Michael Jackson Death Hoax Investigators

General Discussion => General Discussion => The Great Reset, New World Order & Global Mind Control => Topic started by: ~Souza~ on May 23, 2012, 07:14:12 PM

Title: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 23, 2012, 07:14:12 PM
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There's a lot of areas of history that so many don't want to touch, taboo and politically sacred topics.  But who set up the taboos in the first place--right--them!
'Ant-semitism' is a sacred power word of their creation for their protection, and it’s been very effective in silencing millions and creating fear. Many have gone to prison for this 'crime' of voicing other perspectives. Deep rabbit hole.

I'm sorry? I saw a thread on this forum a couple of days ago, people posted a racist website and an anti-Semitic Nazi website and were very upset about them, and now you are telling me that anti-Semitism doesn't really exist? And you defend David Icke? Why does he reference "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", which is an anti-Semitic forgery and was also used by Hitler and was taught in schools in Nazi Germany? Why does David Icke do that if he is not anti-Semitic? I'm quite surprised to see him being used as a positive source in this thread considering people got really upset (and rightly so) in the other thread about the 2 websites.

And what "areas of history that so many don't want to touch" do you mean? In the context of anti-Semitism I'm starting to wonder if this forum or people on the forum doubt or deny the Holocaust? That again would be a big surprise to me considering that this is a forum for MJ supporters and again also because of the criticism on here regarding the 2 websites.

No, no one is denying the holocaust as far as I know. I don't follow David Icke so I can't say anything about that. But I do know there are people calling themselves 'jew' and are making good use of the fear of people to say anything bad about jewish people because of what has been done to them in the war, to go on with their plans. My grandpa always said when I was younger and I asked him about the war, that the jews killed their own people and that always made me mad because that was not what I learned in school, until I jumped into that rabbit hole. I found out my grandfather might not be that crazy after all. It's not that I believe one story over the other or have one definite truth on that, but I did find out that there was more than what was being shown on the surface. But as said before, that's an extremely deep rabbit hole there and it might be better to continue a discussion about that in a new thread, if anyone wants to discuss it. I think there are already threads about this actually.

@MJonmind: correct me if that was not what you meant.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Andrea on May 23, 2012, 07:15:23 PM
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There's a lot of areas of history that so many don't want to touch, taboo and politically sacred topics.  But who set up the taboos in the first place--right--them!
'Ant-semitism' is a sacred power word of their creation for their protection, and it’s been very effective in silencing millions and creating fear. Many have gone to prison for this 'crime' of voicing other perspectives. Deep rabbit hole.

I'm sorry? I saw a thread on this forum a couple of days ago, people posted a racist website and an anti-Semitic Nazi website and were very upset about them, and now you are telling me that anti-Semitism doesn't really exist? And you defend David Icke? Why does he reference "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", which is an anti-Semitic forgery and was also used by Hitler and was taught in schools in Nazi Germany? Why does David Icke do that if he is not anti-Semitic? I'm quite surprised to see him being used as a positive source in this thread considering people got really upset (and rightly so) in the other thread about the 2 websites.

And what "areas of history that so many don't want to touch" do you mean? In the context of anti-Semitism I'm starting to wonder if this forum or people on the forum doubt or deny the Holocaust? That again would be a big surprise to me considering that this is a forum for MJ supporters and again also because of the criticism on here regarding the 2 websites.

She didn't say anti-Semitism doesn't exist.  It can be wielded to their advantage however.  Like MJonmind said, it's a deep rabbit hole.

I would never deny the Holocaust.  I have my own thoughts on it which I won't get into but I certainly wouldn't deny the suffering.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MissG on May 23, 2012, 07:19:39 PM
In war situations drastic measures are taken. Not only jews died, also gypsies did. The worst was in the way that was done and the experiments that were performed.

Hitler was just signing the documents, others executed their decisions and among those "others" were also jews. Sad but truth.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 23, 2012, 07:21:22 PM
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My grandpa always said when I was younger and I asked him about the war, that the jews killed their own people

Well, that is BS. That is basically denying the truth.

MissG, what? Hitler was just signing the documents? That's almost like saying he didn't really know what was going on and didn't have that much to do with it. Wow, just wow ... I'd like you to name Jews that executed his orders, can't believe what I'm reading here ...
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MissG on May 23, 2012, 07:26:34 PM
Quote
Posted by: _Scream_
« on: 1 minute ago » Insert Quote
Quote from: ~Souza~ on 8 minutes  ago
My grandpa always said when I was younger and I asked him about the war, that the jews killed their own people

Well, that is BS. That is basically denying the truth.

MissG, what? Hitler was just signing the documents? That's almost like saying he didn't really know what was going on and didn't have that much to do with it. Wow, just wow ...

That´s your interpretation of my words.

I mean that Souza´s grandpa was not wrong, since Jews did work in concentration camps and killed people, including their own.

It was war. Hitler took a lot of decisions but many others took also the decisions and he just signed the papers for it. So in a way he accepted what was being done.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 23, 2012, 07:27:25 PM
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She didn't say anti-Seminitism doesn't exist.  It can be wielded to their advantage however.

What? You are telling me that Jews just use "anti-Semitism" to their advantage or do sometimes? That, unfortunately, is an anti-Semitic comment in itself. And it denies that anti-Semitism is very real.

I really can't believe what I'm reading here, never expected to see things like that on any MJ forum ...
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MissG on May 23, 2012, 07:29:53 PM
I saw your modified post, scream.

I obviously do not have names. Do you? What are you aiming for?
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MissG on May 23, 2012, 07:34:37 PM
Well, _scream_, you should then talk with the same Jews I do who do not deny the holocaust but agree on the fact that some Jews are perpetuating the tragedy for their own benefit, including spreading hate.

I know that there is a division of opinion among jewish people about this very subject. However, both angles must be observed.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Andrea on May 23, 2012, 07:38:29 PM
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She didn't say anti-Seminitism doesn't exist.  It can be wielded to their advantage however.

What? You are telling me that Jews just use "anti-Semitism" to their advantage or do sometimes? That, unfortunately, is an anti-Semitic comment in itself. And it denies that anti-Semitism is very real.

I really can't believe what I'm reading here, never expected to see things like that on any MJ forum ...

There is always corruption at the upper-most levels of any religion/government/bank/corporation.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 23, 2012, 07:38:35 PM
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I mean that Souza´s grandpa was not wrong, since Jews did work in concentration camps and killed people, including their own.

This is not true! They were forced to burn the bodies of the people killed in the gas chambers, being forced to do something doesn't mean they worked there, they were prisoners themselves and forced to do that. And they were forced to work, in fact they were worked to death, hard physical labor and almost no food, that has nothing to do with actually working for the Nazis.

I'm very surprised and shocked, never thought I would read stuff like that on an MJ forum, I think I should leave, this is a political ideology that I don't agree with at all.

P.S. MissG, if you can't name any Jews who killed other Jews in the Holocaust, then it's just an allegation and there is obviously no proof.

P.P.S. Bottom line is I'd never expect MJ fans/supporters with those kind of views and you also can't on one hand get angry about a website like stormfront and on the other hand post things like the ones discussed and support David Icke, that is hypocrisy.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 23, 2012, 07:59:27 PM
Just for the record: I am not talking about the normal jews, or those that were forced to burn bodies. I am talking about the ones that are still controlling the world and our wallets and minds. The zionists, the 'men behind the curtain'.

MJ himself said that the jews did that to him (allegations and trash to take him out), his original version of TDCAU was banned because it had 'kike me' in it, which is seen as anti-semitism (don't ask me why, I forgot what it means). MJ had jewish friends, so he talked about the same 'jews' I'm talking about. Just wanted to explain that. I live in Holland, one of the countries that suffered the most in the war. I know my country's history very well. You will never hear me say that the jews haven't suffered in that war, but I do believe that the original story isn't what we have been told. What we meant with 'abusing the fear of anti-semitism' was just proven by you.

I hope you get what I mean. Michael said our history books were full of lies for a reason, he studied this war very closely. Just read up on it, even though this is such a difficult subject. I always reacted the same way you do now, but I decided to read up on it some more as well. Problem is that there is a lot of crap out there with half truths. Never forget that there are two camps. There are also videos and articles out there from people who ARE against jews but will mask their hate very well, hoping people will believe their lies. The truth is always somewhere in the middle and you should always use your own common sense.

There have been many non-jews: innocent german people, gay people, people from the resistance etc. killed in the war as well and I am not very sure that number is that much lower than that of the number of jewish people killed, yet no one talks about them, they are not remembered. Why aren't they? Why was the number of people that died in Auschwitz lowered over the years? I think the sign once said 3 or 4 million, I think it now says 1 million. Where did they get the first number, and where did those 2-3 million people go? Why are they saying that 6 million jews were killed, when that doesn't add up when you look at the numbers of jewish people alive before the war, and the number of people alive after the war? I am not saying it's okay if it's 'only' 1 million instead of 6 million, don't get me wrong!! Horrible things have been done in that war, but not just to jewish people. I am only saying that the facts might have been altered for a purpose. Just read up on it, but it's a very deep rabbit hole and not a fun one.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 23, 2012, 08:11:28 PM
The Holocaust is often used as  argument in favor of zionism, the holocaust is used for political benefit
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 23, 2012, 08:24:14 PM
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The Holocaust is often used as  argument in favor of zionism, the holocaust is used for political benefit

Yeah, I made a long ass post and you are able to make exactly my point in just one sentence! Hahahaha. I guess your English is becoming better every day paula!
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 23, 2012, 08:31:23 PM
So you support the belief in a Jewish world conspiracy? The guys on stormfront do too ...

I didn't abuse the fear of anti-semitism, I just call anti-Semitism anti-Semitism when I see it. People who are anti-Semitic of course don't like that because they want to be able to voice their opinions about Jews without being told that they are anti-Semites and they want people to accept their world view as the truth.

I've have never heard or read anything about Michael talking about WWII and the Holocaust and him saying in that context that history books lie.

I'm German, and I know my country's history and Europe's history very well too.

I really should leave now and I will, if I want this kind of discussion or if I want to read opinions like the ones posted here, I can go post or lurk on stormfront or similar websites ... I'm very surprised and shocked to see opinions like the ones I just saw here on a forum that is about MJ and the death hoax, I know I'm repeating myself, but I'm really shocked. I've been lurking on this forum for a couple of months, mostly in the back and Front threads, I really wasn't prepared at all to read about a "Jewish world conspiracy" on here ...

P.S. Just saw paula-c's comment ... I really can't believe what I'm reading here. I really wasn't sure what to think about Front, this discussion started in the Front thread - I was on the fence about him, sometimes I was more thinking he could be real and possibly Michael himself, sometimes I thought he is just fake, so I kept reading. But now I really do not believe that Michael would ever choose a board to post on that supports the ideology shown in this thread. I'm out.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 23, 2012, 08:42:41 PM
Scream, I think you either misread our posts, or just don´t want to see what we mean. I also didn´t say YOU abused it, I said you were the proof of abuse, because of your fear. Stormfront is a sick website with sick people. They base their hate for Jews in general on the controlling zionists, who have nothing to do with Judaism anymore. The people posting there are a danger to society and I am not pleased with you saying that we are just like them, because I assure you that we are NOTHING like them.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 23, 2012, 08:44:29 PM
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Just for the record: I am not talking about the normal jews, or those that were forced to burn bodies. I am talking about the ones that are still controlling the world and our wallets and minds. The zionists, the 'men behind the curtain'.

MJ himself said that the jews did that to him (allegations and trash to take him out), his original version of TDCAU was banned because it had 'kike me' in it, which is seen as anti-semitism (don't ask me why, I forgot what it means). MJ had jewish friends, so he talked about the same 'jews' I'm talking about. Just wanted to explain that. I live in Holland, one of the countries that suffered the most in the war. I know my country's history very well. You will never hear me say that the jews haven't suffered in that war, but I do believe that the original story isn't what we have been told. What we meant with 'abusing the fear of anti-semitism' was just proven by you.

I hope you get what I mean. Michael said our history books were full of lies for a reason, he studied this war very closely. Just read up on it, even though this is such a difficult subject. I always reacted the same way you do now, but I decided to read up on it some more as well. Problem is that there is a lot of crap out there with half truths. Never forget that there are two camps. There are also videos and articles out there from people who ARE against jews but will mask their hate very well, hoping people will believe their lies. The truth is always somewhere in the middle and you should always use your own common sense.

There have been many non-jews: innocent german people, gay people, people from the resistance etc. killed in the war as well and I am not very sure that number is that much lower than that of the number of jewish people killed, yet no one talks about them, they are not remembered. Why aren't they? Why was the number of people that died in Auschwitz lowered over the years? I think the sign once said 3 or 4 million, I think it now says 1 million. Where did they get the first number, and where did those 2-3 million people go? Why are they saying that 6 million jews were killed, when that doesn't add up when you look at the numbers of jewish people alive before the war, and the number of people alive after the war? I am not saying it's okay if it's 'only' 1 million instead of 6 million, don't get me wrong!! Horrible things have been done in that war, but not just to jewish people. I am only saying that the facts might have been altered for a purpose. Just read up on it, but it's a very deep rabbit hole and not a fun one.







The Jewish holocaust (thing not denied, but that, manipulated by interest), is the use that a caste of ambitious exploiters and profiteering circumstances, used as a pretext to hoodwink the world in combination with other vermin that sirvir them on a silver platter the possibility of obtaining through theft; a foreign territory, of legitimate possession of the Palestinians.





Quote
The Holocaust is often used as  argument in favor of zionism, the holocaust is used for political benefit

Yeah, I made a long ass post and you are able to make exactly my point in just one sentence! Hahahaha. I guess your English is becoming better every day paula!



seriously :icon_mrgreen:
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 23, 2012, 08:48:12 PM
I do not believe that it is so difficult to understand that anti-semitism and zionism are two different things
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 23, 2012, 08:55:05 PM
Souza, just because you word things more carefully and give Michael as a source when he never said anything anywhere about the Holocaust and that history books lie about it, doesn't mean you are different ...

I'm really gone after this post, I just saw that I forgot to reply to the number of victims thing ... the numbers changed due to ongoing research, the research wasn't done after a year or after 10 years and up until 1990 they couldn't research in the former Soviet Union, in and after 1990 they finally could start to look at those archives and the numbers changed again, because before 1990 they could only estimate without being able to actually look at the documents that the Russians had. No mystery there.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 23, 2012, 09:02:35 PM
Fine Scream. I´m not here to convince you, you asked what was meant and you got an answer. You might take it the complete wrong way, but I can´t help that.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MJonmind on May 23, 2012, 10:06:13 PM
Wow, I don't know how the topic got to the holocaust. I posted David Icke in regards to ancient aliens coming to earth. The video of him speaking, he didn't even mention the holocaust once, nor did he talk about Jews at all. Another video of him I watched had to do with the moon. Scream, you narrow people down so harshly. We are each made up of thousands of beliefs/theories/interests, so why would you jump on this?  I pride myself on reading various perspectives on hundreds of topics, and of not sticking with conventional opinion.  I enjoy reading the stories people tell from all sides, and I have a brain, so I can weigh things, and come to my own conclusions. I love all peoples groups, and hate seeing any group that is abused and treated unfairly, but I also like to know the full picture to help me understand why certain groups are targeted. I believe God loves all people groups and has a plan for each person. I also believe God's story-line includes evil, with heroes and protagonists, because it makes the story richer and more dramatic. We all have good and evil in us. I also believe what MJ said is true, "Just because it's in print doesn't mean it's the Gospel (truth)."  There have been major lies foisted on mankind for selfish gain, and plenty of altering/stretching the truth.

Would you not agree that victors have generally written the history books? Naturally they put their biases into the stories and reports. They want to vilify those they see as their enemies or those they want to subdue for their gain. Nothing's ever black and white but usually gray and complicated.

Oh, Souza, I'm not saying the holocaust didn't happen.  Did it happen exactly the way officially portrayed...and what is it's significance compared to the many other huge genocides of people groups--those are my questions.

Quote
Meanwhile, professional survivors in America have created endless museums and education programs that take the uniqueness of Jewish suffering for granted. They’ve also created a whole host of advocacy organizations whose fundraising depends on keeping the memory of the Holocaust alive. It has indeed become an industry — as former Israeli foreign secretary Abba Eban quipped, “There’s no business like ‘Shoah’ business.”
No business like Shoah business - Michelle Goldberg - Salon.com (http://www.salon.com/2002/04/03/mirroring_evil/)
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Grace on May 23, 2012, 11:34:02 PM
The issue in anti-semitic vs. anti-human is there is always a "blame" and a "feel guilty when I say so" card.
Sometimes the cause is not the reason for the result.

Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Magic_Love_4U on May 24, 2012, 03:20:40 AM
People are just too sensetive how we use words these days.
Depending on how I would say Black when talking about black people can be used as I am a racist.
Depending on how I talk about jews or use that word I could be considered a anti-semite
Depending how I speak about Jesus I can be anti this and that.

Racism was put there just so this would happen.

