Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

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Offline imabeliever2

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 22, 2009, 08:01:59 PM
True, they were one way or another linked together to destroy him. Just in case you haven't seen it yet, another MJDH family member posted the website to MJ's FBI file under new topics.  Its interesting!  Well...should I come across anymore information, I will post it for sure and will look for any information from you guys as well.  

I still question the going ons in that house on June 25th, how did Michael manage to get away, how did he pull the Death Hoax Off and who helped him :?:  :?:   :?:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
And I remember going to the record studio and there was a park across the street and I\'d see all the children playing and I would cry because it would make me sad that I would have to work instead.

Offline O-drey-O

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 25, 2009, 06:59:28 PM
Yep I've been wondering that since the beginning, but unfortunately I think that we will know it if Michael comes back...  :? All we can do from now is guessing... It must be powerful people, otherwise the hoax would be quickly discover but who exactly ...IDK
I have another question. Lately I read that Michael had to sell 25% of the Sony catalogue because of his debts, so he would still have the 25% left.And now it's up to Branca and Mc Clain, to decide if they would sell it to Sony or to let it to the children. Do you know if this is true and if there are any news about that? I didn't see anything...
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Offline tinker_bell

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 25, 2009, 08:06:19 PM
Quote from: "O-drey-O"
I have another question. Lately I read that Michael had to sell 25% of the Sony catalogue because of his debts, so he would still have the 25% left.And now it's up to Branca and Mc Clain, to decide if they would sell it to Sony or to let it to the children. Do you know if this is true and if there are any news about that? I didn't see anything...

I've been wondering about that catalogue too, i really think it's significant. Just imagine, in 2005 it's been estimated to be worth $ 4-5 billion (well, i guess the whole thing, not just MJ's part). Anyway, i came across this article which exlains the current (well as of this summer) state of affairs pretty clearly and since it's been published in Forbes, i'd give it some credit:

Quote
Michael Jackson's Estate Sale
Zack O'Malley Greenburg, 06.26.09, 07:00 PM EDT
Jackson's debt may force a quick sale of his prized asset: rights to the Beatles catalog.

Michael Jackson died just before heading to the U.K., where a 50-concert schedule would have done much more than launch a musical comeback tour.

Proceeds from the concerts would have chipped away at nearly half a billion dollars in personal debt.

Creditors allowed Jackson to dig himself into such a hole because of the cash cow he put up as collateral: his 50% interest in a music publishing catalog that includes 250 Beatles songs and hundreds of thousands of other works.

Now, if those same creditors push the Jackson estate for quick payment, they could force a distressed sale of his interest in the catalog.

The King of Pop blew the profits from sales of 750 million records on extravagances ranging from $10,000-a-night hotel stays to the construction and upkeep of his $50 million Neverland Ranch.

But Jackson made one brilliant financial move--shelling out $47.5 million in 1985 to buy the publishing catalog. Ten years later, Sony ( SNE - news - people ) paid Jackson $90 million for half the rights, forming a joint venture called Sony/ATV. Today, it's worth far more.

"You're talking about the greatest catalog in existence," says Ryan Schinman, chief of Platinum Rye, the world's largest buyer of music and talent for corporations. "When you have that many No. 1 hits in a catalog, you almost can't put a price on it."

Schinman thinks the catalog is worth as much as $1.5 billion (like i said, in 2005 during court deposition it was estimated to be worth 4-5 bln), which would put Jackson's share at $750 million. Using a rough industry rule of thumb--that a catalog can throw off 5% to 7% of its value in cash each year--Jackson would have been earning some $80 million a year from his stake.

The real promise for getting out of debt, though, came from the scheduled concerts and the potential for an extended international tour. The London shows promised to net Jackson $50 million and a global tour could have earned him hundreds of millions of dollars more.

While the Jackson estate will own much of his own music, the big prize is still the Beatles catalog. Only an orderly sale will bring the maximum value.

"His creditors could say that, due to his passing, the owners of the estate have to make good on his debt in 60 days," says analyst Chris White of Wedbush Morgan. "Then you'd have to put this joint venture on the block, and that would be a distressed sale."

