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Yulia

Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 11:11:21 AM
It seem like this has all became a show made up by TS. I smell this is just a big show to entertain himself. Anyway I've never given a damn on it, either now, I just came upon the thread. It's without any logic. I wish people will understand what Michael says: Think by yourself.
Last Edit: March 09, 2011, 11:19:01 AM by Yulia
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mdc

Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 11:12:42 AM
And maybe this light/reflector on ambulance from this video looks different...not as flat?
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[attachment=0:1hfv3y3c]ambulance light1.jpg[/attachment:1hfv3y3c]
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 11:21:47 AM
Yes  the pic.from inside the ambulance could have been staged before June/25 ,using for it  a studio.The using of a real ambulance on 6/25  gives more credibility to the hoax because of the eye witnesses outside Carolwood and so begins the illusion . ;)   As to the paramedics,IMO they must be in it, but who knows.... :?:
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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paula-c

Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 11:54:05 AM
Quote
TS_comments wrote:

2good2btrue wrote:
Thanks for the new information TS.

There had to be a real ambulance at Carolwood Dve, to help start the illusion....

Yes, if you mean on 6-25-09. However, my statement was referring to a staged photo before 6-25-09. Here is my statement again: "For example: if the ambulance photo was staged before 6-25-09, why bother bringing the ambulance to Carolwood Drive [before 6-25-09]—just to take a photo of things inside the ambulance?"

that the staging of the paparazzi allegedly taking that picture, is really the only proof that Micahel died, no one has said with the exception of Karen Faye who saw the corpse of Michael
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 12:00:22 PM
In regards to the medics being real, that is a question I've always had.  Oh how I wish I lived out there so I could go and investigate personally while I'm off work!!  I've wondered if anyone was able to go to the station house and just look at the medics, try to find some traits we find in the pics.
Anyhow, this seems to have become the TS leadership place to go..so I'm saying thank you for pushing us into different directions while we await the hard times ahead with the trial.
I'm reading  the Trials of Michael Jackson right now and am in SHOCK as to the life Michael must've lived and am also getting a lot of new perspective as to perhaps what is going on NOW!
Thanks for your info and help..and Trusting you with your good faith :))
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 12:17:37 PM
Quote from: "fordtocarr"
In regards to the medics being real, that is a question I've always had.  Oh how I wish I lived out there so I could go and investigate personally while I'm off work!!  I've wondered if anyone was able to go to the station house and just look at the medics, try to find some traits we find in the pics.
Anyhow, this seems to have become the TS leadership place to go..so I'm saying thank you for pushing us into different directions while we await the hard times ahead with the trial.
I'm reading  the Trials of Michael Jackson right now and am in SHOCK as to the life Michael must've lived and am also getting a lot of new perspective as to perhaps what is going on NOW!
Thanks for your info and help..and Trusting you with your good faith :))

Also, I've read where there are two entrances to Carolwood, and perhaps there were two ambulances that day.  One at each entrances.  Maybe that's why the first one pulled out so slowly, to make sure the other was gone.  I also read where the other hospital there had the roads blocked off at the same time.  Maybe the other amb. went there?  Maybe the pics are valid and that was the "dummy" amb. to throw the paps off the other.  They were shopped for US to be thrown off.
Also, IS that Murray in the pic at the entrance of the hosp. because it don't look like him to me as any of the people?  He's very tall and I think would be taller than that man in white, which is closer to the camera and would even be taller than the others. It don't look to me as Murray was there.  Maybe he was in the amb..  the other one.