We can soon not speak about anything without offending someone.
This is just insane!
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: AKHTONI on May 24, 2012, 09:57:12 AM
 :WTF:  is it anti semitic if someone denied the holocaust or liked adolf hitler . I like adolf hitler and what's the problem?( since ariel sharon is good and man of peace ( palestine)and GBush (iraq and afgha masacres) .....)

 the jews killed each others and they called it holocaust and put the whole blame on hitler.

the next step they convinced the world that they suffered from injustice and and.... so they must have a state to defend themselves.

the UN  divided palestine between arabs and jews and they(jews) were sure that usa and england with them ( cause they have hands there ). as you can see now the arabs lost their land and the jews are taking care of it
http://z.about.com/d/middleeast/1/0/v/8/-/-/0723-occupation-israel-pale.jpg (http://z.about.com/d/middleeast/1/0/v/8/-/-/0723-occupation-israel-pale.jpg)  >:(

And from israel, the jews give orders and commanding the world ( binky and brain) ( actually they are everywhere after the alleged holocaust they started immigration . even to north pole  )....... and the history is long ,you know

so the holocaust is political weapon


scream:
Quote
So you support the belief in a Jewish world conspiracy?

Yes I did and I doubt this holocaust and wait they did a conspiracies before they are known as prophets killers right?if they did this with prophets how about normal human being

they control almost the whole  world and when they reach 100% it's  the EOW (armagedon)
and I believe they wanted to destroy michael.(TDCAU)

Quote
What? You are telling me that Jews just use "anti-Semitism" to their advantage or do sometimes? That, unfortunately, is an anti-Semitic comment in itself. And it denies that anti-Semitism is very real.


so we must say that the jews are good. and all the kind words? no one can say no or it's antisimitic or maybe they are the choosen one . sorry I've never talked positively about them cause it's hard to find the good side.


when a jew say yes ,I say NO I can't trust them they don't do what they say .and call it antisimitic if you want

ps: don't tell me that you are confusing zionists and jews cause it's hard to find jews now
 



 
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 24, 2012, 10:08:20 AM
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:WTF:  is it anti semitic if someone denied the holocaust or liked adolf hitler . I like adolf hitler and what's the problem?( since ariel sharon is good and man of peace ( palestine)and GBush (iraq and afgha masacres) .....)

 the jews killed each others and they called it holocaust and put the whole blame on hitler.

the next step they convinced the world that they suffered from injustice and and.... so they must have a state to defend themselves.

the UN  divided palestine between arabs and jews and they(jews) were sure that usa and england with them ( cause they have hands there ). as you can see now the arabs lost their land and the jews are taking care of it
http://z.about.com/d/middleeast/1/0/v/8/-/-/0723-occupation-israel-pale.jpg (http://z.about.com/d/middleeast/1/0/v/8/-/-/0723-occupation-israel-pale.jpg)  >:(

And from israel, the jews give orders and commanding the world ( binky and brain) ( actually they are everywhere after the alleged holocaust they started immigration . even to north pole  )....... and the history is long ,you know

so the holocaust is political weapon


scream:
Quote
So you support the belief in a Jewish world conspiracy?

Yes I did and I doubt this holocaust and wait they did a conspiracies before they are known as prophets killers right?if they did this with prophets how about normal human being

they control almost the whole  world and when they reach 100% it's  the EOW (armagedon)
and I believe they wanted to destroy michael.(TDCAU)

Quote
What? You are telling me that Jews just use "anti-Semitism" to their advantage or do sometimes? That, unfortunately, is an anti-Semitic comment in itself. And it denies that anti-Semitism is very real.


so we must say that the jews are good. and all the kind words? no one can say no or it's antisimitic or maybe they are the choosen one . sorry I've never talked positively about them cause it's hard to find the good side.


when a jew say yes ,I say NO I can't trust them they don't do what they say .and call it antisimitic if you want

ps: don't tell me that you are confusing zionists and jews cause it's hard to find jews now

Excuse me. Are you saying Hitler is a nice guy and all Jews are bad people? Because if THAT is the case, you might want to voice that opion on another forum.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 24, 2012, 10:22:13 AM
The holocaust is a profitable investment that contributed and continue to provide important benefits both economic and political to the Zionists
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: missudi on May 24, 2012, 11:38:48 AM
Cant believe anyone would deny the holocaust,I 100% believe it.shame on you.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 24, 2012, 11:47:34 AM
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Cant believe anyone would deny the holocaust,I 100% believe it.shame on you.

No one is denying the holocaust here, maybe you are misunderstanding the posts.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 11:50:51 AM
Damn, I knew I shouldn't have looked at this thread again ... with AKHTONI you have a full-blown anti-Semite and Nazi on the forum. And this person dares to call himself/herself a Michael Jackson fan or supporter? If this was my forum, I'd ban this person immediately for hate speech. And if I was Front, I'd also make it known that I don't like hate speech, anti-Semitism and love for Adolf Hitler in general and in particular on the forum that I post on (if Front is indeed Michael or someone close to Michael). If he can call out Frenchbraid for posting something that was totally harmless compared to what AKHTONI just posted, this should be a lot more important to him.

I'll really try not to look at the forum or at least this thread again, maybe someone could PM me in case Front decides to say something about AKHTONI'S opinion.

P.S. Souza, didn't you read AKHTONI'S post? He or she did deny the Holocaust by saying it didn't happen, the Nazis didn't do anything, the Jews killed each other and blamed it on Hitler. If this is even possible I consider that even worse than complete denial.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MJonmind on May 24, 2012, 11:57:57 AM
Is Front your 'Yes-man' for you to yank around? No.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 24, 2012, 12:03:15 PM
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Damn, I knew I shouldn't have looked at this thread again ... with AKHTONI you have a full-blown anti-Semite and Nazi on the forum. And this person dares to call himself/herself a Michael Jackson fan or supporter? If this was my forum, I'd ban this person immediately for hate speech. And if I was Front, I'd also make it known that I don't like hate speech, anti-Semitism and love for Adolf Hitler in general and in particular on the forum that I post on (if Front is indeed Michael or someone close to Michael). If he can call out Frenchbraid for posting something that was totally harmless compared to what AKHTONI just posted, this should be a lot more important to him.

I'll really try not to look at the forum or at least this thread again, maybe someone could PM me in case Front decides to say something about AKHTONI'S opinion.

P.S. Souza, didn't you read AKHTONI'S post? He or she did deny the Holocaust by saying it didn't happen, the Nazis didn't do anything, the Jews killed each other and blamed it on Hitler. If this is even possible I consider that even worse than complete denial.

Scream, I asked AKHTONI t clear up her post, because I want to know for SURE first what she means, since we are dealing here with many nationalities and some people might use the wrong words in English. So until then, I am not going to ban anyone. Why are you still here? If this is all you can say and do, you have no business in this thread. You're a new member, why stir up the post by twisting words? And since when are people saying Front should leave for stuff like this? I get the feeling that there are certain people here that are actually from another forum, realize they have been wrong about front, and now want him to post elsewhere, because they are not welcome here anymore. Maybe you shouls PM Front and just be blunt about that, but stop infecting this board with drama that I can perfectly handle myself.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 12:04:22 PM
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Is Front your 'Yes-man' for you to yank around? No.

Well, if he is Michael or someone close to Michael and posts on this forum and doesn't distance himself from hate speech posted on this very forum .... that should be important to him. If it isn't, then I indeed misunderstood everything that Michael stands for. Either that or Front is a fake.

So AKHTONI likes Hitler? You know, had Michael been living in Nazi Germany as a black man, he would have been murdered by the Nazis as well. So an MJ fan liking Hitler, that's just unbelievable.

MJonmind, it tells me a lot that you confront me for posting my opinion, but you don't say a word about AKHTONI'S post.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 12:16:39 PM
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Damn, I knew I shouldn't have looked at this thread again ... with AKHTONI you have a full-blown anti-Semite and Nazi on the forum. And this person dares to call himself/herself a Michael Jackson fan or supporter? If this was my forum, I'd ban this person immediately for hate speech. And if I was Front, I'd also make it known that I don't like hate speech, anti-Semitism and love for Adolf Hitler in general and in particular on the forum that I post on (if Front is indeed Michael or someone close to Michael). If he can call out Frenchbraid for posting something that was totally harmless compared to what AKHTONI just posted, this should be a lot more important to him.

I'll really try not to look at the forum or at least this thread again, maybe someone could PM me in case Front decides to say something about AKHTONI'S opinion.

P.S. Souza, didn't you read AKHTONI'S post? He or she did deny the Holocaust by saying it didn't happen, the Nazis didn't do anything, the Jews killed each other and blamed it on Hitler. If this is even possible I consider that even worse than complete denial.

Scream, I asked AKHTONI t clear up her post, because I want to know for SURE first what she means, since we are dealing here with many nationalities and some people might use the wrong words in English. So until then, I am not going to ban anyone. Why are you still here? If this is all you can say and do, you have no business in this thread. You're a new member, why stir up the post by twisting words? And since when are people saying Front should leave for stuff like this? I get the feeling that there are certain people here that are actually from another forum, realize they have been wrong about front, and now want him to post elsewhere, because they are not welcome here anymore. Maybe you shouls PM Front and just be blunt about that, but stop infecting this board with drama that I can perfectly handle myself.

AKHTONI'S post is very clear, you can't say things like "the jews killed each others and they called it holocaust and put the whole blame on hitler" or "I like adolf hitler" or "when a jew say yes ,I say NO I can't trust them they don't do what they say" and actually mean the opposite because your English is bad. That is hate speech.

I didn't say Front should leave, I said if he is Michael or close to him he should address this, that's at least what I would expect from Michael if people post hate speech on the forum that he chose as his home.

I'm new as a poster, I've been lurking for many months in the back-Front threads, I didn't look at many other threads, a few here and there and a couple of older threads too, but other than that just lurked in the back and Front threads because I was interested in them and found back and also Front interesting. I've never been on any other hoax forum, have never even seen them, I found this one when I googled the death hoax and stumbled upon back and Front. Why do I have no business in this thread? It's about anti-Semitism that you said doesn't exist on this forum and then you have somebody post something extremely anti-Semitic and I'm not allowed to comment on that?
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 24, 2012, 12:21:36 PM
Scream, Front is not your monkey. You can't tell him what to do. Furthermore, I am the admin here and BELIEVE ME that I can handle that with AKHTONI. Like I said, I want to have it cleared up first. Plus we don't even know how old she is, she might not even know what she is saying. I am not going to just randomly ban people because YOU think I should. If Michael is here and he disagrees with the way I handle this forum, he is free to post elsewhere or address me in private. YOU Scream, should leave the managing to me. You have made your point. Discussion closed and I'm going to lock this thread now that I understand the purpose you had with this all. AKHTONI, please pm me what you meant with your post.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 24, 2012, 12:31:49 PM
Scream, your shock and horror are transparently disingenuous. No matter how hard you try to project these ugly images onto the members here, they simply are unfounded. Not one person has stated the words you have tried so hard to put into their mouths. Unless you change your tune real quick, I deduce that you are simply trying to stir the pot and cause trouble and this is your only reason for being here.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 24, 2012, 12:51:45 PM
I talked to Souza and we agreed to reopen this topic. I think it is an interesting discussion and one we can discuss like adults. So please, continue.

@Akhtoni, perhaps you could expound here on what you posted prior.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 01:32:13 PM
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Scream, your shock and horror are transparently disingenuous. No matter how hard you try to project these ugly images onto the members here, they simply are unfounded.

Especially now after AKHTONI'S post they are not ... also nothing disingenuous about my shock and horror, I never expected to see anything like this on a Michael Jackson forum. I already said that I'm German, I know our history very well, my parents were children during Nazi Germany and my family was against Hitler. The Nazis killed millions of Jews, gypsies, homosexuals, sick and disabled people, political prisoners in the Holocaust. Millions and millions were killed in the war, also my relatives that had to fight in a war for a country that they hated and were killed in the war. I know what happened during Nazi Germany - and not just from history books but from what my family told me and the horrors they went through. And you think I'm not really shocked by reading things like "I like Hitler"? It's not just that I'm deeply offended by that, an ideology like that also scares me. I'm glad that Nazi Germany lost the war or I would have been born into the Nazi dictatorship as well and wouldn't be able to voice my opinion here, and if I did, I'd end up being murdered in a concentration camp as well.

So yes, people with this kind of ideology ("I like Hitler") scare the hell out of me and should scare the hell out of everybody, as long as this ideology is still alive and well, things are bound to repeat themselves. Maybe here in Europe, maybe somewhere else in the world. I don't want to see another world war, I don't want to see another Holocaust. That is also the reason why it is so important to remember, so saying the Holocaust is just used for political benefits these days is wrong. It happened, if we forget, it's bound to happen again, especially if there are people out there who "like Hitler" and "doubt this holocaust" (see Akhtoni's post).

My shock and horror is very real, I never expected to see some of the things I saw here and especially Akhtoni's post on a forum dedicated to Michael Jackson. Never seen anything like this before on any other Michael Jackson fan forum (and don't tell me this is not a fan forum, it's still dedicated to Michael and some people on this forum are fans, others call themselves supporters).

I'm leaving now, I really shouldn't have looked at this thread again, I just thought there might be an interesting discussion going on and that my decision to leave yesterday might have been a bit hasty, but I was wrong. And not taking my shock seriously is also quite offensive, I don't have to expose myself to that. AKHTONI'S post made me physically sick (and should shock everybody who reads it), and then my sincerity is questioned. It's all for L.O.V.E .... or so I thought.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Magic_Love_4U on May 24, 2012, 01:33:48 PM
It is rumoured that Hitler was jewish himself.
There is a difference between Jews and Zionists but in real life it has nothing to do with religion.
There is only one thing that facinates me with Hitler and that is how he managed to brainwash so many people...
But Hitler is as evil as they come! He was a human being lost in his path and sucked into his fears and own insecurities.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 24, 2012, 02:01:13 PM
"The Holocaust industry" clarifies with luxury appointments, documents and statements, how the Zionist Jews come extort the Germans since 1952 and obtaining funds to arm themselves. In principle, the organizations representing families of the victims of the alleged massacre, have received in compensation from the German Government, until the year 2000, $ 60 billion. The reality is that organizations such as the American Jewish Congress, the Masonic lodge Bi' nai Brith and the Conference on Jewish material claims against Germany have focused on managing the money. The mother of the author of the book, Norman Finkelstein, who survived the Warsaw ghetto, only received $3,500, while, as the author himself acknowledges, many people who had never been locked, received hundreds of thousands of dollars. In a parliamentary appearance of 23 February 2000, the German Government recognized that only about 15% of the money delivered to the Conference of applications materials reached the victims really. Where did that money go?

It seems clear, is not it? Through these organizations, he finished in the Israel State, which has used it to arm themselves to the teeth and become the strongest in the area army. Thus, the Holocaust has been the culprit of the bombs that have killed Palestinians and Lebanese. Do you now perceive why refuse to be investigated?In Spain there is a prime example, the President of this organization to redeem for the victims of the Holocaust, which was shown, three or four years ago, which did not live the Holocaust; many recall it. A great scandal which ended with a small mouth.From their Jewish status, Finkelstein recognizes the Holocauto (capitalized) as a historical event, began to take shape at the end of the cincuenta-sesenta, until then, nor Jews own them too interested, and this fact, he agreed, of course, with her comes from these funds.

Finkelstein argues that the Holocaust, capitalized, was an ideological construction for base support from United States to Israel and, incidentally, silence the rest of the world. The reputed writer israeli, Boas Evron, affirms that "awareness of the Holocaust is in fact an official propaganda indoctrination, a mass production of slogans and false visions of the world, whose real aim is not at all understanding of the past but the present handling". This manipulation is based on its conception in fact "unique in the manner of a mystery religion." Elie Wiesel says that the Holocaust "is impossible to understand or describe, and never will be understood or transmitted". (Wiesel lectures at a cost of $25,000, with including limousine, which reveals that "the secret of the truth of Auschwitz lies in silence").

As commented myself weeks ago, that uniqueness of the Holocaust gives the Jewish people an alibi before the rest of human beings, which, for Boas Evron, "equals clearly deliberately cultivate paranoia..." "This mentality sorry in advance any inhuman treatment which inflicts to non-Jews, that the dominant mythology holds that everyone collaborated with the nazis to destroy the Jewish community".According to Nathan and Ruth Ann Perlmutter, anti-Semitism emerged "jealousy and resentment felt the gentiles because Jews exceeded Christians in the commercial world".

The last chapter of this film which both affects the reality that we live in, is the issue of Jewish gold in Switzerland accounts. We are sure that many remember it because the controversy has happened a few years ago, but it is also very likely that you've understood nothing, like me, so far: data provided by Finkelstein, he understands very well, with you to laugh, because really that is delusional.You will see, this is a struggle of dogs (Swiss Bankers) boxer dogs pitbul (Rabbi and Zionist organizations). One day, the Zionist organizations are beginning to talk that many Jews deposited in Swiss banks their money and gold, but as a result of his disappearance, those accounts were not claimed by relatives. Zionists (Elie Wiesel, Simon Wiesenthal and later, the Council of Jewish communities) arrive to bankers and tell them that they want $ 20 billion, and threaten to demands (40% of the firms of lawyers New York pointers are Jews). Already know as spent American lawyers with the theme of tobacco and cancer, right?

Swiss Bankers respond that the most can do is carry out an audit and, after enduring harassment of the media world, offered 600 million, although the value of the accounts is situated between 170 and 269 million dollars. The Zionists respond to them with heavy arguments: US banks controlled by Jews threaten to withhold their Swiss Bank pension funds. In the end, after several years and $ 600 million employees to defend themselves against "the Holocaust industry", the bankers agree pay 1.25 billion. "The agreement was intended to repair three groups of people: claimants in inactive accounts domiciled in Switzerland, those that this country had been denied asylum and victims of the regime of slave labour".