In other words, creditors could essentially foreclose on Jackson's stake in the Sony/ATV venture. Sony could try to block such a sale or buy Jackson's stake at a firesale price.

Representatives from Sony/ATV declined to comment.

A low price, while good for Sony, would diminish Jackson's estate. Given the state of both the economy and the music business, a quick sale of Jackson's catalog stake might not even erase his considerable debts.

"The music business is in the doldrums, to put it mildly," says Donald David, an estate lawyer who handled the postmortem finances of Tupac Shakur. "If somebody wanted to liquidate his interest, it's unclear whether it'd be enough to pay off the debt."

Add in competing interests from Jackson's family, creditors and even one-time friend Paul McCartney, and the situation could get complicated very quickly.

"They could get into a bit of a disagreement as to who has priority," says David. "That said, you can't leave an asset free of what it is securing. If McCartney wanted to claim back that catalog, he'd have to pay off the loans. He's got the money to do it, but I'm not sure he'd want to."

If an estate drama is on the horizon, Wall Street seems unfazed. Shares of Sony ended Friday's session down less than 1%.

"Sony is such a huge conglomerate," says White, "that their exposure to one entertainer--even one as big as Jackson, isn't going to move the needle in the short term."
http://www.forbes.com/2009/06/26/michae ... state.html

To sum it up (what's been stated in the article above), MJ used his half (or perhaps 1/2 of his share) of the Beatles' catalog as collateral for a loan and risked loosing it unless he paid the loan out. So the 02 concerts were scheduled to help him out. But the concerts famously flopped. So as this article was issued on June 26, further fate of the catalogue was very unclear. The chances were high that creditors would attempt to sell the catalogue to return their investments. And one could assume that Sony would try to outbid them and keep the 100% for themselves. BUT as we know, in the beginning of December seveal papers announced that all the debts were sorted by the estate. Which i presume could only mean that the share in catalogue can now safely return to the estate being released from collateral. While it dosn't look as beautiful as some other theories, this potentially COULD be the reason for a hoax, in which case i'm afraid MJ's not gonna come back, but his kids will be financially secure for the coming few centuries. And actually it looks like a win-win situation for everyone: MJ doesn't need to do the exhausting 50 concerts and a (God forbid) world tour, AEG haven't lost a dime, it's the opposite actually - they received some feasible profit as many fans didn't ask for refunds and also the movie had quite a successful run, the creditors got their money, and even Sony would benefit from the fact that the catalogue remains in MJ's hands instead of being split between several owners. To say more, it looks like Sony has established some sort of new partnership with MJ company and i'm sure we'll see some joint projects in future (be it new albums of unreleased songs, movies or else). Perhaps there was a peace treaty signed behind the curtains, well i'm just throwing it out... However IF the catalogue will be eventually sold to whatever third party (including Sony) this could give some food for bad thinking. So i was kinda glad to see that last sentence about Sony beeing big enough to get frustrated over a bunch of songs :)

Now there's been a lot of speculation about MJ financial straits before and after June 25 (http://michaeljacksonnotdead.wordpress. ... ficulties/). Personally i never believed he was in debt... but what if he was. In 2001 he said: "The Beatles catalogue is not for sale, has not been for sale and will never be for sale." Yet he made it collateral which is risky. Either he had to be 100% sure to have the money to get it back and have extremely loyal accountants while the deal was pending, or there were indeed some troubles (but otherwise why would he get loans in the first place? :? ). You decide.
Perhaps someone of you can find different information on the subject, that would be interesting!

This thread seems to be the one for discussing issues concerning the estate and all the shady people around it, so i'll just post it here:

viewtopic.php?f=73&t=1734
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »


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Offline imabeliever2

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 27, 2009, 08:20:36 PM
tinker_bell, thanks! That was excellent investigative work!  I hadn't gotten the opportunity lately to do a more deeper investigation, but I will start tonight!  I will look  also, and try to find out more information on the connection between Martin Bashir and Sony/AEG any linked associations.  I've mentioned before, that I find it very strange that Michael's friend Chris Tucker has not commented or said anything regarding Michael's "Supposed Death"  They were pretty close and I saw from a photo that he too was at Al Malnik's birthday party with Michael.  Maybe he know's something and he's afraid to say anything.  Being able to connect all these people says this was a conspiracy without a doubt.   ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
And I remember going to the record studio and there was a park across the street and I\'d see all the children playing and I would cry because it would make me sad that I would have to work instead.