I don't know if this is too far off this "new thread" we are told to follow, but I wanted to get these questions in here before I forgot. :)))
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Do

Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 12:19:53 PM
Hi guys,
I'm not an avid reader of TS' posts (I truly apologize for that  :oops: ) so maybe I do not understand the value of this post, but my question is what's the use of trying to figure this all out? I thought that, now we are (hopefully) getting closer to a possible bam, there will be more important reasons to learn about this hoax. I feel that this post of TS does not add any important information, except the fact his dead really was fake. But we came to that conclusion a long time ago right? I haven't post much lately because I had the feeling we were running around in circles and I get that same feeling once again with this particular post. I hope someone can explain to me what's the reason for this post, what kind of information in it will help us to UNDERSTAND the hoax? Hugs
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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"Three passions, simple but overwhelmingly strong, have governed my life: the longing for love, the search for knowledge, and unbearable pity for the suffering of mankind."
Bertrand Russel

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paula-c

Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 12:22:30 PM
the picture of the ambulance can not see the face of the paramedics, .. which he declared in court may be real or not paramedics
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Im_convincedmjalive

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Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 12:23:05 PM
Quote from: TS_comments


First of all, congratulations to everyone—you have been doing an excellent job on the 2-26 thread investigation!   <!-- s:) -->:)<!-- s:) -->   Second, today is graduation; it’s now time to take this investigation to the next level.   <!-- s:o -->:o<!-- s:o -->  <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) -->   Third, today is March 9—which is the two year anniversary of the amazing bull market rally that is still going, and which I related to God and the hoax a year ago in Update #4 (4-33).   <!-- s:shock: -->:shock:<!-- s:shock: -->   Fourth, speaking of update #4, that was my most detailed numerology post; and #4a was posted one year ago today (CA time), which was six months after 9-9-09.   <!-- s:geek: -->:geek:<!-- s:geek: -->   And fifth, speaking of numerology, it’s now time to start looking at how numerology unlocks and explains some of the hows of the hoax (in addition to explaining the when and why, which I have already discussed in great detail).

The next level means that we are now going to shift the focus from the ambulance picture (whether it was real or fake, etc) to whether or not some or all of the paramedics are in on the hoax.  Did the actual paramedics pose for a staged ambulance shot before 6-25-09?  Or did MJ use actors dressed like paramedics? Was the ambulance photo staged with the actual #71 LAFD ambulance, or another one that looks about the same inside?  Would the real paramedics publicly deny the ambulance photo, if it was not them in the picture (and they were not in on the hoax)?

These and similar questions are now the focus of investigation.  Yes, we have already discussed these things to some extent; but it has not been the focus before now.  You may continue discussing the ambulance photo, if you want; and please keep that discussion in the proper thread {You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login}.

Of course the ambulance photo is part of the evidence related to the paramedics, so the photo will still be discussed somewhat in this thread; but try to remember the focus of discussion in this thread.  When it’s time to graduate again, I will start another thread with the focus of who or what (if anything) went to the hospital on the stretcher in the ambulance.  We might need to discuss this a little now, but it’s not the focus yet; so let’s see what we can establish about the paramedics, before we focus on that aspect.

In the previous thread, I mentioned that it’s good to have at least two or more strong evidences pointing to the same conclusion; and we now have at least four strong points, indicating that the ambulance photo is fake—even after some (including me) have tried to play unbeliever, and debunk whatever we can.  Here are those four strong points, with links to some of the evidence.  People are still welcome to try and debunk them if they can; but please read at least the information in the links below, before trying to debunk them.

#1. Ben’s slip: “Chris, and the other people that were there that day and the other d---- and uhhh, and uhhh ----”
{You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login; You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login}.

#2. In the video of the ambulance, the monitor/screen is clearly on {You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login}.  In the photo, the monitor/screen is not on {You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login}.

#3. The shadows on the red car in the video do not match the shadows on the red car in the photo {You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login; You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login}.

#4. The paramedics did not recognize MJ; they said it looked like an old man, maybe a hospice patient {You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login; You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login}.  This report of the paramedics does not fit with the face we see in the ambulance photo.  If the paramedics are in on the hoax, and what they said was scripted: then the ambulance photo is fake, one way or another.  And if the paramedics are not in on the hoax, then what they said was true—and does not fit with what we see in the ambulance photo, which would still mean that it is fake {You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login}.  Either way, then (paramedics in on it or not): the photo is fake; so the only question is what method was used to make the phony photo.

The first three of these four points listed above indicate that the photo was planned and staged in advance, rather than merely editing MJ’s face into a photo that was actually taken through the ambulance window on 6-25-09.  This is why I started our investigation process with the ambulance photo; now we know that it was planned and staged in advance, so we have a good platform upon which we can build our next level of investigation.