Best of all is that, to justify the money claimed, Zionist organizations increased enormously the traditional figure of Holocaust survivors (100,000) with which, incidentally, disassembling the myth that anyone leaving live there and, approaching the figures to which kept the Jewish extermination deniers! At the end of the year 2000, according to Jewish organizations, had the double of survivors of the Holocaust who in 1945! (An argument to support the superiority of the Jewish race, no doubt).Things like these, are those made say the mother of Finkelstein (proud lady who for many years refused to receive anything from those facts)., "if all persons claiming to have survived the Holocaust, did it: who killed Hitler?".Needless to say that the Jews "a standing" have not seen the money from such claims. "We guess to where you have gone to?"

Other data that you perhaps draw attention, that in United States there are 7 major museums of the Holocaust (none on the Indians or blacks to the end and out, are there) and more than four hundred university chairs on the subject, besides the fact that the Holocaust is celebrated in all States.Forty percent of Americans awarded the Nobel Prize in the scientific and economic area are Jewish, as well as twenty percent of the professors from major universities. 16 of the 40 first American fortunes are beans and its per capita income twice that of non-Jews. All these data come, I repeat, a Jew with a conscience, Norman Finkelstein.The book "The Holocaust industry" has 200 pages and more that read, it devours!

Rafapal: periodismo planetario: La industria del Holocausto (http://rafapal.blogspot.com/2006/08/la-industria-del-holocausto.html)
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 24, 2012, 02:05:47 PM
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It is rumoured that Hitler was jewish himself.
There is a difference between Jews and Zionists but in real life it has nothing to do with religion.
There is only one thing that facinates me with Hitler and that is how he managed to brainwash so many people...
But Hitler is as evil as they come! He was a human being lost in his path and sucked into his fears and own insecurities.

I agree. And I thought I was crazy, but I have also read somewhere that Hitler was allegedly Jewish himself, but I can't for the life of me remember where.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MissG on May 24, 2012, 02:26:54 PM
Post are being misread and twisted. Also, people is free to believe what they want and to express their opinions regarding this matter, positive or negative, as long as doesn´t get in to a hate speech.

We are forgetting that it was war times and during war terrible things happen.
Look at Irak for heavens sake! Civilians being exterminated as well. What about Iroshima and Nagasaki? or the massacres and mutilations in Sierra Leone? Lybia?...so many places to think about.

The holocaust happened, it was war, but also happened LONG time ago. Time to learn from it and never allow to happen again, ever. And also to move on. Hitler and his regime is gone.

The holocaust is not "own" by Jews. It happened to MANY ethnic groups.

Now days, seems like some Jews are using that sad past which they did not suffer but their grand parents did and getting in to lands which don´t belong to them. Zionists are exploiting the past history to their benefit and masking it behind the "look what happened to us" card.

The holocaust happened to MANY civilians yet those other groups don´t use it to settle in other countries.

Israel suffers due to this never ending hate and "pay back" time, making people to leave their country to safer places.

Let´s be objective here, please.


Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 24, 2012, 02:50:23 PM
That is what it is is talking about, as the Holocaust have been used and manipulated  by zionism
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Grace on May 24, 2012, 03:11:57 PM
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I agree. And I thought I was crazy, but I have also read somewhere that Hitler was allegedly Jewish himself, but I can't for the life of me remember where.

Austrian press July 12, 1933

13 Jul 1933 - HITLER OF JEWISH EXTRACTION? Assertion Of An Aus... (http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/48437176?)

Quote
July 12 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/July_12), 1933 (Wednesday)
  • The Vienna newspaper Oesterreichische Abendblatt published a three page story claiming proof that Adolf Hitler was "directly descended on his mother's side" from a Jewish family in Czechoslovakia, and that there were at least ten Jewish persons named Hitler in the city of Polna (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polna). Alexander Basch, the recently deceased city registrar, had identified a sister of Hitler's grandmother as having been a Jew who moved from Polna to Vienna when both places were part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. "Hitler Jewish, Austrians Say", Milwaukee Journal, July 13, 1933, p1
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Mandsford/1909 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Mandsford/1909)
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MaryK on May 24, 2012, 03:38:17 PM
Well....as I am German I´d like to say a few words as well.
We, the generation of the postwar period, have been brought up to strictly condemn and demonize everything related to Hitler and what happend during the Third Reich. We have been taught to immediately react in a strongly negative way to all things "Nazi" "Hitler" and so on, from a very young age.
They do everything at school to literally hammer that into our heads so deeply....so maybe that´s why we are having a hard time trying to approach the subject from a different point of view.

I could say so many things...but...for now, I´ll keep them to myself.

You know...when I was an adolescent I traveled a lot and I had many bad experiences because I am German. I have been yelled at, spit at, cursed at, insulted and shunned in different countries of Europe. And I was only just a kid....
I am actually happy to see that I am not hated on this forum because of my nationality.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 04:37:06 PM
Ok, just a couple of words because the German to German thing is interesting ... nobody at school hammered anything into my head, believe it or not, I never had one history lesson in school about Nazi Germany. I don't know how old you are, maybe I'm older than you, that would be my guess, and that things changed since I went to school. And that not every school is the same. And I also changed schools sort of "in the middle" to a different kind of school and they were at a different level than me in all subjects, so I had to do a few tests, one of them was history and I had to study from one history book they gave me. In this book there was just one very short chapter about Nazi Germany and it never came up in the test.

So no, nobody hammered anything into my head ever, I just heard so many stories from my parents, first hand experiences, that was enough for me to understand how bad it was, not just the war but the dictatorship they had to live under. And how much worse it was for other people, like Jews, than it was for my parents, and they already went through hell. My family also never hammered anything political into my head as my family is not political at all, I am though, but up until my mid 20's I was not, just like the rest of my family. But then I started to read a lot about Nazi Germany, started to watch documentaries, did my own research about all kinds of subjects regarding WWII and the Holocaust on the internet, which gave me an even better understanding of what my parents went through, because it added the big picture to their personal stories.

I don't really understand what you mean by approaching it from a different point of view .... how can I approach someone who says "I like Hitler and the Jews killed each other and blamed it on Hitler"? What different kind of view would help me here? If you mean the whole "collective guilt" thing .... I never felt that way and I never felt that I am guilty of anything, I wasn't even born back then. Sometimes people confuse remembering and not forgetting with collective guilt. There is no collective guilt, especially not when it comes to people who were born after 1945 and I never felt that anybody wanted me to feel guilty for what the Nazis did.

No one ever hated on me because of my nationality, apart from once in my life not too long ago on the internet, and that person also happened to be a Michael Jackson fan. Never heard from my parents that they have been hated on because of their nationality, never heard this from anyone in my family. So this Michael fan was a very rare thing for me, surprised me coming from a Michael Jackson fan, but unfortunately they are not always as tolerant as they themselves think they are, she wasn't, at first I thought I misunderstood, but I didn't, so I stopped talking to her.

And yes, my parents and their families were against Hitler, but I am aware that parents and grandparents from some of my friends were not .... and of course they lost family members in the war as well, but my friends still hear from them that "it wasn't all bad" and that Hitler was right. My friends fortunately don't agree with them and see them for what they are, family or not.

And since you are German as well, my opinion on this subject has nothing to do with that, I don't need laws, but you also know that AKHTONI could never post what he or she posted on a German forum. Not because there is no free speech, but because this kind of hate speech is against our laws. Laws like that do exist in many countries, there are hate speech laws in the United States as well, btw.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on May 24, 2012, 04:40:31 PM
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That is what it is is talking about, as the Holocaust have been used and manipulated  by zionism

There's a difference between the common jewish people and the Zionists.  To me, these zionists are not following the Jewish religion really.  They are following they're own political agenda's.  They're following Lucifer.  They're like Luciferians but they are calling themselves something else.  They do everything to promote their evil agenda.  It's an extremist group which isn't following God.  So this isn't really about religion just like Magic_Love_4U said.






Love
 
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MaryK on May 24, 2012, 04:50:20 PM
@_Scream_: I am 39 years old. How old are you?

Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 05:47:50 PM
Mary, I'm 44, not as much age difference as I thought. It's just that I read things like you posted on the internet from time to time and for some reason it's usually people who are in their 20's or younger who post similar things. So that gave me the impression that you might be younger than me. So I guess schools and teachers are different.

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There's a difference between the common jewish people and the Zionists.

The problem is .... the actual collective guilt that is happening. A lot of people, some out of pure ignorance, some out of an anti-Semitic agenda and ideology, blame all Jewish people for what a few do. Like they blame all Jews for what Isreal does (I don't agree with a lot that Isreal does, but it's a country first and I don't care that most of the people living there are Jews - since I also wouldn't blame all Germans because a few are doing things that I don't like or are criminals or all Catholics for what the church did hundreds of years ago, not even for what the church does wrong these days, or all black people in America because a few commit crimes, just like white people, and nobody would ever blame all white people because some commit murder or sell drugs). And those who actually have this ideology and are not just ignorant use words like Zionists as a code for "Jews". How can you blame an entire country for what their politicians do? Some in the country will agree with them and some won't, in a democracy 50 % of all voters might have voted for the complete opposite and are not responsible for the fact that the other side won. In the case of Israel, how can you hate on Jews that don't even live in that country and would never move there? More Jews live outside Israel, all over the world, than live in Israel. And yet you have AKHTONI claiming that there are no Jews, just Zionists, that Jews can't be trusted, that Jews committed the Holocaust and blamed it on Hitler, that Jews kill prophets (well, the Romans killed Jesus) - talk about collective guilt, even for things that Jews didn't do and that happened 2,000 years ago!
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Tink on May 24, 2012, 06:06:26 PM
As far as I know, the Nazis were a political power, that ran out of control under a power hungry MADMAN.

Germany had just come out of WW1, with an awfully heavy debt to pay, and Hitler offered a way "out" of it. Blaming all the Jews was a first step, in taking back control. Then, it was invading Poland - and setting up a bunch of Prison, then DEATH CAMPS there. I should know - my Great Aunt Alka survived Berkinau-Auschwitz; she wasn't Jewish, she was CATHOLIC! Anyone who didn't fall in line with the Nazi party line was dumped in all of the camps. Oh, riiiight - land!

Poland was earmarked for EXTERMINATION. My Great Aunts & Uncles for the most part, were murdered at their Palaces and castles - which the Nazis took over, and ran administrative tasks from...you can imagine how I feel about that.

Only one wasn't...and he had to watch 5,000 Polish soldiers stand for 4 days, with their hands over their heads on his property. Anyone who dropped their hands, was SHOT. Anyone who tried to give them water or food, WAS SHOT. They extorted him for money - until he ran out ahead of the Russians.

The reason why Poland was so easily overrun? Thank Russia for that, because of Katyn Forest Massacre: Where they decapitated Poland, by taking ALL the top leaders, the thinkers, men from the colleges. Anyone who could've rallied AGAINST the Nazis, received a bullet in the back of their head, execution style, the number being about 22,000. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre) Stalin contributed greatly to Hitler decimating Poland.

I really don't understand how anyone can get this "zionist" theme out of this; it was about destroying lives; invasion, taking over the world by Hitler and his personal minions!

Oh, and let us not forget Hugo Boss designing the SS Uniforms - that's why they looked so snappy (and I'll never forgive that design house).

The numbers tattooed on my Great Aunt's arm, sending any clothes we didn't need to Poland every year, it was so precious to them. I've only been able to speak with two of my younger relatives, and they're pretty cool, similar to me. But what really sticks in my memory, is when an 80 year old woman contacted me, who was quite ill - and just wanted to hear from another relative, before she died. I spent as long as she wanted on the phone - then her son thanked me...another Berkinau-Auschwitz survivor.

So please - it was about Total Global Domination. Nobody gave a damn about the Jews, the Gypsies, nor the Poles. They were just hamburger fed into the machine called WAR.

Anyone remember what it was like, when the Allies allowed Germany to be divided, Poland given to Russia on a silver platter, along with so many other countries, screaming for their freedom? That was a DARK DAY for freedom.

Yes; many of the school books for Elementary schools ARE wrong - because children can't handle the dark stuff. When you hit college, usually you get more of the truth. I remember my History teacher in college on the first day telling us, "Toss all you learned out the door; for history is written by the victors. Now, you learn the truth."

Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 06:31:05 PM
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I really don't understand how anyone can get this "zionist" theme out of this; it was about destroying lives; invasion, taking over the world by Hitler and his personal minions!

Exactly! People talk about Isreal and the Jews in general using the Holocaust for political benefits - but forget that the other side uses the Holocaust denying it for their own political agenda, blame all Jews for the Zionists (and they are just a handful of Jews) and use the Holocaust as a weapon against them ("the Jews killed each other and blamed it on Hitler") and use Holocaust denial as a weapon against all Jews today.

Reading the story about your Great Aunt - I'm really wondering, Michael has Jewish fans as well, maybe some post here or lurk here. How must they feel reading things like "I like Hitler and all Jews are Zionists, they kill prophets and Jews can't be trusted, they killed each other and blamed Hitler and that they were 'everywhere' after the 'alleged Holocaust'" - yeah, how dare they, right? How dare they be anywhere? That's not just denying the Holocaust that's also expressing anger about the fact that there are still Jews left and that they dare to live wherever they choose to live. That must be so hurtful for them considering that a lot of families had no survivors and some had maybe one, and exactly those survivors or their children who lost their entire family in the Holocaust have to read AKHTONI'S extremely hateful comments on here, seeing how most people just react to them with chatter about the Zionists and the so called Holocaust industry.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on May 24, 2012, 07:58:04 PM
Scream and others,

You said people were reacting.  I think people are reacting because it's still going on as we speak.  It never ended.  It's just not in Germany,Poland,Holland,France at the moment.  There are still wars,suffering,starvation,genocide going on in the Middle East and in other places.  The "top of they pyramid" is still trying to control the world.  We're all at the bottom and we're all the same.  "They Don't Care About Us"  We all have to realize this and unite.  Religions,nationalities,ethnic groups,politics etc. are dividing us.  We have to stop letting all of this divide us.  If we all unite then they have no one to control. 

Love
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 08:09:12 PM
Dontwalkaway, what I meant was actually that they don't react with disgust to AKHTONI'S post but instead attack me and just talk about Zionists and the Holocaust industry. Instead of thinking for one moment how a Jew reading AKHTONI'S post must feel. How anybody who suffered during Nazi Germany or the families of those who suffered must feel reading his/her post. Instead of expressing how sorry they are that they had to read this and that they had all this hate thrown at them .... it's all for L.O.V.E.? Really?

All that is necessary for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing ....

And then I read people on this forum saying how the world has to change, how they have to change, how hate has to stop .... and yet most of the people in this thread don't even speak out against hate speech.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on May 24, 2012, 09:08:01 PM
Scream,

I don't react with disgust even though I don't always agree.  This is because that person was being honest and giving their real thoughts and feelings.  I also appreciate the fact that you are being honest.  This is sometimes a good thing because then we can talk about it and work on it.  That's what we have to do in order to unite.  The only way we can accomplish anything is if we unite.  For example, the government in the U.S. calls the people in Iraq or Afghanistan or wherever "terrorists".  They blame an attack on "terrorists".  The people in Afghanistan or wherever calls U.S. the "terrorists". 
This goes on and on and it never ends.  Our enemies are not people just like us in a foreign country.   There's so much propoganda,control,manipulation etc.  People don't realize the truth.  Most people are just trying to survive and don't know what's really going on.
We have to spread information.  Who is really controlling education, news, military,corporations,banks,food, resources, etc. etc.????  Who is really doing the manipulation and starting the wars ????   We don't have the total big picture but I think on this forum we are getting closer to it.  We're trying to get closer to the truth.  This is the way we can unite and then "Heal the World".  In a way it might be a good thing that you brought up this topic.  This sure is a "big" one.    :ghsdf:

 
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MJonmind on May 24, 2012, 10:20:39 PM
I don't think there can be any real debate or discussion, if one or both sides are reactionary and accusatory, and emotions rule over facts and information.  Hate is not the same as bringing forth facts and details. All people experience things from their perspective, and you cannot deny people what they feel or experience.  There were others backing Hitler, he was probably more a puppet of higher powers. He was not a lone madman but selected to take the blame and fall.  Scream, there are ALWAYS other perspectives, but if they are silenced by force and fear, naturally you will only hear one side and believe that's all there is to know about the subject.  No one here is denying the death and suffering on an unbelievable scale, the questions all have to do with the powers behind it all, and the powers behind those powers, the purposes for it happening on a larger scale.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 11:01:47 PM
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Hate is not the same as bringing forth facts and details.

Oh, so AKHTONI brings forth fact and details? If that's how you see his or her post then you don't see anti-Semitism and dangerous hate speech against Jews when it hits you in the face.

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All people experience things from their perspective, and you cannot deny people what they feel or experience.  There were others backing Hitler, he was probably more a puppet of higher powers. He was not a lone madman but selected to take the blame and fall.

I don't even know what to say to that. You clearly have no knowledge about Hitler and his roots from decades before he even became a member of the NSDAP (his time in Vienna for example). If you knew about that and his anti-Semitism long before he ever became the leader of that party, you would never say that he was just selected to take the blame and fall.