Offline shannychell

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 28, 2009, 02:55:16 PM
Someone mentioned something about Chris Tucker that has been bugging me, it has been 6 months now and we have not really heard anything from Chris about MJ, they were extremely close friends and I am sure that if this is a hoax Chris would definitely be aware of it and maybe that is why there has been no comment from him on it.  What do you all think?
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Offline O-drey-O

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 28, 2009, 03:10:29 PM
Oh yes I remember ... concerning Al Manick and Chris Tucker, there is a member who wrote something about it on another site... I'm gonna try to find it
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Offline imabeliever2

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 28, 2009, 06:07:13 PM
Thank, you guys!   I spent a few hours last night trying to find anykind of information on Chris Tucker and I found absolutely none.  IDK.....seeing that he and Michael were so close you would think that he would have been one of the first to interview.  Maybe he feels unsafe because he knows something that he's uncomfortable sharing with the public/press,  with the two of them being so close, I'm sure Michael shared with him his fears about his life and why.  But if Michael's family was able to give interview information or voice their opinion, I don't understand why can't he.   OR....... :idea: Maybe he knows all about the hoax and Michael's whereabouts! :?:  :?:  :?:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
And I remember going to the record studio and there was a park across the street and I\'d see all the children playing and I would cry because it would make me sad that I would have to work instead.

Offline O-drey-O

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 29, 2009, 09:51:56 PM
I believe Chris Tucker is in the hoax... The thing is that he hasn't said anything about Michael. Not a word, nada. So it will be difficult to find something...  I didn't find the post I was referring to, i'll continue to look for it of course^^.

But there is something more about Al Manik.

http://http://www.zoominfo.com/people/Malnik_Al_58621055.aspx?PersonID=58621055&lastName=Malnik&firstName=Al&id=58621055&searchSource=page&page=2

Embattled pop star Michael Jackson has added a new name to his long list of strange bedfellows: Miami Beach loan king Alvin Malnik, long said to be heir apparent to legendary mob finance wizard Meyer Lansky. Malnik Is a New York gangster/lawyer who moved to Florida.He is to control the Bahamas gambling and Caribbean drug running.
...
It is to Malnik, a multimillionaire whose suspected mob connections have been fodder for federal files since the 1960s, that Jackson is believed to have turned for help in erasing debt said to approach $200 million.
...
A lawyer, real estate developer and proprietor of the supertrendy Miami Beach hot spot The Forge, Malnik is also owner of Title Loans of America, a national chain that lends money legally at annual percentage rates reaching 264% - higher than most loansharks' vig.

He concedes he gave the pop star financial advice - as he has to members of the Saudi royal family - but has denied he lent Jackson considerable sums or put up the $3 million bail when the singer was charged last month with molesting a 12-year-old, cancer-ridden boy.
...
The relationship hit its showbiz zenith on May 17 this year, when Jackson - decked out in a vintage '70s glitter shirt and outsized Afro wig - was host of a 70th birthday disco party for Malnik at The Forge.
...
Malnik, who declined to be interviewed for this story, has long maintained he set eyes on the famous gangster only once - in a chance encounter in an elevator.

Ok now a little dates about Al Manik

Malnik first came to prominence in the early 1960s with the attempt to establish a gambling resort at Paradise Island in the Bahamas.He had already established himself in the banking and real estate businesses in Miami but soon become Lansky's public "front-man." The Paradise Island venture led to the establishment of Resorts International, the entertainment and gambling conglomerate which was the subject of intense law enforcement scrutiny for years as charges of control by Meyer Lansky surfaced (Mahan, 1980).

1962: Malnik was listed as a director of the Bank of World Commerce, a Bahamas-based institution that involved 'some of the nations' top gangsters,'

1963 The feds opened their first dossier on Malnik .It was two years after he graduated, first in his class, from Miami Law School.He had helped set up the Bank of World Commerce in Nassau, the Bahamas, an alleged loot laundry that investigators said involved "some of the nation's top gangsters."