Please remember to use common sense, in addition to forensic investigation and raw data analysis.  For example: if the ambulance photo was staged before 6-25-09, why bother bringing the ambulance to Carolwood Drive—just to take a photo of things inside the ambulance?  Why not stage the photo elsewhere, and indoors, where there would be a very low risk of the wrong people seeing what is going on?  Also keep in mind the goals of the hoax; common sense should tell us that the only ones in on the hoax are those who need to know about it, in order to accomplish the goals.  Why would MJ spend tons of money—and greatly increase the risk of someone letting the cat out of the bag too soon—just to have dozens or hundreds of people in on the hoax, who don’t need to be in on it?

Finally, just like last time, I may play “DA” (devil's advocate)—and try to debunk things that are true, just to keep you on your toes!  Enjoy the ride!!
Thank you for the next level. Right on time!  <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) -->

[youtube:2t24qanx]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgD4COfhrLU&feature=related[/youtube:2t24qanx]

I enlarged some text above that is in favor of my thinking on this subject so far. I am adding this video above as evidence. I believe that this show has clues in it. The fire captain is very suspect in my book. He seems to be acting. I think he is another key person. He would be the some of the paramedics in on it. I believe the picture was indeed shot on a different day, in a different ambulance and the paramedics in that fake picture are actors dressed in costume.  <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) -->

Side note: Everything that has been released to the public regarding this investigation is also biased and is meant to taint the public's opinion regarding Murray's innocence or guilt. Just like the media did to Michael in 1993 and 2005.

In the video above Ben is again talking about that day and the scene of the guy (shot through the gate) standing from a crouching position is once again being shown. Why that part again? I think there is a reason for that and it is to draw attention to that guy. Perhaps to get people wondering who the heck was that?

I do not believe the real paramedics (the ones that showed up that day and testified in court) would publicly deny the picture because of this:

<!-- l -->You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login<!-- l -->

LAFD Capt. recalls Michael Jackson (MJ) events on June 25, 2009
[youtube:2t24qanx]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggewNtwvHJ4&feature=related[/youtube:2t24qanx]
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In this video the Captain is so precise on the time the 911 call was made. He even says it down to the seconds, lol
Quote from: mjaliveomg
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its incridible how this guy looks like MJ...
I agree, very suspect. I noticed that before when we were discussing the ambulance picture in TIAI 2/26 thread. Thank you for circling the guy.

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Quote
Michael Jackson hearing: Paparazzi, fans hampered paramedics from getting stricken pop star to hospital
January 6, 2011 | 10:58 am

A paramedic who tried in vain to save Michael Jackson’s life testified Thursday that an unruly crowd of paparazzi and tourists outside the pop star’s home hampered efforts to get to the hospital recalled Los Angeles City Fire Department paramedic Richard“It’s a circus out there. It’s unbelievable,”Richard Senneff of the scene outside Jackson’s Holmby Hills mansion June 25, 2009. 

The witness testified on the second day of testimony at a hearing to determine whether there is enough evidence to try Dr. Conrad Murray for involuntary manslaughter.

Senneff said that the ambulance driver had trouble navigating away from the residence because of a throng that included passengers of a tour bus and photographers with “big cameras, little cameras, video cameras, still cameras.”

At one point, a man with a video camera ran alongside the ambulance holding a camera with a large lens against the window. “It just seemed wrong,” he said. Under questioning by a defense lawyer, Senneff said Murray wanted to put a “central line” to restart Jackson’s heart, but that medics did not have equipment or training to do so.

He said the singer did not respond to two rounds of drugs to revive him and hospital officials told him over the radio to “call” Jackson’s death, but that neither he nor Murray wanted to do so. “I said, 'Be advised, this is a very high-profile VIP,' ” Senneff said.
u]. “I said, 'Be advised, this is a very high-profile VIP,' ” Senneff said.[/size]

The 50-year-old singer was pronounced dead at UCLA Medical Center. Senneff said rescue workers had gone “above and beyond” the call of duty in the field not because Jackson was a celebrity, but “because it was someone’s son.” Katherine Jackson, the singer’s mother, listened intently in the courtroom gallery. Judge Michael Pastor also heard from a second paramedic who, like Senneff, said that Murray initially claimed he had not given his patient any medication.