What do you mean, I can not deny people what they feel or experience? If they feel that they like Hitler, that's something I have to respect and I'm not allowed to question that? What if they also feel there needs to be a new NSDAP, what if they founded this new party because they "like Hitler" and want to finish what he started? It's ok for them to do that because I have to respect that they feel this way?

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No one here is denying the death and suffering on an unbelievable scale, the questions all have to do with the powers behind it all, and the powers behind those powers, the purposes for it happening on a larger scale.

The powers behind WWII and the Holocaust were Hitler and the Nazis. Denying that and looking for other powers who were actually behind it means downplaying what the Nazis did and taking the responsibility from them.

And no one here is denying the death and suffering?

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scream:
Quote
So you support the belief in a Jewish world conspiracy?

Yes I did and I doubt this holocaust

I can't believe how people defend AKHTONI and just think what he or she said will just go away if they deny often enough that he or she actually said that.

I was really hoping that I'm wrong about the people here, but I can see now that I am not, if people actually defend AKHTONI and at the same time say that they are not anti-Semitic just means I was right from the start when I posted about David Icke (I actually thought people only use him as a source because they don't know about his anti-Semitism, boy, was I wrong, they know and use him as a source anyway or because of that). I guess I've been lucky so far on the internet, I never was on any forum where people could post things like AKHTONI did here, if anybody only posted 10 % of what he or she said, the posts were deleted and the users were banned for hate speech and all forums I have ever been on had "no hate speech, no racism, no anti-Semitism" in their forum rules. The only places I ever saw posts like that one were forums like stormfront. I'm still shocked to see a Michael Jackson forum acting like this and I'm still in disbelief.

And not that this is important, the hate speech against Jews and pointing out how dangerous it is is what's important .... but since this all started in the Front thread, I was on the fence about Front but now I'm convinced that he is fake, I really don't believe for one second that Michael would choose a forum that supports ideologies like this one. Hate against (groups of) people goes against everything he ever stood for. I know that it's a bit early, Front might not have seen this yet, so maybe he will address it in the near future, that might put me back on the fence. If he doesn't, well, then I wasted a couple of months of following the 2 threads and reading through the old one from beginning to end.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: BeTheChange on May 24, 2012, 11:17:04 PM
I've been observing the discussion here and I find it fascinating...good call bec and Souza for re-opening it.  And although the 'surface' discussion going on is quite interesting....what fascinates me more is the discussion going on just below the surface.  This is a HUGE topic...a very deep rabbit hole.

No matter how you slice it, Hitler was ONE example of evil personified....and he didn't act alone.  I am fascinated by his intelligence and often wonder what he could have accomplished if he had used his gifts for good.  I can completely understand Mike having wanted to speak with him.  People freaked out when they read that...using it as yet another excuse to accuse Mike of something else (it's like they have a checklist).  The only way to beat evil is to study it, learn it and watch it in action...what better way to understand it than through the 'mind' of evil?

I haven't 'studied' the Holocaust enough to give an educated 'opinion' on it...nor do I have personal attachments to the events that occurred.  But I do know enough to know that no matter what took place....it left a scar in human history....much like the events of 9/11 left a scar (there are many other scars...but those two are fresh scars).  Whatever the 'logistics' of it were...innocent people did die and evil scored major points.  I don't see it as a class, race, sex, gender or any other 'dividing' issue...I see it as 'good'/innocent versus evil (remember, deep rabbit hole).  And as long as the 'good' remain divided amongst themselves....over this issue or ANY other issue....'they' will keep scoring points.

I do believe that we are approaching a crucial time in human history.  I don't know what is gonna take place, but I feel something building worldwide...like a volcano brewing just under the surface, that can, and will, soon erupt.  And based on 'their' past game plans, 'they' will strike first...again.  My hope is that the 'good' will be awake enough to finally block the shot.  My fear is that 'they' have got us all so 'divided' over just about everything under the sun...it's evident on the board and in everyday life....that we won't even see it coming.

What has kept me here for 3 years is my belief that Mike has a game plan of his own...a plan that will stop the world...one that WILL draw lines in the sand.  I'm trying to study it, learn it and watch it in action...so that I'll be ready on his cue. 

The 'good' is long overdue.

With L.O.V.E. always.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 11:27:48 PM
Now I just looked at the links you posted, MJonmind. It's unbelievable, CODOH is the website of Holocaust denier Bradley R. Smith.

Bradley Smith, Holocaust Denial, Committee for Open Debate on the Holocaust -- Extremism in America (http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/smith_codoh/default.asp?LEARN_Cat=Extremism&LEARN_SubCat=Extremism_in_America&xpicked=2&item=10)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_denial (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_denial)

In 1987, Bradley R. Smith, a former media director of the Institute for Historical Review, founded the Committee for Open Debate on the Holocaust (CODOH). In the United States, CODOH has repeatedly tried to place newspaper advertisements questioning whether the Holocaust happened, especially in college campus newspapers. Some newspapers have accepted the advertisements, while others have rejected them. Bradley Smith has more recently sought other avenues to promote Holocaust denial – with little success. On September 8, 2009, The Harvard Crimson school paper ran a paid ad from Bradley R Smith. It was quickly criticized and an apology was issued from the editor, claiming it was a mistake.

And rense.com .... Jeff Rense is a Holocaust denier as well:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Rense (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Rense)

Rense's radio program and website, Rense.com, cover subjects such as 9/11 conspiracy theories, UFO reporting, paranormal phenomena, Holocaust denial, Zionism, ....


Funny how you post links of Holocaust deniers to try and convince me that you don't deny the Holocaust and that you are not anti-Semitic. Or maybe just never bothered to research the source and just took the information without knowing who is behind it. If I read any kind of information I always research the source as well. But I'm quite sure you know who you are quoting, so it makes sense that you don't see the wrong in what AKHTONI said. And how right I was from the beginning. And you use Michael's name for this and claim that you do this for Michael and that you are here for Michael (see people on here claiming that when he said that history books lie he meant the Holocaust when he was actually talking about music and music history and how blacks have been discriminated against for decades and still are .... you are putting words in his mouth, things he never said to support your own agenda, that's a wrong that should be righted as well).
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 24, 2012, 11:33:18 PM
Scream you really need to calm down and start reading the words that people are writing and stop inserting your own and then getting outraged about your version. That's called twisting to suit an agenda and it has no place in respectful discussion on ANY subject.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 24, 2012, 11:52:51 PM
I saw the words, bec, some of them were "I like Hitler", "the Jews killed each other and blamed Hitler", I also saw people defending AKHTONI and then one of them posted links to websites of Holocaust deniers, and it's not just 2, no, 3 website, I forgot to mention whale.to:

neurodiversity weblog: A Whale of an Expert (http://neurodiversity.com/weblog/article/163/)

They even promote the fake Protocols of the Elders of Zion like David Icke does as well and which are still used by Nazis to this day (you can see it on stormfront, they know they are fake but still say that the things said in them mirror reality). Not a website I would link to or quote for truth, they are propaganda.

No need to insert my own words if people post "I like Hitler" or links to the websites of anti-Semites and Holocaust deniers, it's obvious anyway what their agenda is. Michael just doesn't deserve this and doesn't deserve that HIS words get twisted and people insert their own to make it fit their agenda (like the history books lie comment). He had to face horrible things said about him, his own words twisted time and again, the allegations, and now his name is used and his words are twisted by people to make it seem like he supported their agenda. Is Holocaust denial and liking Hitler all for L.O.V.E. as well? And if I'm supposed to respect someone's feelings if the feeling is liking Hitler and hating the Jews, do people care at all about the feelings of Holocaust survivors and their families when they read those horrible things?
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MJonmind on May 24, 2012, 11:56:42 PM
BTC,
Quote
What has kept me here for 3 years is because I believe Mike has a game plan of his own...a plan that will stop the world...one that WILL draw lines in the sand.
You know that motion that MJ made in his dance routine when he stood with legs spread apart and reaching down with his pointer finger to touch the ground? That always reminded me of Jesus writing in the sand.
 
Quote
John 8:

2 At dawn he appeared again in the temple courts, where all the people gathered around him, and he sat down to teach them.3 The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group4 and said to Jesus, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery.5 In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women.Now what do you say?”6 They were using this question as a trap,in order to have a basis for accusing him.

   But Jesus bent down and started to write on the ground with his finger.7 When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, “Let any one of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stoneat her.”8 Again he stooped down and wrote on the ground.

   9 At this, those who heard began to go away one at a time, the older ones first, until only Jesus was left, with the woman still standing there.10 Jesus straightened up and asked her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?”

   11 “No one, sir,” she said.

   “Then neither do I condemn you,”Jesus declared. “Go now and leave your life of sin.”NIV


Scream, you're always bringing in emotion. Was it people like you that called these writers 'holocaust deniers' or did it actually come from their own mouths, because I doubt that.  It's simply called 'name-calling' to silence opponents and vilify anyone who questions details of the official story. I have a question for you, do you believe it was Osama Bin Laden who was behind the bringing down of the Trade Towers on 911?  The events are somewhat related IMO. TS has most definitely spoken against the official story of 911.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 25, 2012, 12:27:29 AM
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Scream, you're always bringing in emotion. Was it people like you that called these writers 'holocaust deniers' or did it actually come from their own mouths, because I doubt that.  It's simply called 'name-calling' to silence opponents and vilify anyone who questions details of the official story.

Ok, now everything is a conspiracy, one of the websites, whale.to, even has the entire fake and anti-Semitic Protocols of the Elders of Zion on it, for Heaven's sake! If you look at the websites it becomes clear where they stand. If you of course agree with them, you won't see what they are actually saying. Those websites are well known among people interested in politics and it's widely known where they stand.

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I have a question for you, do you believe it was Osama Bin Laden who was behind the bringing down of the Trade Towers on 911?  The events are somewhat related IMO. TS has most definitely spoken against the official story of 911.

TS speaking against the official story tells me nothing. A lot of people do. Yes, I do believe Osama Bin Laden was behind it and the reason why the official story seems a bit strange and seems to have a lot of holes in it is that they never told us the whole story for national security reasons. If they told the entire story they'd also have reveal what they do to observe terrorists and other things that would compromise their future work.

But I really give up now, I really thought by explaining things and where I'm coming from with my personal history and by telling people who they are quoting and supporting I could make people aware of things and make them think. But from the way this discussion went I can just say that this ideology seems to be deep-rooted on this forum and Michael's words are twisted to make them fit. It was a big surprise for me to hear that he apparently said that history books lie about the Holocaust, at first I thought he actually said that and I missed that somehow (although that would have been a huge headline over here) until I realized people just took the part with history books lie and put the rest into his mouth. I really never expected to see anything like this on a forum that is dedicated to Michael, I find this extremely confusing, but I think I have to accept now that I can't make people understand by explaining. I can't make them re-think their points of view, it's just so sad because Michael deserves so much better ....
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 25, 2012, 12:39:05 AM
Quote
And if I'm supposed to respect someone's feelings if the feeling is liking Hitler and hating the Jews,

THIS is twisting to suit an agenda.

Quote
but since this all started in the Front thread, I was on the fence about Front but now I'm convinced that he is fake, I really don't believe for one second that Michael would choose a forum that supports ideologies like this one. Hate against (groups of) people goes against everything he ever stood for. I know that it's a bit early, Front might not have seen this yet, so maybe he will address it in the near future, that might put me back on the fence. If he doesn't, well, then I wasted a couple of months of following the 2 threads and reading through the old one from beginning to end.

and this is a threat an attempt at coercion.

These have no place in intelligent and respectful discussion.

MJonmind said it best to you:
Quote
Scream, there are ALWAYS other perspectives, but if they are silenced by force and fear, naturally you will only hear one side and believe that's all there is to know about the subject.

Scream, you are full of fear. Fear is one path to the dark side. Have you ever seen Star Wars?

Read these words: take a deep breath and switch to decaf.

Ps. I guess we are still waiting for Akhtoni to expound.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 25, 2012, 12:59:18 AM
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Quote
And if I'm supposed to respect someone's feelings if the feeling is liking Hitler and hating the Jews,

THIS is twisting to suit an agenda.

Really? Did you even read AKHTONI'S post?

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I like adolf hitler and what's the problem?

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the jews killed each others and they called it holocaust and put the whole blame on hitler.

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And from israel, the jews give orders and commanding the world ( binky and brain) ( actually they are everywhere after the alleged holocaust they started immigration . even to north pole  )....... and the history is long ,you know

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Yes I did and I doubt this holocaust and wait they did a conspiracies before they are known as prophets killers right?if they did this with prophets how about normal human being

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they control almost the whole  world and when they reach 100% it's  the EOW (armagedon)

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sorry I've never talked positively about them cause it's hard to find the good side.

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when a jew say yes ,I say NO I can't trust them they don't do what they say

But whatever, like I said, this thing is obviously deep-rooted on this forum and if YOU want this kind of stuff on your forum .... I honestly didn't think you do, especially after seeing the thread about the chimpout and stormfront, but I was so totally wrong. You obviously support anti-Semitism on here and use anti-Semites like David Icke, Jeff Rense or Bradley R. Smith as sources all the time. I can't even wrap my head around the belief that this political ideology has anything to do with Michael and the death hoax, but you put them together somehow, for me that's like 2 puzzles pieces that don't fit together at all.

Oh, and btw. .... what I said about Front is not coercion. I really mean that, everybody has their reasons to either believe he is fake or legit. I just told you what my reasons for jumping of the fence would be. Am I not allowed to have my own opinion? He will react if he wants to, I don't force him and I couldn't if I wanted to, I just voiced my opinion regarding what would make him fake for me for good.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: BeTheChange on May 25, 2012, 01:09:25 AM
@scream...you do bring up some very good points but why do you keep painting with such a broad brush?  We are all very diverse in our experiences, knowledge and opinions...yet, you keep insinuating that the opinions of a few (regardless of what they are) are reflective of the entire forum body.  Isn't that presumptuous and kind of discriminatory? 

I do respect your passion on the subject...but sense that it is fueling anger and judgement towards others...most of which ARE here seeking truth.

With L.O.V.E. always.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 25, 2012, 01:14:28 AM
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@scream...you do bring up some very good points but why do you keep painting with such a broad brush?  We are all very diverse in our experiences, knowledge and opinions...yet, you keep insinuating that the opinions of a few (regardless of what they are) are reflective of the entire forum body.  Isn't that presumptuous and kind of discriminatory? 

What I mean by that, when I say it's deep-rooted and the forum doesn't have a problem with it, with the links, posts like AKHTONI'S post and all the rest is that the people who run this forum don't mind if people post this stuff and even defend it and attack me for speaking out against it, meaning they support all this. This doesn't mean that every single member agrees with it.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MFFreedom on May 25, 2012, 01:25:49 AM
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Quote
And if I'm supposed to respect someone's feelings if the feeling is liking Hitler and hating the Jews,

THIS is twisting to suit an agenda.

Really? Did you even read AKHTONI'S post?

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I like adolf hitler and what's the problem?

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the jews killed each others and they called it holocaust and put the whole blame on hitler.

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And from israel, the jews give orders and commanding the world ( binky and brain) ( actually they are everywhere after the alleged holocaust they started immigration . even to north pole  )....... and the history is long ,you know

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Yes I did and I doubt this holocaust and wait they did a conspiracies before they are known as prophets killers right?if they did this with prophets how about normal human being

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they control almost the whole  world and when they reach 100% it's  the EOW (armagedon)

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sorry I've never talked positively about them cause it's hard to find the good side.

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when a jew say yes ,I say NO I can't trust them they don't do what they say

But whatever, like I said, this thing is obviously deep-rooted on this forum and if YOU want this kind of stuff on your forum .... I honestly didn't think you do, especially after seeing the thread about the chimpout and stormfront, but I was so totally wrong. You obviously support anti-Semitism on here and use anti-Semites like David Icke, Jeff Rense or Bradley R. Smith as sources all the time. I can't even wrap my head around the belief that this political ideology has anything to do with Michael and the death hoax, but you put them together somehow, for me that's like 2 puzzles pieces that don't fit together at all.

Oh, and btw. .... what I said about Front is not coercion. I really mean that, everybody has their reasons to either believe he is fake or legit. I just told you what my reasons for jumping of the fence would be. Am I not allowed to have my own opinion? He will react if he wants to, I don't force him and I couldn't if I wanted to, I just voiced my opinion regarding what would make him fake for me for good.

Don't know about Jeff Rense or Bradley R. Smith, but to call David Icke an anti-semit?  :icon_question: I have attended two lectures of his so far and never ever have I gotten the impression he was anti-semitic or against the concept of God. At All. He goes beyond labels. New Age? Don't even got THAT impression. Anyhow, Michael - as I believe - has also surpassed labels (exept for explanations). He surely understood what goes on in the world and realised a long time ago, that LOVE is the answer. Nothing more or less. Labels are just no good. And wether someone believes in the Elite running the world or not: it doesn't erase the facts that fundamental freedoms are continously stripped from us with nowadays lousy justifications (their favourite: 'for security reasons'). The constant worldwide Anti-Semitism screamings - IMHO - are simply a tool to keep the people in a state of hate and distrust. I chose to give my impression on David Icke for reasons of explaining but that's it. What difference does it make if republican or democrat anyways? Not one. As the money rules the world. BTW wonderful song of Michael "Money".