1964: Acquitted on tax fraud charges, Malnik was heard discussing Lansky two years later on bugs placed by cops probing whether casino profits were invested overseas on the mobster's behalf.

But by then, Malnik - who purchased his first Rolls-Royce at age 29 - had long been a fixture in Miami's fast lane.

He made his first venture into showbiz, organizing a video jukebox company, Scopitone, that was touted as a music-industry revolution.

1966 : the U.S. attorney in New York secretly indicted Malnik on charges of using the mail to defraud Scopitone investors.In 1971, prosecutors quietly dropped the case.

1969 : after Malnik opened The Forge , it rose quickly to the top of Miami's night scene, attracting celebrities such as Frank Sinatra, Judy Garland, Richard Burton and even Richard Nixon, who came with his shady financier pal, Bebe Rebozo.

A Bahamian company named Appolonia Investment Limited allegedly paid over three million dollars to purchase property of Malnik in Nassau, and a ranch, owned by Malnik.

In the early 1970s, Malnik was also involved with Sam Cohen's sons in land deals in Florida and the Poconos.Their companies -- COMAL and "Cove Associates" -- dealt with Caesar's World and the Teamsters Pension Fund, both institutions which have attracted a substantial amount of law enforcement attention"


"Title Loans of America is owned by two trusts whose sole beneficiary is Alvin Malnik, a Miami lawyer whom the New Jersey Casino Control Commission found in 1980 and 1992 to be "a person of unsuitable character" to have any role in the industry. "

Odd... Michael may have owned money to this people... I 'll keep digging a little deeper...
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Offline Truth_Freedom

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 30, 2009, 07:08:23 AM
Diana Ross, Chris Tucker nor Eddie Murphy have said anything. They are all silent.
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Offline imabeliever2

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: December 31, 2009, 11:37:07 PM
I believe Diana Ross and Eddie Murphy both commented on the supposed death.  However Chris Tucker has not and we can't seem to find where he is or what he's doing now. And yes, I really do believe that Chris Tucker is in on the hoax for sure, he's been acting too strange about this!  

O-Drey-O, that was interesting.......I'll see what else I can find as well.  One strange thing that I did find was a statement saying that Randy Jackson believe MJ's 2002 will was forged and not signed by him because he was in New York on the date it was signed.

http://blog.taragana.com/e/2009/10/22/randy-jackson-questions-mjs-will-46209/
Randy Jackson questioning MJ’s Will

Something else strange that I found while reading Randy's Jackson's statement.  Although Randy is saying that MJ couldn't have signed the 2002 Will because he was in New York on the day the Will was signed, the lawyer of the estate Howard Weitzman insists witnesses to the will were present when Michael had signed the will.  I looked up this attorney Howard Weitzman........I can't believe what I found on him!  

ANOTHER SUSPICIOUS PERSON AFFILIATED WITH MOB ACTIVITY.  And the amazing thing is that these are men in High Ranking Positions and they're all part of MJ's ESTATE, that they're refusing to let MJ's mother see :?:  :?:  :?:  

http://www.mikecann.net/2009/12/courtney-cobain-love-and-howard.html
Howard Weitzman and his entertainment business having been council for many well known clients. Weitzman seems to have had some real relationships with convicted organized crime folks or used their services in at least one of his cases, something which we will get into more with upcoming posts. He worked at MCA which has many reported incidents of being in league with the mafia.He's currently serving as the attorney for the trustees of the Michael Jackson estate.

Also, in this same article it was mentioned that Courtney Love Cobain has made statements that point to Howard Weitzman and others being behind the theft of her and Frances Bean Cobain's assets. Weitzman is listed in this civil case as the co-signer with Love setting up the Frances Cobain Irrevocable Trust. The case was recently dismissed at First Republic Bank's request. Love and Laird Norton Tyee Trust Company seem to have come to some sort of agreement

What is going on here??????  Everyone affliated with MJ seems to at one time if not currently connected to organized crime activity.   :?