Martin Blount said the denial struck him as odd because he saw a hypodermic needle and three bottles of lidocaine in the room. Murray, he said, “scooped up” the bottles and placed them in a bag before they left for the hospital. “Did you ever see those bottles again,” Deputy Dist. Atty. David Walgren asked. “No, sir,” Blount replied. Murray, 57, has pleaded not guilty.

Prosecutors accuse Murray of an “extreme deviation” from the standard of medical care by, among other things, giving Jackson the surgical anesthetic propofol to treat insomnia.
Quote
I am posting this article to disprove the hoax regarding the theory/reason why the ambulance drove backwards and slowly. Paramedic Senneff gives the reason for that. Blame it on the fans and paps why they couldn't save Michael, shifting blame onto fans and paps will supposedly relieve him from any harm/blame to the King of Pop.  <!-- s8-) -->8-)<!-- s8-) -->  <!-- s;) -->;)<!-- s;) --> He also gives credibility to Ben's pic by saying "At one point, a man with a video camera ran alongside the ambulance holding a camera with a large lens against the window."
 
I am also posting some questions that can be either pro hoax or against depending how the questions are answered.

Q-What would be considered going above and beyond the call of duty?

Q-Why didn't he (Senneff) want to call the time of death either even though the hospital told him to do so?

Q-How many paramedics were actually in that ambulance?

According to Senneff's testimony there was a driver, himself, and Blount. So that is 3 but only two testified?
Another point I want to add to this is that IF Michael/the patient was already DOA when the paramedics got to the house and they tried to do CPR there for a good amount of time; the ambulance would not need to be in a hurry when leaving because the patient is already gone.
To the airport! lol
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Last Edit: August 08, 2011, 03:50:47 PM by ~Souza~
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curls

Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 01:22:56 PM
To start with something pretty basic, I'd like to know if the paramedics that gave evidence at the prelim looked anything like the ones we see in the ambulance pic. Without their faces I realise that's hard, but if the court ones happened to be obviously very different e.g. big burly black men, then that would help!  Sinderella, if you're around, I have it in my mind that you knew someone who was in court who was giving you the info that you were so diligently posting for us (but I may have dreamed that!). Could they, or anyone else help us out here?

I'd also like to clarify how many paramedics there were. I always thought there was just the two until someone here said there were three. Only two gave evidence at the prelim.

Well that'll do for starters!
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 01:31:26 PM
Quote from: "curls"
To start with something pretty basic, I'd like to know if the paramedics that gave evidence at the prelim looked anything like the ones we see in the ambulance pic. Without their faces I realise that's hard, but if the court ones happened to be obviously very different e.g. big burly black men, then that would help!  Sinderella, if you're around, I have it in my mind that you knew someone who was in court who was giving you the info that you were so diligently posting for us (but I may have dreamed that!). Could they, or anyone else help us out here?

I'd also like to clarify how many paramedics there were. I always thought there was just the two until someone here said there were three. Only two gave evidence at the prelim.

Well that'll do for starters!
AND A DOCTOR.... No one mentions MURRAY was also in there and MURRAY took presidence being a physican, correct, as the tape eluded to of 911. a
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 01:33:21 PM
ur welcome Im_convincedmjalive,

i did some comparisions with the paramedics on UCLA (the photo that i circled "MJ")

take a look on MJ hair on this photo


 with sunglasses..take a look on his body



now take a good look again on the paramedic that i circled


the hair, the body and even the glasses are almost identical..Who would notice a paramedic when everyone thought that MJ was lying on the stretcher "dead"?  8-)

what do u think , TS :?:  :?:
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 01:39:15 PM
Quote from: "mjaliveomg"
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its incredible how this guy looks like MJ...