Love you all :bearhug:
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Magic_Love_4U on May 25, 2012, 03:28:25 AM
Sometimes these things are just funny to read, that people are so sensetive to these stuff stunnes me.
Who cares if a person is a anti semite, that is their problem, who cares if someone is a racist, that is their problem.

Society have done a good job so that people always offend eachother without even knowing it and then be called names.
If I would say something to offend a jew, then I am a anti semite.
If I say something offensive to a black person then I am a racist.
If I say something offensive to an overweight person, then I am a bully.

Please stop this childish behavior, no wait, not even children do these things because they know better.

Stop judging people, calling them names and say that they are this and that when u don't even know the person.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: AKHTONI on May 25, 2012, 07:20:21 AM
AHA yesterday it was locked good that you reopened it

I will respond this scream .he think himself something  >:(
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: AKHTONI on May 25, 2012, 07:58:04 AM
my name is all over scream posts what happened to you?

Quote
AKHTONI'S post is very clear, you can't say things like "the jews killed each others and they called it holocaust and put the whole blame on hitler" or "I like adolf hitler"

 
did I say which side I like in hitler or you just choose the evil side of him?I think he is genius and there is something fascinating (good) in him. or maybe i am evil i like his evil side? and it's not your bussiness if someone say I like a man and because you don't like him means I am wrong and you are right ok.

the "whole blame" he didn't do it alone the jews are included we are not stupid to believe it. and it's not your bussiness to make me believe what you want

Quote
"when a jew say yes ,I say NO I can't trust them they don't do what they say"


it's clear from a muslim to a jew . and it's me. what's antisimitic here

Quote
That is also the reason why it is so important to remember, so saying the Holocaust is just used for political benefits these days is wrong. It happened, if we forget, it's bound to happen again,

like @MissG said it's happennig now in palestine iraq afghanistan and happened before in bosnia. or maybe it's not a holocaust? because they are not jews? they are christians and muslims and don't worry nothing will happen to the jews again since you are controling the world

Quote
but you also know that AKHTONI could never post what he or she posted on a German forum. Not because there is no free speech, but because this kind of hate speech is against our laws

and you are controling the media too

Quote
Like they blame all Jews for what Isreal does (I don't agree with a lot that Isreal does, but it's a country first and I don't care that most of the people living there are Jews

the real jews (that i said it's hard to find them) or judaism reject a state to the jews they are not allowed. but you said i don't agree with "alot" what israel does. but you are with israel. means you are not a real jew

Quote
what I meant was actually that they don't react with disgust to AKHTONI'S post but instead attack me and just talk about Zionists and the Holocaust industry. Instead of thinking for one moment how a Jew reading AKHTONI'S post must feel.
 

I like the way you want to put all the members here against me because yi am dangerous . and you the king here. it's the same thing they are using if someone is not good for them he must be banned turn him off
that's how they tried to do to michael with false allegations

Quote
most of the people in this thread don't even speak out against hate speech.

 :WTF: whene someone talk about the jews means it' antisimitics?


one more thing if you think that i will say sorry for what i said you are dreaming

I will continue later.

   




Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 25, 2012, 08:04:13 AM
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AHA yesterday it was locked good that you reopened it

I will respond this scream .he think himself something  >:(

You can respond, but I will not allow an attack on jews in general, not do I want you to say things like 'I like Hitler'. Not for scream, but for me. The Germans, by order of Hitler, have captured my grandfather in the war. He was beaten so hard that he suffered brain damage and turned blind. He never saw his children and grandchildren. So back off on stuff like that.

@Scream, I am giving you ONE more chance to cool down, discuss in a normal way, stop twisting words and let ME handle things here. If that's not possible, I will disable your account for at least a week so you can cool down and actually READ what people are saying here. It seems you are focussing on one member only here to make the whole forum look like Hitler-supporters. Cut it out.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 25, 2012, 08:08:25 AM
AKHTONI, you better lower your voice too, or you can cool off a few days as well. This is not going to turn into a muslim vs jew thread, I think that is being fought out enough in real life. So you can continue, but show some FUCKING respect. Both of you. Damnit, is it so hard to discuss with respect here?
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: suspicious mind on May 25, 2012, 08:15:52 AM
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Sometimes these things are just funny to read, that people are so sensetive to these stuff stunnes me.
Who cares if a person is a anti semite, that is their problem, who cares if someone is a racist, that is their problem.

Society have done a good job so that people always offend eachother without even knowing it and then be called names.
If I would say something to offend a jew, then I am a anti semite.
If I say something offensive to a black person then I am a racist.
If I say something offensive to an overweight person, then I am a bully.

Please stop this childish behavior, no wait, not even children do these things because they know better.

Stop judging people, calling them names and say that they are this and that when u don't even know the person.

good post

one would think that truth with love could equal peace
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 25, 2012, 08:59:51 AM
"The effect of the second war died around 2% of the world's population at the time (about 60 million people), most of them civilians, despite the fact that there are versions more pessimists who say died approximately 70 million people, (61,000,000 of the allies and 12,000,000 of the axis powers)."


With this what i am saying is that all human lives are valuable.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 25, 2012, 09:31:21 AM
@Scream:

Quote
And if I'm supposed to respect someone's feelings if the feeling is liking Hitler and hating the Jews,

THIS is twisting words to suit an agenda because NO ONE told you to RESPECT these things, YOU invented that sentiment and then proceeded to become outraged by it. This is why I accuse you of being disingenuous. Before you go off again, I suggest you reread the thread, or actually, READ it, because I assure you, NO ONE told you to respect any one else's sentiment.

You can have a respectful debate without respecting your opponent's stance. But the problem is, I don't think you even grasp what the other members are communicating. You seem blinded by your hate and fear. Intelligent people are able to calmly evaluate what is being expressed by the opposition and hold a discussion based on the debate points raised. Respectful discussions push the dialogue forward and benefit us all. Screaming hotheads who put words in people's mouths put all of mankind back a rung or twelve. We are here to discuss the 'what if's' of the world and get closer to the truth by doing so, not to attack each other and wrestle in the mud like pigs.

+1 for Souza, because she made the point quite clear.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Adi on May 25, 2012, 10:15:51 AM
Scream,

You are making massive, sweeping generalisations and ASSumptions of the members of this Forum based on the post of ONE member of this Forum.

YOUR posts are VERY offensive to me and probably the MAJORITY of EVERYONE here. YOU do not KNOW the background OF anyone here....so I suggest you shut the f*ck up with your accusations, assumptions and generalisations.

I do not agree with what AKHTONI wrote at all. I find it abhorrent and quite frankly revolting. However, your post's imply that because the entire Forum membership has not come here to condemn AKHTONI's filth, we are anti-semitic?

YOU are using Front, whoever Front may be, in a weird, twisted guilt trip, smoke em' out  manner. You have an agenda, no doubt. YOU are the one that needs to take a look in that mirror and "make that change". 


Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 25, 2012, 10:22:41 AM
Well said, Adi, on all counts.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Shamone Jackson on May 25, 2012, 10:42:39 AM
Sigh!  I'm all for finding out everyone's honest opinions but it shouldn't apply with certain subjects.  There are 3 subjects that should never be discussed in the office...and in this case, on the forum:  Race, Religion and Politics.  There will only be hurt feelings and misunderstandings. 
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 25, 2012, 10:49:19 AM
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THIS is twisting words to suit an agenda because NO ONE told you to RESPECT these things, YOU invented that sentiment and then proceeded to become outraged by it.

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All people experience things from their perspective, and you cannot deny people what they feel or experience.



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Sometimes these things are just funny to read, that people are so sensetive to these stuff stunnes me.
Who cares if a person is a anti semite, that is their problem, who cares if someone is a racist, that is their problem.

Society have done a good job so that people always offend eachother without even knowing it and then be called names.
If I would say something to offend a jew, then I am a anti semite.
If I say something offensive to a black person then I am a racist.
If I say something offensive to an overweight person, then I am a bully.

Please stop this childish behavior, no wait, not even children do these things because they know better.

Stop judging people, calling them names and say that they are this and that when u don't even know the person.

Who cares if Hitler was an anti-Semite, that was his problem.
Who cares if Neo-Nazis are anti-Semites and xenophobic, that's their problem, even when they kill migrants in the streets of Germany.
Who cares if Neo-Nazis are anti-Semites, that's their problem, even if they desecrate Jewish graves.
Who cares if Mottola is racist, that's his problem.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Magic_Love_4U on May 25, 2012, 11:09:08 AM
Just don't feed into it.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 25, 2012, 11:10:48 AM
Oh good Scream, I'm glad you located the accurate quote. Read carefully what MJonmind wrote and then compare it to your interpretation. She is right. Your interpretation of her words was incorrect. These misunderstandings can be prevented by reading the words that are typed. You CANNOT deny those things. You DO NOT HAVE TO RESPECT them, but you cannot deny them.

Feel free to discuss your own feelings, perspective, and experience. Just stop putting words in people's mouths.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: RK on May 25, 2012, 11:33:31 AM
@_Scream_....you are doing many of the members of this forum a real injustice by insinuating that we do not speak out against genocides and racism. If you set aside your outrage and really read what has been said, you will find the majority here are  against all violence aimed at any ethnic group, and not solely just the Jewish people. I am ashamed of what happened to the aborigines here where I live in Australia and my husband is a Serbian who is deeply ashamed of what happened in his home country. We do not recognize labels in my household... our ideology is that there is only one race...the human race. We all deserve to be treated with honour and respect. 
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 25, 2012, 11:43:00 AM
People on here are interested in Michael Jackson and the symbolism in his music and short films, right? He definitely doesn't like racism and he doesn't like Hitler, he also doesn't think no one should care if people are racist or anti-Semitic, he said it best in his music and short films, if you still feel it's ok to link to websites that for example promote the anti-Semitic Protocols of the Elders of Zion, then I am powerless, if even Michael Jackson can't convince you, you won't listen to me. Michael's message in his music and short films and in his interviews and speeches is also the reason why I know if Front is Michael, he would address this and not look away:

Michael Jackson - Black Or White (Complete Version) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dgAaCUa4nM)

Pay close attention from 8:40 to 8:55, look at the car windows.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Grace on May 25, 2012, 12:07:28 PM
Quote
Antisemitism (also spelled anti-semitism or anti-Semitism) is suspicion of, hatred toward, or discrimination (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination) against Jews (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews) for reasons connected to their Jewish (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judaism) heritage. In a 2005 U.S. governmental report, antisemitism is defined as "hatred toward Jews—individually and as a group—that can be attributed to the Jewish religion and/or ethnicity."[1] A person who holds such views is called an "antisemite". Antisemitism may be manifested in many ways, ranging from expressions of hatred of or discrimination (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination) against individual Jews to organized violent attacks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pogroms) by mobs, state police, or even military attacks on entire Jewish communities. Extreme instances of persecution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews) include the pogroms (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pogroms) which preceded the First Crusade (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews_in_the_First_Crusade) in 1096, the expulsion from England (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edict_of_Expulsion) in 1290, the massacres of Spanish Jews (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Spain#Massacre_of_1391) in 1391, the persecutions of the Spanish Inquisition (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Inquisition), the expulsion from Spain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alhambra_decree) in 1492, the expulsion from Portugal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_in_Portugal) in 1497, various Russian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Russia) pogroms, the Dreyfus Affair (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreyfus_Affair), and the Final Solution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Final_Solution) by Hitler's Germany (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_Germany) and official Soviet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_the_Soviet_Union) anti-Jewish policies. While the term's etymology (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etymology) might suggest that antisemitism is directed against all Semitic peoples (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic#Ancient_Semitic_peoples), the term was coined in the late 19th century in Germany as a more scientific-sounding term for Judenhass ("Jew-hatred"),[2] and that has been its normal use since then.[3]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism)




Quote
The First Amendment to the United States Constitution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution) guarantees freedom of speech (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_speech), which allows political organizations great latitude in expressing Nazi, racist, anti-Semitic, homophobic, and Neo-Confederate (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-Confederate) views.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-Nazism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-Nazism)




Anti semitism in the U.S. (an example).

Quote
The trial and execution of Ethel and Julius Rosenberg took place in an atmosphere of continuing and intense antisemitism in the United States. At the time of their arrest, and as the trial progressed, the case appeared open and shut: according to the steady stream of news reports the Rosenbergs had provided atomic secrets to the Soviet Union resulting in that country, according to Judge Kaufman, having the bomb years before the Russians otherwise would have. More recently government files revealed that, while espionage had provided “atomic” secrets to Russia, the spy involved was not Julius Rosenberg but a scientist working on the top secret “Manhattan Project” and secondarily by a 19 year old Harvard student also working on the project. The Russians tested their first bomb in 1949. Those recently released government documents also disclosed that, not only were the real sources of those atomic secrets known before the Rosenbergs went to trial, but that the FBI and government prosecutors were aware also that Julius Rosenberg had provided the Russians information on radar (http://www.pbs.org/redfiles/kgb/inv/kgb_inv_ins.htm), not the bomb. Regarding Ethel Rosenberg, “declassified documents now show that decrypted information reporting that Ethelwas NOT involved in Soviet spy work (http://www.pbs.org/redfiles/kgb/inv/kgb_inv_ins.htm) was passed to the FBI… the government knew she did not commit [the crime].”   The FBI had implicated Ethel in order to coerce her husband to cooperate in other on-going investigations.   “The Rosenbergs were convicted (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_and_Ethel_Rosenberg) on March 29, 1951, and on April 5 were sentenced to death.”
Antisemitism in American politics, part 2: the Rosenberg Show Trial | Jerusalem Post - Blogs (http://blogs.jpost.com/content/antisemitism-american-politics-part-2-rosenberg-show-trial)



Extremism.

Quote
A Knights of the Ku Klux Klan event, held in Fairdale, Kentucky, in August 2006, was a joint event with the neo-Nazi National Socialist Movement (http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/The_National_Socialist_Movement.asp) (NSM), billed as a “Unity Rally.”  This was just one of many recent attempts by a variety of Ku Klux Klan groups to coordinate their activities with the Minneapolis-based NSM (http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/The_National_Socialist_Movement.asp), which became the largest neo-Nazi group in the United States in 2006. 
Ku Klux Klan -- Extremism in America (http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/kkk/affiliations.asp?LEARN_Cat=Extremism&LEARN_SubCat=Extremism_in_America&xpicked=4&item=kkk)



Minneapolis, MO - where Propofol is discussed to be introduced for executing death penalty.
Propofol -- Now Used to Kill People ... On Purpose | TMZ.com (http://www.tmz.com/2012/05/24/propofol-conrad-murray-missouri-michael-jackson/)



I think this needs no further comment.

(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/gallery/66_25_05_12_5_03_09.jpeg) (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/gallery/66_25_05_12_5_03_09.jpeg)

(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/gallery/66_25_05_12_5_03_49.jpeg) (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/gallery/66_25_05_12_5_03_49.jpeg)


Michael never looked away.

We remember well the smear campaigns of the British tabloids concerning Michael and Hitler.
It's about time the truth is being said about this as well.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 25, 2012, 12:09:41 PM
back no like the neo-cons that's for sure.

Though I always thought he meant neo-conservatives, but that's another topic. I think.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on May 25, 2012, 12:10:11 PM
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Sigh!  I'm all for finding out everyone's honest opinions but it shouldn't apply with certain subjects.  There are 3 subjects that should never be discussed in the office...and in this case, on the forum:  Race, Religion and Politics.  There will only be hurt feelings and misunderstandings.

We have to discuss race,religion,and politics because those are some of the main things that are keeping us divided.  I think you're right about there being a lot of misunderstandings.  This is the reason that we have to work it all out but we have to do it respectfully.  Most of the time there is fear and lack of information.  We all have to share our ideas,thoughts,perspectives and information so we can get closer to the truth.  There's propoganda,media control,education control everywhere.  There are different views and perspectives about everything and no one knows everything.  We don't know the truth about history, science,etc.etc.  We are just trying to get closer to the truth.  There are people from all around the world here so that is good.  TPTB don't want us to unite. 
We have to get "smart" and stop the attacking and the name calling.  That's what they want.  Our enemies are not people just like us in a foreign country or of a different religion or race.  We're all the same and we want the same things.
We're all one.  Spread information and truth so that we can come together. 

Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 25, 2012, 12:34:31 PM
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I think this needs no further comment.

(http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/gallery/66_25_05_12_5_03_09.jpeg) (http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/gallery/66_25_05_12_5_03_09.jpeg)

Michael never looked away.

Thank you for the screenshot, Grace .... if you look at the first car window he smashes, it says "Hitler lives", you might have to watch it full screen and pause the video shortly before he smashes it.

P.S. I want to add that this is not meant literal (although there are those Nazis and Neo-Nazis who think Hitler is alive and escaped to Atlantis - Michael doesn't believe that obviously, maybe in this context it is meant literal), "Hitler lives" means Nazism/Neo-Nazism lives (see "I like Hitler").
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Grace on May 25, 2012, 12:43:37 PM
Think outside of the box.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 25, 2012, 12:58:00 PM
(http://uploadpad.com/files/blackandwhite.jpg)
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Tink on May 25, 2012, 01:26:38 PM
UNITED WE STAND - divided we fall. It's what we must do, to help each other.