It never fails.......with this situation, you start investigating on one thing and it leads to another :roll:

I can't wait to see what we stumble across next.  Question is, with so many people involved how do we get to the root of exactly which one/who was responsible for hiring Dr. Murray for Michael :?:  :?:  :?:
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And I remember going to the record studio and there was a park across the street and I\'d see all the children playing and I would cry because it would make me sad that I would have to work instead.

Offline ILuvUMoreMJ

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 01, 2010, 04:09:27 AM
Nice summary tinker_bell. ;)

I seem to recall someone posting a video of Chris Tucker singing a tribute to MJ on stage...must have been on the old forum.

Edit: Here it is... http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-704- ... -You-video
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I will always love you Michael!

Offline Grenat

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 03, 2010, 01:02:55 AM
I think that it's possible that Michael hired Dr Murray
Of course he wouldn't need him in London because if he hoaxed his death he knew he wouldn't go to London , so he wouldn't need one doctor licensed to practice in London.
If he knew about it then it's one more proof for the hoax : he hired a cardiologist !
It's possible MJ chose him because he knew he would be suspicious and the perfect suspect for the crime . He used him as a scapegoat .
The AEG could be either part of the hoax or either part of a conspiracy , that's right .
AEG fired Michael's staff because Michael asked them to(maybe)
Why not turn things around ?
It's possible all thoses scary things that you discover are all part of the hoax .
I believe that all of that served for the hoax , not for a conspiracy , if not then why hire Kenny and all his band at the funeral ?
What make look like a conspiracy can look like an hoax as well if you turn things around .
My theory only works if Michael was still in charge of everything of course.
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Offline imabeliever2

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 03, 2010, 03:43:51 PM
I really do not believe that MJ hired Dr. Murray.....this man might do time for MJ's "supposed" death.  I believe Murray was hired as a scapegoat, not knowing what was really going on!

I do not believe that MJ would hire someone and set them up to spend time in prison.  I believe this was strictly done by someone or some group that doesn't care about "setting" a person up and that person having to do time.  Michael believed that they were trying to kill him.  I do not think Michael would deliberately destroy someone else's life to save his.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
And I remember going to the record studio and there was a park across the street and I\'d see all the children playing and I would cry because it would make me sad that I would have to work instead.

Offline Grenat

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 03, 2010, 08:08:48 PM
Quote
I really do not believe that MJ hired Dr. Murray.....this man might do time for MJ's "supposed" death. I believe Murray was hired as a scapegoat, not knowing what was really going on!

I do not believe that MJ would hire someone and set them up to spend time in prison. I believe this was strictly done by someone or some group that doesn't care about "setting" a person up and that person having to do time. Michael believed that they were trying to kill him. I do not think Michael would deliberately destroy someone else's life to save his.

Well sure it's seems cruel and out of character but it's could be possible.
We are wainting that he comes back but simple exemple :
 we don't think about the fans that killed themselves when they learned about "his death" it's  a "cruel" outcome too.
Theses people lost their lives.
Of course I'm not saying that he has done something like hiring someone to use as a scapegoat and send him to jail for nothing but that could be the case however.
The thing that discourage me most in all of this is thinking about the people that killed themselves , it's unrelated to the topic I'm sorry but their families if they see Mike come back , what would they do ?
More importantly , if he is indeed alive , how does he feel about this ?
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Offline imabeliever2

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 04, 2010, 12:03:02 PM
Yes, I have thought about that, which I learned recently, it is sad that 12 fans committed suicide because of their loss.  My heart goes out to their parents/loved ones.  I can't explain the reasoning behind what they did.  However me, myself.....I'm not gonna jump in front of a moving train because someone else did (even for MJ).....lol.  Although I love him as an entertainer/humanitarian, I also love my own life and refuse to let anyone or anything cheat me out of it.  