It's funny that you posted this.....
I remember thinking this exact thing the first time I saw the photo.  I told a friend it would seem like Michael to play the part of his own paramedic on June 25.  Someone here wrote that Michael has the world so convinced he's dead, he could walk around and nobody would notice.  I wonder if that could really happen?    
Anyways......great post, thank you!
Have a wonderful day!
Blessings Always!
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 01:40:13 PM
Quote from: "Elsa"
Quote from: "VeryLittleSusie"





On these photos - MJ on the stretcher entering the hospital - we can se at least 2 paramedics in dark blue suits....  :?
And i guess Murray is there in the white T-shirt...

I think that all these footage was staged before and handed over to the press/television as the finished material. It was not filmed by CNN as far as I know... (I might be wrong)
They could have easily film it before June 25 and then send it to the media to publish.  Nowadays, nobody bothers to verify the material, we can observe the copy-paste journalism in bloossom...

VeryLittleSusie - You might be getting ahead of the game.  The ambulances don't match in the 'arriving at the hospital' scenes.  Look at the different rear doors and the yellow reflector behind the back wheel in the first photo -it isn't on the ambulance in the second photo.  I saw this online somewhere and had been looking for it.

First off I just wanted to say I've been reading along everyday, but haven't commented yet!! After seeing this today, I have to say I don't agree with you! I can see the reflector in every picture. It is not yellow but a darker red if you look carefully! Also the back doors are still striped, just washed out by bright light it looks to me like. So these reasons alone don't make them different in my opinion!
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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MissG

Re: TIAI March 9
March 09, 2011, 01:45:58 PM
Quote from: "TS_comments"

The next level means that we are now going to shift the focus from the ambulance picture (whether it was real or fake, etc) to whether or not some or all of the paramedics are in on the hoax.

Quote
Did the actual paramedics pose for a staged ambulance shot before 6-25-09?  Or did MJ use actors dressed like paramedics?
How is anyone supossed to know that? Is it relevant?, why?. May be those pramedics don´t even exist on the 1st place. They can be taken from another film or photo and placed in to the scene.

Quote
Was the ambulance photo staged with the actual #71 LAFD ambulance, or another one that looks about the same inside?
If the actual #71 is the one Tristan showed, the interiors photo/video did not match 100%.
Could have been the same ambulance but altered (by photoshop) for the final puplished pic.

Quote
Would the real paramedics publicly deny the ambulance photo, if it was not them in the picture (and they were not in on the hoax)?
In order to answer to that question we may be need to "find" who the "real" paramedics were.

Quote
Please remember to use common sense, in addition to forensic investigation and raw data analysis.  For example: if the ambulance photo was staged before 6-25-09, why bother bringing the ambulance to Carolwood Drive—just to take a photo of things inside the ambulance?

To atract attention to that spot, Carolwood Drive. May be in the mean time people were focusing in the on going circus, MJ could have been just vanishing sneaking through the backdoor or being somewhere else already.

 
Quote
Why not stage the photo elsewhere, and indoors, where there would be a very low risk of the wrong people seeing what is going on?
That ambo photo was not taken that day (we supose). What was shown in the video is a dramatization.

Quote
Also keep in mind the goals of the hoax

Oh! have we come to a conclusion of what are the goals of the hoax?

 
Quote
common sense should tell us that the only ones in on the hoax are those who need to know about it, in order to accomplish the goals.  Why would MJ spend tons of money—and greatly increase the risk of someone letting the cat out of the bag too soon—just to have dozens or hundreds of people in on the hoax, who don’t need to be in on it?
As I see it. We are the ones making the hoax as we talk. We don´t need to be in it but accidentally we are. This hoax evolves as our theories do. The 1st seed was planted (either by MJ and/or his team) and grew withing our imagination in one way or the other.

Back to the goals of the hoax, depends on the perspective we take and proyect towards who. I still don´t know the reasons but can see the "how come".
Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Guest
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("Minkin güerveeeee")
Michael pls come back


"Why a four-year-old child could understand this hoax. Run out and find me a four-year-old child. I can't make head nor tail out of it"

 

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