I'm not surprised to find out that so many of us have had older relatives beaten on, murdered during WW2 - and I'm sure it goes back to WW1 (as in my family's case - my own grandmama). We had to pay to get her back, from the Bolshevics...if you all noticed, it all revolves around the have/have nots. My family paid, paid, paid - until we had nothing left - after we got as many people out, between two world wars. I regret nothing. At least in the 1990s, the TRUTH was restored!

Bayer is one of the main culprits, in WW2; what was being held over their heads? Hugo Boss?

Dr. Porsche was held under threat of his entire family being exterminated, if he didn't design tanks. There is a human element, when you look close enough.

The arrogance of the Nazi party, fortunately, was their downfall. They thought they were unsinkable - just like the titanic. Even when his generals were telling him otherwise, Hitler couldn't comprehend they were losing. He'd kill those who told him anything negative, from what I understand.

60,000,000 people, in total, sounds correct to me - those starved all over, not just in Germany and Poland. This was a Global Catastrophe.

In the end? WE BETTER LEARN from WW2, Korean war. The Vietnam War was a border war - so of course, it was doomed. Which is why it was foolhardy to invade Iraq, under any circumstances. If you can't close the borders, it just doesn't work.

You then have to look at WHO benefits from war: the suppliers of weaponry, etc.

Right now, Afghanistan is suffering a HUGE Polio outbreak, which is listed on the BBC - it's heartbreaking! Kids who'll never be able to walk right, without braces - all because daddies thought the vaccine would render kids infertile. My entire family is a bunch of "Fertile Myrtles," and everyone's had that one, along with all the other vaccines. Hasn't stopped the babies from coming.

As for the B&W video? That graphitti was ALL added, after the initial airing - to make the violence acceptable. I thoroughly enjoyed it the way it was aired - UNALTERED - here's a COMPARISON: (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/dc/Blackorwhite_comparison.jpg)

It's from here - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_or_White (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_or_White)

So, do the research first, when it comes to Michael. I love it when he messes with people's heads, and does things his way.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 25, 2012, 01:55:13 PM
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As for the B&W video? That graphitti was ALL added, after the initial airing - to make the violence acceptable.

Yes, it was .... to make the message clear. That's why it is so wrong that they put the version without it on the Vision DVD.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: BeTheChange on May 25, 2012, 02:16:13 PM
@scream...I'm not sure if you've (mis)interpreted someone here as saying or thinking that Mike 'liked' Hitler or condoned any of his actions, but I've yet to see anyone express that.  And if anyone did, they'd be wrong based on what we do know about Mike.  We are all very aware of Mike's messages and what he stood for....which did ALSO include tolerance, compassion, understanding and love.  Yes, Mike never looked away...but he also never approached with hate.  He didn't wish he could've spoken with Hitler so he could've blasted his ass...he wanted to bring love to evil.  In fact, no matter the injustice that Mike spoke against...he always premised it with a message of love first and foremost, even for people who harbor evil at their core, like Hitler.

I also don't get your whole 'Front isn't Mike if he doesn't speak up' argument.  Out of ALL the criteria/evidence we have at our disposal to make an educated guess as to Front's authenticity (regardless of whether or not he's Mike)....that argument or point, IMO, is weak.  I completely agree that Mike would NOT approve of nor partake in an anti-semitic forum, or one run by someone who expressed those views.  As far as I know, Souza is the one who runs it with bec's help.  Are you accusing them of being anti-semitic?  If so, where's your proof?  If you are not accusing them, then what exactly would Front need to speak out about?  One comment posted by one member out of 5000+ members?  I could probably see some logic in your argument if Souza and/or bec were condoning Aktoni's post or the hate-filled sentiments...but they have both been clear on where they stand with that.  As admin and mod, they have also both warned Aktoni, you and every other member about being offensive to other members. 

But that doesn't seem like it's 'good enough' for you...it's like you want or need Front to come out and rip a strip off Aktoni.  But if Mike wouldn't have done that with Hitler....what makes you think he would with Aktoni?  If it's just a matter of wanting/needing Front to speak up to appease you...so that you know where he stands....well, then that shouldn't be necessary either, since you've stated that you know where Mike stands on the topic.  And if it's about you wanting/needing him to address/manage the forum as a whole, well, that's what the admin and mod are here for...and they have, and are, maintaining the integrity of the forum that he has chosen to post on. 

So, ya....IMO, your 'Front isn't Mike' argument is weak.  Is there some other agenda going on?

With L.O.V.E. always.

Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: _Scream_ on May 25, 2012, 02:49:19 PM
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@scream...I'm not sure if you've (mis)interpreted someone here as saying or thinking that Mike 'liked' Hitler or condoned any of his actions, but I've yet to see anyone express that.

When a Michael Jackson fan says "I like Hitler" and "the Jews killed each other and blamed Hitler" and in a second post makes it very clear that he or she meant every word, when Michael Jackson fans post links to anti-Semitic websites run by Holocaust deniers, they didn't get anything, they don't get Michael's message and they also don't get that Michael as a black man would have been murdered, his entire family would have been murdered in Nazi Germany. So how can any Michael Jackson fan go totally against his message and not realize that they are even offending Michael as a black man?

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Yes, Mike never looked away...but he also never approached with hate.  He didn't wish he could've spoken with Hitler so he could've blasted his ass...he wanted to bring love to evil.  In fact, no matter the injustice that Mike spoke against...he always premised it with a message of love first and foremost, even for people who harbor evil at their core, like Hitler.

Well, that's what he said, but did you see his anger and aggression in the video? Fact is, yes, I also wish I could just speak to evil people and love them and then they'd turn into good people. But Hitler was a sociopath, anti-Semite and racist, Michael as a black man would have never gotten close to him, he would have been killed instead. You can have your wishes and hopes, but you still have to see reality. Maybe talking about Hitler in this context makes things look too far away .... do you think just talking to Saddam and loving him would have stopped him from killing people? Would have turned him into a nice and caring guy? Yes, we can dream, we can have visions, but you can't take them literal. Sociopaths are a fact of life, they exist, Michael had a lot of them in his life as well and couldn't change them or stop them from doing evil things to him.

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I also don't get your whole 'Front isn't Mike if he doesn't speak up' argument.  Out of ALL the criteria/evidence we have at our disposal to make an educated guess as to Front's authenticity (regardless of whether or not he's Mike)....that argument or point, IMO, is weak.

It's not weak. He chose this forum to post on and there are things posted on here that go totally against what Michael stands for, what he voiced in every interview and speech and in a lot of his songs and short films, he can rip people like Frenchbraid a new one for posting things that are completely harmless and didn't have any impact on the world as such compared to what some people posted in this thread, but he looks away when hate speech is posted? That doesn't make any sense. Of course I still don't know if he even saw this thread yet, so I'm still waiting, I never said he has to react within minutes. But if there won't be a reaction soon or in his next few posts, then for me that means he is fake. Nobody has to agree with me, but if he doesn't address the important things in this world that need to change, especially now that all this was posted on the forum that is his home, he can't be Michael. back stopped posting on MJJC because people posted negative things about Michael's family after addressing it first, but there was no change, so he left. If Front is back is Michael, this is just as important or even more important for the world as a whole.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 25, 2012, 02:51:09 PM
The original meaning of the BoW video was about breaking free from the industry, letting them know he can't be fucked with anymore. After all the complaints about the violence, he added the grafitti. Two birds -> one stone.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 25, 2012, 02:54:40 PM
Scream has left us for at least a week or two, I warned her more than once.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 25, 2012, 03:26:18 PM
Also called my attention That in the years of the 2nd World War the Jews controlled Many half in North America and Europe and Were owners of industry propaganda of U.S. cinematic. States and if you do not believe I invite you to see a documentary Called That HOLLYWOODISM talks about the history of the founders of Hollywood. Also there are Many Jews linked to insdutria But this does not anymore mean there is no other That ethnic group That Makes This Kind of movies, But MOST of the largest Producers of This type of film is of Jewish origin Mainly Which Have An aberrant sexual content of sadomasochism. Also called the attention the origin of large banking positions in the world of finance Such as the IMF, the World Bank, and the federal reserve of the United States. UU.Aunque this does not want to say That They Have the guilt of all evil in the world Because she exists in Any race or group But nobody is favorite of God, or we are all or none the we are, no one is exclusive of evil But there is CHOSEN race for me nor are all children of God. About the neo-Nazi sources very careful Must Be Because They Are much extremism and the source is without Credibility That fanaticism is bad WHERE it comes.





(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/dc/Blackorwhite_comparison.jpg)























Quote
Hollywoodism: Jews, Movies, and the American Dream

      Credit writer-director Simcha Jacobovici with ambition: to convert Neal Gabler's 420-page book study, An Empire of Their Own: How The Jews Invented Hollywood, into a coherent documentary. Hollywoodism: Jews, Movies, and the American Dream, playing at the Coolidge Corner,is quite a film story, of how a group of impoverished Jews immigrants from Eastern European shtetls eventually became czars of the studio system: Carl Laemmle and Adolph Zukor at Universal, Louis B. Mayer at MGM, Harry Cohn at Columbia, and the three Warner Brothers. The movies they green-lighted were thematic affirmations of their own rags-to-unbelievable riches sagas: asserting that anyone with chutzpah can make it in the USA, including little guys and outsiders, that there's an inevitable happy ending at the end of the rainbow. Since everybody went to Hollywood movies, and breathed the utopian cant of studio product, these Jewish moguls could be said to have invented "the American Dream."

     Hollywoodism provides sagacious observations from Jewish film critics and studio historians, including Gabler, J. Hoberman, and Jonathan Rosenbaum, and prime footage of the Jewish bosses: i.e., Mayer pontificating before the American Legion, Laemmle lecturing his employees, "I will not have quitters or lazy men working for Universal," and with the thickest of Yiddish accents. But Jacobovici's film is weirdly schizophrenic. The first half is Jewish boosterism, proud crowing about how these lowly Jews ascended in Hollywood. Only one historian mentions that these studio heads "were ruthless, badly mistreated women." The second half (more credible) is often a finger-wagging at these same bosses for hiding their Jewishness, for forcing Jewish actors to change their names to gentile ones, for doing movies which always pushed assimilation, for being totally cowardly before World War II about making anti-Nazi movies, for being gutless a second time in cooperating with HUAC in purging Hollywood of supposed Communists.

     A couple of problems: (a) the film bunches 20th Century Fox with the Jewish-run studios, but William Fox was a gentile. In actuality, Fox was known as "the goyisher studio." Including the final scene from Fox's The Grapes of Wrath to illustrate a "root for the underdog" Jewish point of view is simply an untruth: the filmmaker, John Ford, and the producer, Darryl F. Zanuck, are likewise Christian.

     (b) It's certainly stretching film history to describe the era of the Jewish bosses as being an enlightened time for blacks on screen, as opposed to, earlier, when WASPs were in control and the pro-Klan The Birth of a Nation was the par. Yes, there were several all-black musicals made in '30s Hollywood, but otherwise blacks were stereotyped as maids, eye-rolling porters, and shuffling, muddle-headed servants in countless films made by Zucker, Mayer, the Warners, and Harry Cohn. Curiously, Jacobovici shows a flagrant example of Jewish racism without criticizing it in his voiceover: Al Jolson switching from singing in the synagogue to doing "Mammy" in blackface in the Warner Brothers' The Jazz Singer.

GERALD PEARY
Boston Phoenix, September, 1998






Gerald Peary - film reviews - Hollywoodism: Jews, Movies, and the American Dream (http://www.geraldpeary.com/reviews/ghi/hollywoodism.html)
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MissG on May 25, 2012, 03:46:00 PM
Well, I was smelling the cake on this one as well.

Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: sweetsunsetwithMJ on May 25, 2012, 05:14:12 PM
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Also called my attention That in the years of the 2nd World War the Jews controlled Many half in North America and Europe and Were owners of industry propaganda of U.S. cinematic. States and if you do not believe I invite you to see a documentary Called That HOLLYWOODISM talks about the history of the founders of Hollywood. Also there are Many Jews linked to insdutria But this does not anymore mean there is no other That ethnic group That Makes This Kind of movies, But MOST of the largest Producers of This type of film is of Jewish origin Mainly Which Have An aberrant sexual content of sadomasochism. Also called the attention the origin of large banking positions in the world of finance Such as the IMF, the World Bank, and the federal reserve of the United States. UU.Aunque this does not want to say That They Have the guilt of all evil in the world Because she exists in Any race or group But nobody is favorite of God, or we are all or none the we are, no one is exclusive of evil But there is CHOSEN race for me nor are all children of God. About the neo-Nazi sources very careful Must Be Because They Are much extremism and the source is without Credibility That fanaticism is bad WHERE it comes.





(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/dc/Blackorwhite_comparison.jpg)























Quote
Hollywoodism: Jews, Movies, and the American Dream

      Credit writer-director Simcha Jacobovici with ambition: to convert Neal Gabler's 420-page book study, An Empire of Their Own: How The Jews Invented Hollywood, into a coherent documentary. Hollywoodism: Jews, Movies, and the American Dream, playing at the Coolidge Corner,is quite a film story, of how a group of impoverished Jews immigrants from Eastern European shtetls eventually became czars of the studio system: Carl Laemmle and Adolph Zukor at Universal, Louis B. Mayer at MGM, Harry Cohn at Columbia, and the three Warner Brothers. The movies they green-lighted were thematic affirmations of their own rags-to-unbelievable riches sagas: asserting that anyone with chutzpah can make it in the USA, including little guys and outsiders, that there's an inevitable happy ending at the end of the rainbow. Since everybody went to Hollywood movies, and breathed the utopian cant of studio product, these Jewish moguls could be said to have invented "the American Dream."

     Hollywoodism provides sagacious observations from Jewish film critics and studio historians, including Gabler, J. Hoberman, and Jonathan Rosenbaum, and prime footage of the Jewish bosses: i.e., Mayer pontificating before the American Legion, Laemmle lecturing his employees, "I will not have quitters or lazy men working for Universal," and with the thickest of Yiddish accents. But Jacobovici's film is weirdly schizophrenic. The first half is Jewish boosterism, proud crowing about how these lowly Jews ascended in Hollywood. Only one historian mentions that these studio heads "were ruthless, badly mistreated women." The second half (more credible) is often a finger-wagging at these same bosses for hiding their Jewishness, for forcing Jewish actors to change their names to gentile ones, for doing movies which always pushed assimilation, for being totally cowardly before World War II about making anti-Nazi movies, for being gutless a second time in cooperating with HUAC in purging Hollywood of supposed Communists.

     A couple of problems: (a) the film bunches 20th Century Fox with the Jewish-run studios, but William Fox was a gentile. In actuality, Fox was known as "the goyisher studio." Including the final scene from Fox's The Grapes of Wrath to illustrate a "root for the underdog" Jewish point of view is simply an untruth: the filmmaker, John Ford, and the producer, Darryl F. Zanuck, are likewise Christian.

     (b) It's certainly stretching film history to describe the era of the Jewish bosses as being an enlightened time for blacks on screen, as opposed to, earlier, when WASPs were in control and the pro-Klan The Birth of a Nation was the par. Yes, there were several all-black musicals made in '30s Hollywood, but otherwise blacks were stereotyped as maids, eye-rolling porters, and shuffling, muddle-headed servants in countless films made by Zucker, Mayer, the Warners, and Harry Cohn. Curiously, Jacobovici shows a flagrant example of Jewish racism without criticizing it in his voiceover: Al Jolson switching from singing in the synagogue to doing "Mammy" in blackface in the Warner Brothers' The Jazz Singer.

GERALD PEARY
Boston Phoenix, September, 1998






Gerald Peary - film reviews - Hollywoodism: Jews, Movies, and the American Dream (http://www.geraldpeary.com/reviews/ghi/hollywoodism.html)

Did you see the "NO MORE WET BACKS" message, I think Michael is probably claiming the right of Mexicans to have a decent life in the States.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on May 25, 2012, 05:34:22 PM
This is just my two cents.  Discrimination and prejudice is one of the main problems.  I'm not pointing fingers or blaming.  I'm just talking generally.  We never want to judge someone or even a group without knowing them.  We can't blame a whole nationality,race, or religion for the actions of a few.  There's always corrupt people within any group.   We can't generalize and say horrible things about each other constantly.  Such as Muslims are _____, Jews are this______, Japanese are _______ Italians are ________ and so on.   I can fill in the blanks with things I heard but I don't want to spread these things any further.   

This is all RIDICULOUS.  We really have to end it.  United we stand and divided we fall just like Tink said. 

We lose control if we let these things divide us.  Did you guys know that there were thousands of Japanese Americans detained in concentration camps in the US during WWII also.  These were innocent American citizens discriminated against just because they were Japanese.   

Love   

Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ilovemjforever on May 25, 2012, 08:49:42 PM
The bigger picture is the most powerful people in the world are Zionists and Satanists.They are not real Jews.This is where the confusion comes in,imo.I dont see Jews as being evil,but the fake ones are.The bible refers to them as the Synagogue of Satan,these people are pure evil,i think some times people forget that there is a big difference between the real Jews and the counterfeit Jews.Maybe Scream forgot to consider this fact.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on May 25, 2012, 09:24:54 PM
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The bigger picture is the most powerful people in the world are Zionists and Satanists.They are not real Jews.This is where the confusion comes in,imo.I dont see Jews as being evil,but the fake ones are.The bible refers to them as the Synagogue of Satan,these people are pure evil,i think some times people forget that there is a big difference between the real Jews and the counterfeit Jews.Maybe Scream forgot to consider this fact.