Obviously, this had nothing to do with MJ, but their own personal lives.  Michael isn't personally responsible for the actions of others nor can he be blamed for the actions of others.  Of, course I'm sure this is not what he wanted or expected.  When I first learned of Michael's "supposed" death, I was devastated too, but something inside of me wouldn't let go of the fact that he is still alive.  Yes, we love him dearly, but he's not God!  We have to be open minded with whichever way this turns out.  I think it's great that we have forums such as this to interact with other believers and not be looked at as retarded.  Either way this turns out (MJ Dead or Alive) our goal is to investigate the what's, how's and the why's. and as true fans, support his dreams and make them a reality.  Not throw away our lives because we're hurting, but fight for what he stood for.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
And I remember going to the record studio and there was a park across the street and I\'d see all the children playing and I would cry because it would make me sad that I would have to work instead.

Offline Grenat

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 04, 2010, 03:34:20 PM
I don't think it's his fault either...I wouldn't throw my life away for anyone too. That's unreasonnable action to take , seriously.I wouldn't ever think that way . But maybe they had others reasons adding up.It's too much !
But these people's families are going to think it's his fault...If he comes back he is going to have it hard.
I hope that if he is alive and come back everything is going to be alright for him..
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Offline imabeliever2

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 04, 2010, 04:05:02 PM
Grenat, I totally agree with you.....life is too precious to waste!   :D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
And I remember going to the record studio and there was a park across the street and I\'d see all the children playing and I would cry because it would make me sad that I would have to work instead.

Offline Grenat

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 04, 2010, 04:42:56 PM
Quote
Grenat, I totally agree with you.....life is too precious to waste!

Actually they should've used all this despair and anger to find a way to not repeat Michael's tragedie ,they should've not put their loved ones in suffering the lost of a loved one , because they were supposed to know how much it hurt
They should've fight , because they maybe won't have a second chance.
That's why I tell it's not Mike fault...But people when they suffer they need to blame someone at first because they can't handle it...
They have to find a culprit , they're probably already hating Mike now..but if he reappear before their very eyes and they understand their loved ones lives has gone to waste...Oh my..
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Offline O-drey-O

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 05, 2010, 03:24:49 AM
Yes, I'm afraid for Michael in a certain way if he comes back  :( . Because it's not his fault but the families may not think the same  :? .
I don't want to be disrespectful, please don't get me wrong, but is it really true that these fans killed themselves? Because I heard it once and then nothing... Sorry, I just wanna know...

And about Murray, I have one question.Well I don't know who hired him yet, there were definitely shady and powerful people around Michael.
Let's say Murray was hired by these bad people to be set up and let's say he didn't know anything about the murder plan or even the hoax. He was in Michael's house in order to treat him right? He would have actually given him meds, injected propofol... He wouldn't treat someone that doesn't exist  and Michael wouldn't let him touch him if he didn't need all of that... Murray has to be in the hoax ... no? What do you guys think?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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[size=110]"Lie run sprints, but the truth runs marathons"[/size]

Offline Grenat

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 05, 2010, 08:01:23 AM
Quote
Yes, I'm afraid for Michael in a certain way if he comes back  . Because it's not his fault but the families may not think the same  .
I don't want to be disrespectful, please don't get me wrong, but is it really true that these fans killed themselves? Because I heard it once and then nothing... Sorry, I just wanna know...

And about Murray, I have one question.Well I don't know who hired him yet, there were definitely shady and powerful people around Michael.
Let's say Murray was hired by these bad people to be set up and let's say he didn't know anything about the murder plan or even the hoax. He was in Michael's house in order to treat him right? He would have actually given him meds, injected propofol... He wouldn't treat someone that doesn't exist and Michael wouldn't let him touch him if he didn't need all of that... Murray has to be in the hoax ... no? What do you guys think?

Well about the persons that killed themselves , I wondered the same things too..
We hear it just one time and after that they never mentionned it ever again
12 people is quite a lot...even so they pratically ignored it (the media)
I didn't even hear it on news , I saw it on a tabloid magazine..
Maybe we should research to verify if this statement was accurate

Dr Murray..We don't even know if he is real
He has to be real because he had a life before that,right ?
And about if he is in the hoax or not..well there is 4 solutions :
- Michael isn't dead , he disapeared on his way on the hospital,Murray doesn't know anything (but that doesn't seem likely that you could fake an heart attack right ?)
-Michael isn't dead and Murray has his part in the hoax
-Michael died of cardiac arrest after being injected propofol( or something else I dunno)and Dr Murray was like he himself said "  here at the wrong time"
-Michael is dead and Dr Murray was hired as the scapegoat , he isn't the one that injected the lethal dose but he is the one that has to bear all the blame = conspiracy
I really don't know...I really hope that's either the first or second theory , really

