in on getting rid of him. And I think the Libyans know that too, and they have true love for their leader as he does love them too , (well, not the 'protesters" obviously.. :lol: )
That is what I understand about this issue so far, plus the grudge of the King Idris tribe (east Libya), though Gadhafi’s wife herself, his childrens mother, is from Baida , from the east.
Talk to you guys later...nice posts , but ,I really have to go back an reread later.
one thing though,before I go, the way the British officers got “caught” got me wondering wht the heck is going on over there in "the new Libyan provisional gov" ..the one that the rebels set up, with so much a hurry, with the defector Justice Min sister no less, who was just with the Colonel two weeks ago, (a real shameful clown of a character, if you ask me :lol: )
.well, anyway, .hmmmm..I am thinking hard, lol never ever trust a Brit to save YOUR LIFE :lol:
. . .
Sooo, the British officers(special forces)
The Rebels got them and under custody, and they say, they only just went to Bengazi just to talk to the opposition,to ask them what they wanted.. :? ?
I smell a big , big rat. ;) [/b] :lol:
British special forces. Hmmmmm...wonders never cease.
well check out the vid .. and see ya later...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybHYjuFx ... r_embedded (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybHYjuFxd88&feature=player_embedded)
Peace
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As for the “revolution” .
Comment:
This is a fake revolution. Every Libyan should think carefully and protect the country from its enemies. Libya will be the next Iraq if all Libyans dont stop and think as one. The West has already started stealing Libyan money. This is not a revolution. Wake up Libyan people.
My money is on that there will be an intervention.
I'm in the midst of reading the book "The Shock Doctrine: the Rise of Disaster Capitalism" by Naomi Klein. A very interesting read itself, but she has quoted another writer, Stephen Kinzer and his book "Overthrow". Can't quote either book here directly, but I found an interview where Kinzer explaines the same thing. It is quite interesting now that we're all looking at Libya:
"...Guernica: Your book traces a long tradition of preemptive regime change in United States foreign policy. Is there much difference between what we've seen in Iraq and the thirteen prior examples you examine in your book?
Stephen Kinzer: In telling the story of each of these 14 times that the U.S. overthrew a foreign government, I asked three questions about each episode. First, what happened? How did we overthrow the government of this country? Secondly, why did we do it? And third, from the perspective of history and from the perspective of today, what has been the long-term effect of these interventions? I studied these overthrows of foreign governments not as isolated unrelated incidents but as part of a long continuum. By doing that, you begin to pick out certain patterns. You also begin to realize that it's wrong to think of our invasion of Iraq as a great departure in American history.
Guernica: Tell me about that pattern. For instance, who are some of the recurring players?
Stephen Kinzer: The first thing that happens is a foreign government begins to bother or harass or restrict or regulate or nationalize some big foreign company. Usually, an American company. That's what starts the trouble. If governments do not become nationalist and do not try to control their own natural resources, they do not even come into the crosshairs of American leaders. The directors of these companies, outraged at attempts of some foreign government to regulate them, come to the White House and complain. That's the first phase.
The second phase is what happens to the intervention process while it's in the White House. American leaders do not intervene in foreign countries in order to protect foreign companies. They transform the motivation from an economic one to one that they call "political" or "geo-strategic." They allow themselves to become convinced that any government that would be bothering, harassing, restricting or taxing an American company must be anti-American, anti-capitalist, evil, repressive, and probably the tool of some outside interest that's trying to subvert American power in the world. That's the way the motivation morphs in the political process.
It then morphs one more time when American leaders have to explain to American citizens and others around the world why we carried out a particular intervention. At that point, we usually do not use the economic, or even the political, motivations to explain our actions. Instead, we say that we are intervening out of charity—that we are doing it to help an oppressed people who are being brutalized by an evil regime. This rationale works very well in the United States for two reasons. First of all, because Americans are compassionate people. We truly hate the idea that people in other areas are suffering. We want to help them. And, the second aspect of our character that allows us to embrace this argument is that we're actually very innocent and naive and, in many cases, ignorant about history and culture. This leads us to believe that anything we want to do is also possible. Generations of American leaders have played on this sense of American exceptionalism—the sense that the United States has a gift to give to the rest of the world in order to justify interventions abroad that have actually been planned for very different reasons. "
(http://www.guernicamag.com/interviews/2 ... egime_cha/ (http://www.guernicamag.com/interviews/298/americas_century_of_regime_cha/))
Brings some interesting perspective to the current situation.
Someone here wrote that there's been western business in Libya - could there be phase one as explained above that triggered this?
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Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?
Matthew 7,3
http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1926917
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Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?
Matthew 7,3
http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1926917
Thanks for the link with love from the 156 countries. LOVE from everyone to everyone without judgments upon others, united in one message, that's how it should be.
Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?
Matthew 7,3
As a reaction to your quote I found http://www.scripturestudies.com/Vol6/F5/f5_nt.html (http://www.scripturestudies.com/Vol6/F5/f5_nt.html)
Great care should be taken when passing judgment upon others. Jesus is telling us to look at our own lives first: "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, `Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye" (vss. 3-5). As Spurgeon comments: "The judging faculty is best employed at home."[2] Jesus here expresses the importance of clearness of vision when judging others. If there is a plank in your own eye, you may very well be mis-seeing the speck in your brother's. "Casting out the [plank] will make us more clear-sighted, more sympathetic, and more skillful, in casting out the [speck]."[3] And, note well, that Jesus does not say to ignore the speck in your brother's eye. He says "first" take the plank out of your own eye, "then" you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye. "The would-be helper's first priority must be to remove the obstacle to clearsightedness from his own eye. That done, he is equipped to bring aid to his brother. We should not overlook the point that the speck is to be removed... It is not unimportant that even this small defect be rectified."[4]
Jesus is telling us to look at our own lives first
look in the mirror
The would-be helper's first priority must be to remove the obstacle to clearsightedness from his own eye
Michael's quote: "If you wanna make the world a better place… Start with your mirror."
Wise words, sooo true.