I agree. 
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 25, 2012, 09:47:50 PM
Totally off topic but I would expect that even if he had intentions before, Front will purposely not address this JUST BECAUSE scream made this ultimatum. Front doesn't seem real interested in convincing anyone nor accepting any challenges to "prove" his identity.

I have a feeling that his goal is to passively do the exact opposite.

Quote
But if there won't be a reaction soon or in his next few posts, then for me that means he is fake.

I think that pretty much seals it.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 25, 2012, 10:40:24 PM
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Totally off topic but I would expect that even if he had intentions before, Front will purposely not address this JUST BECAUSE scream made this ultimatum. Front doesn't seem real interested in convincing anyone nor accepting any challenges to "prove" his identity.

I have a feeling that his goal is to passively do the exact opposite.

Quote
But if there won't be a reaction soon or in his next few posts, then for me that means he is fake.

I think that pretty much seals it.

+1
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: AirSlide on May 25, 2012, 11:21:07 PM
Not everyone who claims to be of Judah is actually of Judah.
The true children of Judah suffer greatly because of those who want to steal their identity.
It is these self same identity thieves that have created the term "anti-semite" and they use it as a scare tactic.


Revalation 3:[9] Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 26, 2012, 12:18:09 AM
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Not everyone who claims to be of Judah is actually of Judah.
The true children of Judah suffer greatly because of those who want to steal their identity.
It is these self same identity thieves that have created the term "anti-semite" and they use it as a scare tactic.


Revalation 3:[9] Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Hey, thanks for the scripture. I have read that phrase a hundred times and only now I get it. How stupid!
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: AirSlide on May 26, 2012, 12:36:54 AM
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Hey, thanks for the scripture. I have read that phrase a hundred times and only now I get it. How stupid!

I don't think you or anyone else here is stupid.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MJonmind on May 26, 2012, 02:26:45 AM
(I don't necessarily agree with everything in any of the following sites.)

IMO it is correct to say that Zionist 'Jews' carried out the elimination of 'lesser' Jews, for their own agenda  (part of which was the creation of the state of Israel). This is verified by Jews themselves. There are branches of the lineage of Jews.

(So Scream, then why are even many Jews themselves so-called 'holocaust deniers' if they give a controversial version, opposing the officially taught version?) I know what you'll say, they are 'self-loathing Jews'.  Perhaps many Jews are actually honest about searching for truth, which I totally believe. This is a book so it takes a little time to load.

http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/resources/onlinebooks/Holocaust%20Victims%20Accuse.pdf (http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/resources/onlinebooks/Holocaust%20Victims%20Accuse.pdf)
Also this Jews speaking out:  Real Jew News (http://www.realjewnews.com/)

Some posters above are getting into some related topics, that give a hint at how absolutely VAST and deep is this rabbit hole, how it interconnects everything together. And I'm not over-stating that. In fact it is the MOTHER of all rabbit holes. If there is fear and threats towards people who go there, it means it's very important to understanding the bigger picture and how 'they' control us.

Airslide
Quote
Revalation 3:[9] Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
IloveMJforever
Quote
The bigger picture is the most powerful people in the world are Zionists and Satanists.They are not real Jews.This is where the confusion comes in,imo.I dont see Jews as being evil,but the fake ones are.The bible refers to them as the Synagogue of Satan,these people are pure evil,i think some times people forget that there is a big difference between the real Jews and the counterfeit Jews.Maybe Scream forgot to consider this fact.
Jew Watch News (http://www.jewwatch.com/)

Who really are the Jews? Who are the Biblical Israelites? I've posted plenty elsewhere on my take on this. Here are two huge sites for a LOT of reading if you are interested. It might give some background going back before 1900 and back to Biblical times.
 
Israelite Heritage (http://www.hebrewisraelites.org/)  Scroll down for topic titles.
   Two titles in this site to start:
         Jewsandslavery (http://www.hebrewisraelites.org/jewsandslavery.htm)
         New Page 1 (http://www.angelfire.com/ill/hebrewisrael/printpages/edomkharzars.html)

Stewart Synopsis (http://www.stewartsynopsis.com/)  Click on site topics on the left.

I just want to say something about Scream's tactics and what they would sound like in a courtroom. (Sorry if it sounds lame. :icon_redface:)

Defense lawyer --Your honor, I would like to give some clear evidence as to why the defendant did not commit this crime.
Prosecuting lawyer--I object. This lawyer is a pig, a stupid man, and visits pubs.
Judge -- Over-ruled. I want to hear what the evidence is.
Presecuting  --I want that lawyer thrown out of court for his reputation of lying. Everyone can see how ridiculous his arguments will be, because we all know this defendant is guilty.

I'm not very good at giving a proper example, but this is the nature of not really considering what critics of the official story have to say, before blasting them as anti-semitic and holocaust-deniers. This would never happen in a real court of law, at least I hope not. I hope I make some kind of sense. 10 years ago or so when I started on my 'leaving no stone unturned' journey, I initially balked at what I was learning, but as all the related information was becoming clearer, it seemed (to me anyway) that I had to rethink many pre-conceived beliefs.  Believe me I struggled plenty with it, agonizing many times.

Bec
Quote
back no like the neo-cons that's for sure.

Though I always thought he meant neo-conservatives, but that's another topic. I think.
But you were right.
Quote
What the Heck is a ‘Neocon’?
http://www.cfr.org/world/heck-neocon/p5343 (http://www.cfr.org/world/heck-neocon/p5343)

I would think MJ decided what went into the box set, and what to call the box set. He had the final say. The fact that he may have yielded to pressure, tells me his views on things. (This situation is similar to when MJ had to change the lyrics of They don't really care about us, because Jews were offended.)
Quote
The version included in the box set Michael Jackson's Vision is the aired, televised version without the digital graffiti, and does not include the "prejudice is ignorance" title card.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_or_White (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_or_White)

"I chose to take the less traveled road, and this has made all the difference."

Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: SimPattyK on May 26, 2012, 01:02:56 PM
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This is just my two cents.  Discrimination and prejudice is one of the main problems.  I'm not pointing fingers or blaming.  I'm just talking generally.  We never want to judge someone or even a group without knowing them.  We can't blame a whole nationality,race, or religion for the actions of a few.  There's always corrupt people within any group.   We can't generalize and say horrible things about each other constantly.  Such as Muslims are _____, Jews are this______, Japanese are _______ Italians are ________ and so on.   I can fill in the blanks with things I heard but I don't want to spread these things any further.   

This is all RIDICULOUS.  We really have to end it.  United we stand and divided we fall just like Tink said. 

We lose control if we let these things divide us.  Did you guys know that there were thousands of Japanese Americans detained in concentration camps in the US during WWII also.  These were innocent American citizens discriminated against just because they were Japanese.   

Love
^^Fully agree!!  :th_bravo:
Love you dearly  :bearhug:



@AKHTONI: just so you know, that I perfectly understood your thoughts and feelings very well! even though your emotional involvement got in the way of your choosing the right words to express what you actually wanted to say, that's why I think you've got completely misunderstood.
Also I want to give you an advice: when you discuss about such a delicate subject, even more if it's something that gets to you so deeply, write your message, then let it "simmer" on your PC for a few minutes/hours or until the next day, then you'll see how the best words come to you instantly! When you talk about such a delicate subject you cannot afford to leave your emotions speak first, otherwise you get misunderstood in 99,99% of cases, which happened now. Also think that the person to whom you were addressing, probably was not here to try to understand what people say, but only to prove his/her point, if you know what I mean...  :icon_e_wink: Probably even if you had explained perfectly your ideas, your words would still have been twisted and interpreted in the "desired direction"... :icon_evil:

@AKHTONI: Pls don't let this ugly episode affect you too much or too long, come back ... I miss you already  :bearhug:
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: SimPattyK on May 26, 2012, 01:07:04 PM
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The bigger picture is the most powerful people in the world are Zionists and Satanists.They are not real Jews.This is where the confusion comes in,imo.I dont see Jews as being evil,but the fake ones are.The bible refers to them as the Synagogue of Satan,these people are pure evil,i think some times people forget that there is a big difference between the real Jews and the counterfeit Jews.Maybe Scream forgot to consider this fact.

I agree.
+ 1
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MJonmind on May 26, 2012, 02:00:09 PM
Grace quoted from Wiki on Anti-semetic and it also said.
Quote
Current situation
A March 2008 report by the U.S. State Department found that there was an increase in antisemitism across the world, and that both old and new expressions of antisemitism persist.[129]
So pretty much every country in the world has issues with 'Jews' for many centuries?  Now why is that?  They can't all be blind idiots and so irrationally hateful.

Thank you Simpa, for addressing Akhtoni, because I wasn't sure what to say.

Akhtoni, are you Muslim from an arab country, and young as well? Because that will make it more understandable why you say what you say, how you said it. If any group has a feel for what's happening in the middle east, it's the people who live there and have been directly affected by 'Jews' and Israel for centuries. People in the West get a sanitized version, because 'they' run the media, hollywood, governments, education systems, and influence Western Christianity. The official story people say we must promote the Holocaust story because of the slogan, "Never again".  Well "Never again" apparently doesn't include Arab countries like Iraq and Afghanistan, and peoples like the Palestinians who since 1947 have had many slaughters and on-going suffering. But Arabs have all been vilified in the west and characterized as 'Terrorists' by the same media mentioned above.

MJ wants to promote healing for the world and love for all people groups including Jews, so first of all there needs to be an understanding of the truth of history, before solutions can be put into place.  I believe he can and will do this! And it will happen according to God's time schedule.
 :michael_jackson-1135: :michael-jackson: :moonwalk_:
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: SimPattyK on May 26, 2012, 02:24:31 PM
@MjonMind: (http://smileys.sur-la-toile.com/repository/Amour/amoureux-fou3.gif)

Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on May 26, 2012, 02:48:20 PM
You're great at explaining a lot of the same things that I've been thinking MJonMind.   A lot of our thoughts,ideas are based upon what what we hear in school,all types of media,churches etc.  A lot of it is controlled and censored.  The version we get in the west is entirely different.  Nobody gets the real truth unless they dig for it.  We have to help each other spread knowledge and truth and a lot of the misunderstandings will be dissolved.    We have to find out who the real trouble makers are.  It's really not innocent people just like us in a foreign country. 
MJonMind is right about the villifying of the Arabs/Muslims in the west.  The media and government try to make us think they are terrorists.  They make people feel afraid of traveling and going into public places in the city.  This is all crazy.  I'm sure the same thing is going on in the East.  The government and media spreading information about the US and Israel being evil terrorists. 
We have to stop and think.  Who is the evil group behind it all manipulating all this ?  Who is benefiting from the wars and the suffering ?  Follow the money trail.   We can just stop listening to all this propoganda.

Love You All   
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Dontwalkaway on May 26, 2012, 03:18:06 PM
Did anyone see the movie "The Hunger Games".  I saw it last month and I also read most of the book.  It's about teenagers who are selected by the ruling class in order to fight to the death. The rulers say it's the price to pay for freedom.  Ironically, however; none of these people are free.  There are two kids selected by random from each of the twelve districts of the world.  It's a police state and people are afraid to speak up/rebel.  They're fenced in like prisoners.  No one wants to send their kids in to fight because they have to fight to the death.  The elite class watches this on TV and thinks it's a big show.  They also manipulate it by sending in fires,wolves and things like that. 

I was thinking the whole time, "Just stop listening to this elite group, Just don't fight if you're selected to".  If everyone agrees to just stop, then it all stops.

 :icon_e_geek:   
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 26, 2012, 03:47:51 PM
Scream opened a Twitter account ESPECIALLY to slander this forum, just wanted to let you all know: https://twitter.com/#!/_Scream_44 (https://twitter.com/#!/_Scream_44)

Her first tweet is to me, the rest is about the forum in general and you guys. I'm a bit done with people like that slandering this forum simply because they can't read and can't behave.

Quote
@souza81 I wasn't on Twitter but can't contact you via your Contact button.

Thanks for making it very clear where you stand with your hoax forum and that I was banned for speaking out against anti-Semitism posted on your forum. It's ok to post "I like Hitler" on a forum dedicated to Michael Jackson, the user doesn't get banned, the post doesn't get deleted, but you get banned for speaking out against it (after being asked several times to stop addressing the anti-Semitic tone on the forum) and for posting Michael's panther dance with the graffiti on the car windows.

I'm banned now and get the message "I wanrned you several times, seems like it's pretty damn hard to read. Go cool down for a week or two and read what people say. Stop bitching about one member's post." I'll post screenshots of the posts I was "bitching about" so that people can make up their own minds about what you are allowed to post on your forum without getting banned, but you get banned for speaking out against it.

One member actually tried to convince me that there is no anti-Semitism on the forum by posting 3 links to 3 different websites of known Holocaust deniers. They are free to post that, but you are not allowed to tell them that they are following and supporting Holocaust deniers. You get warned for that and then banned.

Not to mention that no other member spoke out against AKHTONI's posts, but they attacked me for speaking out against it. That's what I called deep-rooted anti-Semitism on the forum. That and the admin and one mod also attacking me and only having problems with people who speak out against the anti-Semitic post - but not with that post.

They call themselves Michael Jackson fans or supporters and yet they twist Michael's words better than any tabloid by quoting his speech about the music industry where he says "history books lie". That was clearly about music and music history and how black artists are discriminated against, and yet they twist it and say that he meant the Holocaust among other things. They turn him into an anti-Semite and Holocaust denier who according to them stood there in public denying the Holocaust. Tabloids could learn a thing or two from them.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Magic_Love_4U on May 26, 2012, 03:49:51 PM
I have relatives in Iran.
I must say, they are against the zionists of the ruling class. They know very well what is really going on.
But it is all rigged.
The people have it bad due to their regime so the people want change.
America (dont know if they still are) is playing the "we must help the iranian people against their regime" card, as they have with other countries. And some of the iranian people want that because they don't have it easy there, and especilly now when USA made sure to shut Iran off with the sanctions.

When I write america and israel I mean the rulers and not the people.

America love to play the Hero card.
Sometimes it just feels like a game, that Iran and America and Israel is all in it together. Making sure that the people will panic, to create fear and chaoes. They don't have to go to war, if they want the regime out it is just for them to enter the country and snatch them.

I personally feel that the last real king they had in Iran that really was honest, loving and real was the Shah.
Just as for america JFK was the last real president.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: trublu on May 26, 2012, 04:07:55 PM
I think the world leaders are mostly evil but I don't think it has anything to do with their religion.

Genocide of any race/group of people is horrific.

It's true Hitler was probably very clever, but I think he was pure evil and whatever intelligence may have had is over shadowed by his evil in my opinion.

Holocaust is always a difficult subject to discuss because so many people were affected by it. I think people are still hurting by it and always will be.


I too don't quite get some of the posts on here, but I am assuming that it 's because English is not my first language and the fact that it's quite difficult to get across your point on such a forum sometimes.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: SimPattyK on May 26, 2012, 04:15:50 PM
When talking about --- > (racism/anti-semitism/Hitler/other horrible crimes/conflicts between nations in general), people  need to be VERY careful about what WORDS they use and pay very MUCH attention to the way they formulate their sentences!
I say this^^ having in mind both parties that fought on this thread yesterday! Because both got too emotional and forgot to remain civil and calm in order to understand what the other one was trying to say!


This kind of subject, will always end up with misunderstandings!!
Every time I assisted and/or took part at a debate on this kind of delicate theme, people always ended by fighting. it's sad, but that is what happens! even when people try to remain polite, there are still very strong opposite directions that the opinions go to!


I think everyone is entitled to an opinion. But when certain people lose control of their actions/words and keep insisting on their own version as if it were the absolute truth, then they need to be calmed down. And IMO, Souza, as admin of this forum did the right thing. AKTHONI listened and stopped. But Scream continued against being warned several times.


 This forum, and certain members of this forum (the admins in particular), and also other sites and pages dedicated to the hoax, have been the target of more and more attacks. And when new members step into this forum and start imposing themselves with a certain opinion/attitude, they normally and logically become suspects of being TROLLS, fake fans/beLIEvers! and most of them prove to be fake in the end.


This user, @Scream, has been nothing but aggressive and continues to be like that outside of this forum. This kind of behavior throws even more doubts on the real purpose of his coming here and starting this ugly fight.
I am sure that a true fan/beLIEver, with peaceful intentions, would have managed to give @AKTHONI the chance to explain herself more reasonably and more clearly than she was able to do, taking into account the accusations and the direct attack she was and is STILL receiving, even though she had stopped from posting in this thread way before @Scream got banned! This is absurd!
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Magic_Love_4U on May 26, 2012, 04:29:20 PM
 ??? so if someone is not a beLIEver they are not a true/real Michael Jackson fan?
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: SimPattyK on May 26, 2012, 04:32:41 PM
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??? so if someone is not a beLIEver they are not a true/real Michael Jackson fan?
Do you know what this sign means : / ?
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Magic_Love_4U on May 26, 2012, 04:36:50 PM
no I do not...
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: SimPattyK on May 26, 2012, 04:38:48 PM
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no I do not...
Google (https://www.google.com)
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Magic_Love_4U on May 26, 2012, 04:43:16 PM
Everyone don't have english as their first language.

My orginial question was:
So if someone is not a beLIEver then they are not a real or true Michael Jackson fan?