Edit : I searched about the 12 people and they are rumoured to have killed themselves . The thing is that there were a fanclub and the chairman of this fanclub think(after reading messages on the board I suppose) that 12 have killed themselves.The chairman doesn't even know if it's true ! I mean I can say that I'll kill myself here if I want , that doesn't mean I'll really die !It's easy to say anything on internet !
There are no proofs and no reliable sources that confirmed .
Check these pages if you want to know more
http://perezhilton.com/?p=58851
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index ... 620AAEMIxN
http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/in ... 012AAdwwpH
Well I think nobody killed themselves after all , they just said it on the moment , because they were shocked but got a grip of themselves after .
I hope so
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline imabeliever2

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 06, 2010, 02:08:16 PM
I question the number of fans that were supposedly have actually committed suicide.  I searched for the identity of these fans and only found one.  A Michael Jackson impersonator.  How real this report is??????   I have no idea! But I've listed the website for your view also.  Who knows......maybe it is a lie also!  

http://www.umcssa.net/tag/pavel-talalayev
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
And I remember going to the record studio and there was a park across the street and I\'d see all the children playing and I would cry because it would make me sad that I would have to work instead.

Offline tinker_bell

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 07, 2010, 09:23:17 PM
Quote from: "imabeliever2"
I looked up this attorney Howard Weitzman........I can't believe what I found on him!  

ANOTHER SUSPICIOUS PERSON AFFILIATED WITH MOB ACTIVITY.  And the amazing thing is that these are men in High Ranking Positions and they're all part of MJ's ESTATE, that they're refusing to let MJ's mother see :?:  :?:  :?:  

http://www.mikecann.net/2009/12/courtney-cobain-love-and-howard.html
Howard Weitzman and his entertainment business having been council for many well known clients. Weitzman seems to have had some real relationships with convicted organized crime folks or used their services in at least one of his cases, something which we will get into more with upcoming posts. He worked at MCA which has many reported incidents of being in league with the mafia.He's currently serving as the attorney for the trustees of the Michael Jackson estate.

A little more on Howard Weitzman, concerning the financial settlement with Chandlers in 1993:

Quote
lso, I suspect the people giving him this bad advice were probably working for his enemies within the recording industry. Michael’s first lawyer was Bertram Fields who worked with an aggressive private investigator, Anthony Pellicano. From what I’ve read, these two men encouraged Michael to go to trial because they didn’t believe Dr. Chandler had a case of merit. In fact, Fields filed extortion charges against Dr. Chandler and his lawyer, Barry Rothman. According to Ms. Hughes, Chandler and Rothman took the charges very seriously because they both hired defense attorneys. Unfortunately, Mr. Fields specialized in entertainment law, http://but brought in Howard Weitzman as the criminal case began to heat up. This turned out to be a big mistake because Weitzman apparently pressured Michael to settle and drop the extortion charges against Chandler and Rothman. This suggests Weitzman was working for Michael’s enemies, perhaps Joe Isgro himself, or Tommy Mottola, or both.
from http://www.jfkmontreal.com/Michael_Jack ... reamer.htm (this article was posted on another thread, quite interesting, but should be taken with a grain of sault IMO)

So this man, who apparently gave MJ the worst legal advise possible back in 1993 is now an attorney for the Estate executors. Who hired him? Michael or Branca/McClain? I suggest the second.

Then we have John Branca, who was asked back a month prior to MJ's death after he resigned in 2006 (for breaching the representation ethics - working for MJ AND Sony/Mottola). We only know about MJ asking him back from DiLeo's words. However, conveniently, MJ didn't amend his will after 2006, leaving Branca as his posthumous manager.

I really couldn't find much on John McClain except him being MJ's childhood friend and a renowned music executor: http://news.lalate.com/2009/07/01/john- ... nterscope/ (i found some comments to this article interesting, but of course, hard to prove)

Now this is a little off topic, but i find it very curious how some of the "messengers" in Internet refered to MJ's shady entourage:

*Michael...L.O.V.E.* from LKL blog, December 23rd, 2009 7:27 pm ET
Quote
You people are idiots. If you cannot clearly see that I am alive, you are just plain stupid idiots. How much more outrageous and unbelievable could the story get every day. I am absolutely embarrassed that so many of my fans are such idiots!
Have a Merry Christmas while you figure out if it was Tohme, Sony, Anschultz, Dileo, Colony Capital, etc. IT WAS NONE OF THEM! I am alive!

Now there's the new oracle from the Italian forum, who said:

Sent: 01/02/2010, 11:26 p.m, user blackorwhite
Quote
- Thome Thome works for Michael. Don’t believe what they write about him. Actually, all the trustworthy people were re-hired by Michael when he decided to go back on stage. Thanks to him Neverland has not been sold.

Wouldn't it be smart move to talk with hoax-beleivers in their language, while trying to slowly divert them from the ugly truth? Just a thought.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »


~A serious face is not yet an indication of intellect. All stupid things in the world are done with that exact expression. Smile, gentlemen, smile!~  

Offline imabeliever2

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 08, 2010, 12:34:50 AM
Thanks tinker_bell, those were interesting findings and articles.  I will also, do more research on John Branco and John McClain to see what I can come up with as well.  I've been following the thread here regarding BOW from the Italian Hoax Site as well. A lot she says makes sense and I've asked our connection here questions as well, but I haven't read enought to 100% make up my mind.  I sure hope it is real though as I'm getting a little tired and frustrated with all the different imposters turning out to be exactly that!  

Remember earlier in this thread, I mentioned three possibilities for the hoax......either he's really gone, he's in a witness protection program or had to leave due to life threatening reasons.  So to me some things make sense and she gives direct answers.  Whether she's real or not.....only time will tell for sure.  

As far as the Michael L.O.V.E. on LKL.   I know for a fact that isn't Michael Jackson speaking. I don't know much about him there, only through heresay, but when he said that, he blew his cover right then and there!

There is absolutely no way on God's Green Earth Michael would ever talk about or to his fans like that!  He always had the utmost respect for us.  And the words are not words that MJ would use.  But see what I mean......people usually blow their own phony cover just like BOW will if she's phony.  Thats why I say.......Time Will Tell for sure!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
And I remember going to the record studio and there was a park across the street and I\'d see all the children playing and I would cry because it would make me sad that I would have to work instead.

Offline Grenat

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 08, 2010, 09:14:22 PM
Quote
I question the number of fans that were supposedly have actually committed suicide. I searched for the identity of these fans and only found one. A Michael Jackson impersonator. How real this report is?????? I have no idea! But I've listed the website for your view also. Who knows......maybe it is a lie also

There is one and only one that confirmed and he is not dead ?
But poor guy , it say that he is a fan for 20 years and he even undergone surgery to look like him . It must have been hard on him
Thankfully he was saved in time !
Of course...I mean it's easy like I said to tell anyone on internet you're going to kill yourself , but it doesn't mean you really do it .
I think that after all nobody died..I hope so
So the issue with the loss of the fans seems to be cleared
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline tinker_bell

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Re: Report (Michael Jackson Didn't Hire Conrad Murray)

  • on: January 08, 2010, 09:40:36 PM
I also find it weird that none of the 'suicide' stories was properly addressed by the media, but the sad truth is it could happen even without being in the news. However, those could just be the cases of 'Munchausen-by-proxy' syndrome cases (http://hubpages.com/hub/Munchausen_by_Internet). If it did happen, it's tragic and obviously had to do with phsychological condition of these people rather than with MJ whatsoever. I do believe though he felt responsibile for those who loved him (remember: "You become responsible, forever, for what you have tamed"? =), therefore i never thought the hoax (if there's indeed one) was for fun, it must be for very serious reasons.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »


~A serious face is not yet an indication of intellect. All stupid things in the world are done with that exact expression. Smile, gentlemen, smile!~  

 

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