For me it is enough if someone just loves the other person and it is really just enough if they like the person.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ~Souza~ on May 26, 2012, 05:09:44 PM
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Everyone don't have english as their first language.

My orginial question was:
So if someone is not a beLIEver then they are not a real or true Michael Jackson fan?

For me it is enough if someone just loves the other person and it is really just enough if they like the person.

That's not what she said, she said true fan/beLIEver which means  true fan and/or beLIEver.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Magic_Love_4U on May 26, 2012, 05:19:23 PM
Thank You Souza!

I first thought she meant what I wrote with the / but when you explained she must her ment her usage of it.

Thanx again.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 26, 2012, 05:21:24 PM
Scream, the more likely it is that you're going to be reading this forum, stop lying in your Twitter account, you can't say all that for a person who made a comment in favor of Hitler.


I am not fanatic of anything :icon_evil: :icon_e_confused:
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 26, 2012, 09:19:58 PM
You know the funny thing is, if this thread had stayed locked this wouldn't have happened. It's my fault. I thought it could be salvaged and it was an interesting discussion.

@The Haters: See if Souza had "silenced" everyone and kept the thread locked and didn't allow freedom of speech on this subject, you would have flamed her for it. As it is, we opened this thread back up to allow people to speak their minds and come to the table like adults and all it resulted in was a downward spiral. Now Scream opened a Hate Blog on Twitter ranting about how unfair the admin is. Souza is flamed no matter what she does. She has been the target of a slanderous character assassination campaign against her since late summer of 2009. Try reading through the bullshit. See if you've learned enough throughout this journey to look past the headlines and discover the real truth for yourself instead of just listening to the loudest SCREAM-er.

Still @The Haters: Scream was warned multiple times to calm down and stop putting words in people's mouths but she ignored all of those warnings, so she was given a time-out for 2 weeks. I don't understand how ANY rational person could argue that was unfair treatment.

I really don't understand such levels of hate and rage over an internet forum. It seems very childish.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: GINAFELICIA on May 26, 2012, 11:29:34 PM
Wow...this is the first time I read this thread.
I remember crying my eyes out at movies about holocaust.
I also remember older people talking about Jews who were behind the communist party in the former USSR and they were sent to Romania to run the communist party here. Horrible things happened to Romanians opposers, so many people died and NOBODY in this wide world gave a fuck about that and nobody in Hollywood made movies to impress the world about their drama.
I also remember the Romanian scientist who discovered insulin (that keeps alive millions of people who are dependent on it to survive) being denied his work and cut from the Nobel prize because he spoke some things about zion in an indeed shocking book that was forbidden in the past (I came to read it only a few years ago from an uncle of mine who worked in the secret services and I was shocked - author talks 80 years ago about media manipulation in its EARLY days, when almost NOBODY realized people  were subject of it ).Denied the prize (http://creation.com/denied-the-prize) I don't say I agree with everything he wrote in that book but at least to the parts about media manipulation.
To deny conspiracies is to deny what Michael is about when talking about "them". Why the hell are we here if we don't see his point?????
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MissG on May 27, 2012, 01:09:57 AM
@MJonmind
 :th_bravo:

This issue is deeper than that and goes faaaaaar back in history, starting from "being the chosen ones".

I am happy to have met Jews who do not agree at all with what is happening in those countries, Jews that want to be separated from those other Jews "exploiting" the situation up to today.

Extremism is never good, on any side.

Quote
The official story people say we must promote the Holocaust story because of the slogan, "Never again".  Well "Never again" apparently doesn't include Arab countries like Iraq and Afghanistan, and peoples like the Palestinians who since 1947 have had many slaughters and on-going suffering. But Arabs have all been vilified in the west and characterized as 'Terrorists' by the same media mentioned above.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: MJonmind on May 27, 2012, 01:42:03 AM
Gina, I too read books and watched movies about the Holocaust when I was younger, and felt such horror and sadness. Just the sheer numbers of loss of life is staggering. We are so removed from that with our mostly comfortable safe lives.

Well I guess no good thing ever comes from discussing anything contrary to the conventional story, especially this subject matter.
 I've removed the offending sites that Scream was angry about. 

I don't want this forum to have trouble because of links I've posted. Then my actions are affecting the common good.  I'm here because of my love for Michael, and the members here.  If I knew that he wanted us to fight against the conspiracy beyond the media that tried to/did destroy his reputation, which is definitely related to this topic, I would keep the sites up. I know TS posted about 9/11, and about JFK, and about Robert Kennedy, which are also related. If we knew that Anonymous was MJ behind the scene, that would also mean he was fighting against this exact same group, 'them',  that is referred to in this topic.  Well, it's almost pointless talking about it because many people just get very upset. My bad, sorry guys!  Also I know when TS talked about the dangers that were around Michael, and the need for great care to be taken in what they said, I think he was also referencing the same 'powers that be' that have conditioned the general public to reject all 'conspiracy theories'.

Yes, MissG, I think MJ had some very close friends that were Jewish, that he trusted completely!
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Grace on May 27, 2012, 02:05:28 AM
WWII and surrounding conditions from way back until today has been a very complicated and controversial matter. This is a subject like political system, sex and religion - always to be discussed with a mindset of maximum humbleness and caution in the sense of not unwillingly hurting people through words and/or action.


It is courageous to start a topic like this, knowing how easily a drift might set in.

The world is not black or white but a lot of in between. Unfortunately, a lot has been hidden before our eyes making it pretty easy to believe in black or white when people don't question or start digging.

We have discussed other taboos and controversial matters in depth before and are  meanwhile trained to do so without hacking each others eyes (more or less, but in the end achieving a climate that allows for controversy keeping manners equally important).

Folks flocking into the board now without investing the time, capacity or willingness to read will not adapt to the style of this board easily because they might have to catch up not only information but also growth that took us years.
This is a general aspect that will become the more important the more people will get interested in asking questions about Michael. I think it would be wise to be prepared for more controversy and people not understanding us in the end.

We  have dissected Michael having a belly button or not on the death bed photo. We have discussed his skin color, his nails, his smile, the possibility of doppelgangers and literally everything from a living dead's perspective. We cannot ignore that more taboo subjects deserve a dissection as well for finding out the truth.

This is the logic of the hoax and of thinking outside of the box.
If this should not be allowed here for other topics as well - then where?
Were we encouraged to dissect, get engaged into questioning, demonstrate perseverance up to TS' leaves discussion? Yes we were. By many sides actually.

Unmasking means also unmasking oneself.
Some have achieved great surpris(z)es in doing so.
Slandering is not even what cockroaches do. Bah.

I am proud of this forum and grateful for everybody having contributed positively to where we are now.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: ilovemjforever on May 27, 2012, 02:14:18 AM
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I have relatives in Iran.
I must say, they are against the zionists of the ruling class. They know very well what is really going on.
But it is all rigged.
The people have it bad due to their regime so the people want change.
America (dont know if they still are) is playing the "we must help the iranian people against their regime" card, as they have with other countries. And some of the iranian people want that because they don't have it easy there, and especilly now when USA made sure to shut Iran off with the sanctions.

When I write america and israel I mean the rulers and not the people.

America love to play the Hero card.
Sometimes it just feels like a game, that Iran and America and Israel is all in it together. Making sure that the people will panic, to create fear and chaoes. They don't have to go to war, if they want the regime out it is just for them to enter the country and snatch them.

I personally feel that the last real king they had in Iran that really was honest, loving and real was the Shah.
Just as for america JFK was the last real president.
100% agree.As an American i love my country,but i am ashamed of our leaders.They have sold out the citizens,not only in our country,but all over the world for money,power and greed.The shedding of innocent blood,due to invisible influence.Its all connected.Follow the money trail,the rabbit hole goes deep,and back to  early civilization.The media plays a huge role in this deception.Its unfortunate we will never see another JFK.Its all come down to chosen puppets,that will do what they are told,and continue to give us the false illusion that we are free and encourage us to vote,knowing damn well ,that presidents are chosen,not elected.Plesseeeeeeee.We all know who the real bogey man is,its all there in the Holy Bible.Once you can pinpoint the Whore of Babylon,the dots will begin to connect,and you can clearly see why they do what they do.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: jono on May 27, 2012, 03:04:28 AM
Just wow... I can't believe this thread!  :over-react-smiley: This is just what THEY want!

It is all about manipulating the public and turning us against each other instead of against THEM...

I would recommend reading "Rule by Secrecy" by Jim Marrs to get a better understanding of the bigger picture here..

With LOVE

 :bearhug:

We, the people, have to UNITE. COEXIST.
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: SimPattyK on May 27, 2012, 04:12:51 AM
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WWII and surrounding conditions from way back until today has been a very complicated and controversial matter. This is a subject like political system, sex and religion - always to be discussed with a mindset of maximum humbleness and caution in the sense of not unwillingly hurting people through words and/or action.


It is courageous to start a topic like this, knowing how easily a drift might set in.

The world is not black or white but a lot of in between. Unfortunately, a lot has been hidden before our eyes making it pretty easy to believe in black or white when people don't question or start digging.

We have discussed other taboos and controversial matters in depth before and are  meanwhile trained to do so without hacking each others eyes (more or less, but in the end achieving a climate that allows for controversy keeping manners equally important).

Folks flocking into the board now without investing the time, capacity or willingness to read will not adapt to the style of this board easily because they might have to catch up not only information but also growth that took us years.
This is a general aspect that will become the more important the more people will get interested in asking questions about Michael. I think it would be wise to be prepared for more controversy and people not understanding us in the end.

We  have dissected Michael having a belly button or not on the death bed photo. We have discussed his skin color, his nails, his smile, the possibility of doppelgangers and literally everything from a living dead's perspective. We cannot ignore that more taboo subjects deserve a dissection as well for finding out the truth.

This is the logic of the hoax and of thinking outside of the box.
If this should not be allowed here for other topics as well - then where?
Were we encouraged to dissect, get engaged into questioning, demonstrate perseverance up to TS' leaves discussion? Yes we were. By many sides actually.

Unmasking means also unmasking oneself.
Some have achieved great surpris(z)es in doing so.
Slandering is not even what cockroaches do. Bah.

I am proud of this forum and grateful for everybody having contributed positively to where we are now.
:th_bravo: :th_bravo:


Just a few links that I find interesting to be taken into account when talking about this subject. I'm not saying I believe everything there... I'm just saying: What If?
It's always recommended to know all aspects and look at the problem from all possible perspectives! After all, this is what OPEN MINDED means or THINKING OUT OF THE BOX!! ---- > namely : even if we think we know the truth about something, we need to be able to accept that there is at least a slight chance that we might NOT know everything or that what we know is NOT exactly the whole truth!
And what does it take us to explore and research everything that one can find before making up one's own mind?? Nothing! Oh maybe time and willingness! that's what it takes, only time and willingness !


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDXZbh301_I&feature=related[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCpmDxShzYI&feature=related[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejb4-EY_DPo&feature=related[/youtube]
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: Australian MJ BeLIEver on May 29, 2012, 06:55:18 AM
i too have my viewpoints however will keep them to myself so as not to be wrongfully accused of denying the holocaust! but i will say this, zionists do hold the reins to global control. that is all....

more importantly, i wanted to post and spare a thought and a few moments for my (NON JEW) purple triangle Jehovahs Witness associates who were executed or persecuted in Nazi Germany and Auschwitz Poland...

WIKI: The purple triangle was a concentration camp badge used by the Nazis to identify Bibelforscher (Bible Students), the German name for Jehovah’s Witnesses in Nazi Germany. A small number of Adventists, Baptists and pacifists (less than one percent) were also identified by the badge.[1] Nazism opposed unorthodox-Christian religious minorities (along with Jews), but made the Bible Students the object of particularly intense persecution, including such extensive incarceration that a distinct badge was assigned to them.

(http://cdn101.iofferphoto.com/img3/item/208/037/790/german-ww2-patch-jehovah-s-witnesses-auschwitz-dachau-3ecf4.jpg)

Unlike Jews and Romani people (Gypsies) who were persecuted on the basis of their ethnicity, Jehovah's Witnesses had the opportunity to escape persecution and personal harm by renouncing their religious beliefs. The Nazi government gave detained Jehovah's Witnesses the option of release by signing a document indicating renouncement of their faith, submission to state authority, and support of the German military

Instead of recouncing their faith, they chose to adhere to Christian Neutrality when it comes to war and hence further persecution instead of freedom based on fear.

I am humbled everytime I think of my brothers and sisters...

Their courageous spirit and loyalty to God to death spurs me on and encourages me to want to be a better Christian and a JW with courage.


May God bless you in ressurection...


Thank you for your fine example, I am humbled by your endurance, strength, love and respect for of fellow God.



For more information....

Purple Triangle: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purple_triangle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purple_triangle)

JWs in Nazi Germany: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_in_Nazi_Germany (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_in_Nazi_Germany)


Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: LoveShyMichael on May 29, 2012, 08:42:14 AM
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Just wow... I can't believe this thread!  :over-react-smiley: This is just what THEY want!

It is all about manipulating the public and turning us against each other instead of against THEM...

I would recommend reading "Rule by Secrecy" by Jim Marrs to get a better understanding of the bigger picture here..

With LOVE

 :bearhug:

We, the people, have to UNITE. COEXIST.

I Love Jim Marrs. I have that book, & also 9-11 conspiracy. I listen to Alex Jones, Infowars.com, & one of the best movies that totally describes the Government Sponsered Terrorism, is Terror Storm. It goes way way to Hitler, & keep in mind ALMOST ALL is totally ADMITTED, DE-CLASSIFIED from our own government. Here is the link. It's a long movie, but it wraps it up in a nutshell on what happens & who's in control. Alex spells it out, ( which I need sometimes) on how it happened, who's behind, shows the documents, shows the commanders in charge, totally worth it. It the best movie to describe Government Sponsered Terrorism.

TerrorStorm Full length version - YouTube (http://youtu.be/vrXgLhkv21Y)
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 29, 2012, 08:42:46 AM
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Grace quoted from Wiki on Anti-semetic and it also said.
Quote
Current situation
A March 2008 report by the U.S. State Department found that there was an increase in antisemitism across the world, and that both old and new expressions of antisemitism persist.[129]
So pretty much every country in the world has issues with 'Jews' for many centuries?  Now why is that?  They can't all be blind idiots and so irrationally hateful.

Thank you Simpa, for addressing Akhtoni, because I wasn't sure what to say.

Akhtoni, are you Muslim from an arab country, and young as well? Because that will make it more understandable why you say what you say, how you said it. If any group has a feel for what's happening in the middle east, it's the people who live there and have been directly affected by 'Jews' and Israel for centuries. People in the West get a sanitized version, because 'they' run the media, hollywood, governments, education systems, and influence Western Christianity. The official story people say we must promote the Holocaust story because of the slogan, "Never again".  Well "Never again" apparently doesn't include Arab countries like Iraq and Afghanistan, and peoples like the Palestinians who since 1947 have had many slaughters and on-going suffering. But Arabs have all been vilified in the west and characterized as 'Terrorists' by the same media mentioned above.

MJ wants to promote healing for the world and love for all people groups including Jews, so first of all there needs to be an understanding of the truth of history, before solutions can be put into place.  I believe he can and will do this! And it will happen according to God's time schedule.
 :michael_jackson-1135: :michael-jackson: :moonwalk_:





(http://www.mundoarabe.org/mapa1pal47.gif)














(http://www.mundoarabe.org/plan2partici.gif)










(http://www.mundoarabe.org/expansi48.gif)








Map of Palestine: The areas in red are the occupied Palestinian territories in 1967 and where the PLO wants to build the future State of Palestine, i.e. about 22% of the surface of the historic Palestine
(http://www.mundoarabe.org/actualestadomap.gif)
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: bec on May 29, 2012, 10:01:19 AM
Aussie: from your pic, =21, 777
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: AKHTONI on May 29, 2012, 11:27:13 AM
@Scream

why are you putting my words into every ones mouth here??

you changed my name to AKH''I like Hitler''TONI well like  you want

WHAT HAPPENED TO GERMANY IS HAPPENING TO AMERICA !!! ZIONIST CONTROL CRASH - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=rX5UMb6GZzA)

isn't good what he did ^^ ( 3:55 to end). sorry but our leaders never think of us.


Adolf Hitler: The Man they Call the Devil - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=iZG9NXmuCaE)

4:50 and 5:54 ^^  like what michael said in this is it.

Adolf Hitler speech against freemasonry illuminati NWO,zionist plutocratic warmongers England. - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=vVgzEVY-lQY)


JFK praises Adolf Hitler - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=H3ei9ycAOdQ) hope jfk is not antisimitic too?

why did mike said hitler was genuis? sure not his evil side.or just he could have made him change . most of hitler speeches are wht's happening now ( change jews by zionists or illuminati if you want ). I am not defending him or saying he is all good.just take a look on youtube and decide.


@sim thanks for the advice i appreciate it  :bearhug: i will watch the vidéos that you posted later thanks. yes and every thing is "what if" in this world.

@ mjonmind yes, I am from a muslim country.


@scream stop attacking the members and admins here because of what i said i think i said "I" and don't take it like an apportunity.

 
Title: Re: Anti-semitism
Post by: paula-c on May 31, 2012, 07:59:23 AM
Hitler had the capacity to captivate your scenario with its controversial speeches during the first phase of the war, was a powerful genius strategist, was an astute man, but that does not make him a " hero "
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