What are we really doing?

[fordtocarr]

I've been thinking a lot, or rather, trying to put thoughts together about this hoax.  I am wondering, what we really are trying to do with not only this site, but all the information and research we so treasure and live for lately.  Maybe I have brain warp, maybe I just need to sit back and wait.  But, I wonder what we will ever do if we find our answers, which I think we will ultimately find we can never have outside of Michael's return.  
I think we are hooked up on a mystery.  Intrigue and search.  We love Michael.  We have actual clues and we take them all into a frame and try to piece them together.  
I think there will never be a way to fit them together unless we get Michael back, because that is the final piece.  There will always be another opinion and another what if.  We will always keep trying.
I wonder if there will be a time we all collectively think "we have it".  We can then, do WHAT?  Present it to...anyone?  Live with the info and have peace?
Are we searching for the ultimate this is how it was done and we can prove it from the facts now, scenario?
I just don't know.  Like with the magazine we turned down.  They go ahead with it, but they can base it upon, us, these people who are searching for facts to uphold our belief in a hoax.  But, for us, we'd have to say, we believe what we do .. which is scattered opinion on scattered clues, but, have no bottom line.  No proof, just theories.
I hate to have this go off to the world, or go on forever as another dead celebrity the fans can't let go of.  We are crazy weirdo Jacko lovers.  Whereas we know Michael was NOT crazy or weird and neither are we.  We have open eyes and those clues are for SOME reason.  But, for WHAT?  What do we do with it?  What is it FOR?  What does doing all of this get us?  What is the purpose?  I'm honestly wanting answers to these, because we DO believe he's alive, and there are new clues and reasons for him doing this and for LEAVING the clues.  But, I wonder if it's simply to reassure us that it's a hoax.  Surely it's not to come to some perfectly fitting theory and then he'll come back, as though us doing this will end whatever reasons he left for.  What if he has his own time table?  His own reasons and don't want anyone investigating and blowing up his reasons..or what if hit jeopardized his reasons?
I really don't know what we will ultimately get done from all this worry and research.  NOT that I can quit or want to, but I don't know the WHY we do it and WHAT FOR.
Please do misunderstand me in this.  I'm not being negative and I'll probably be at this until I'm dying myself.  But, I wonder, what do we try to accomplish and to do what with....
Love to you all who have become my strength

[Andrea]

I think I get where you're going with this, fordtocarr.  I really think the majority of us are here because we truly do believe that Michael is very much alive and will return.  I know some here are truth seekers, which is a very valid reason to be here as well because if looking for the truth has brought someone here and keeps them here, we must be heading in the right direction and making some real sense, not just wishful thinking.

And it I think it helps us to share our thoughts and findings on this forum - we will never figure it out 100% because that would mean getting inside Michael's head completely and that can't happen anymore than someone getting into my head or yours.  I am on this forum several times a day and although we might not figure everything out I know it's not from a lack of trying.  I'm sure a lot of what is said on this forum is pretty close to the truth but a lot of it is out in left field too but it helps to consider all the possibilities.  I would say that 90% of my posts aren't replied to and it doesn't bother me because it makes me feel better to put my thoughts on here, it's a release of some sort.  And there are a lot of posts by members that I agree with but I don't necessarily reply to them all if I have nothing more to add.  Sometimes someone will sum up my thoughts perfectly when I don't even know how to say it myself.  There is honestly nobody in my actual real life that thinks Michael is alive, I have no one to physically talk to about it - and when I do speak of it, I know whoever I'm talking to is just humoring me by listening.  I'm known as a bit of a conspiracy-sister and my Dad says that if Michael comes back, he will believe everything I say going forward.  :lol:  

But what I am sure of is that Michael is alive and in all likeliness is very much aware of this site, how could he not be?

[trustno1]

Ford I think we have our role in this hoax just like all the other players do.  We are the wide-awake ones who didn't blindly believe all they were told by the media because for one thing we know if anyone could/would pull off something like this it'd be MJ, and secondly, we'd been paying attention to his lyrics in trying to warn the world not to believe the media's lies.  He taught us well!  And whether we came here because of intuition and instinct or through the gradual accumulation of clues and inconsistencies, or both, we remain the ones who are on the inside.  Those who still haven't woken up are missing out big-time and hopefully soon they'll see what they've missed out on.  

As for what we can acheive here, I think just being here as a family and discussing/analysing and contributing whatever we can has already yielded huge dividends.  At least I feel the benefits, I'm so much more aware of so many things and have appreciated this journey so much.  And the forum will stand as an important archive once MJ returns, all the non-believers and those who have left will come flooding here and will see how intricate and entertaining and downright maddening it has been at various times.  I don't know whether MJ considered the rest of the world would take so long to wake up, as most still haven't, but I don't think we're putting him in danger, the clues were there to be found and analysed by those who were paying attention.  That would be us!!  I'm sure he knew there would be a fair number who would "get it" and would have assumed we'd all join together via a site or forum, and that's just what happened.  The fact that we're a relatively small number compared to the non-believer fans would I believe just endear us to him more, as we doggedly ignore those who insist we're nuts!  He knows that feeling all too well, so we've got to walk in his shoes a little throughout this too.  I think the reason we're here and keep coming here day after day is something simple yet complex.  We can't not.  It's something we instinctively have to do.  At least that's how I see it.  

[AnaMarcia]

I agree that we have achieved many things with this forum, how to help keep high the name of Michael and arouse the curiosity of thousands of people on the Hoax.
But unfortunately I think we're now stalled, because we not have so many more clues and even less proof of anything.
There are several areas of disagreement and no one can come to any conclusion.
I do not even know where all this goes. For me, the limit will be the end of the trial, after that I do not know how I'll deal with this theory Hoax. The truth is that I spend hours a day here and sometimes I feel totally frustrated because I have the impression that we are back to square one!
I love Michael and I love being in this forum, but the uncertainty is something that hurts the soul and even if you're happy, on the other hand, the matter Michael saddens me deeply. Just wish we had something significant going forward, because that really saddens me doldrums!
Anyway, I not have much to do except watch and wait.
But for me, never have all the answers, even if Michael back!

[MJonmind]

You all bring up interesting points. Andrea I always appreciate your posts, and like you I only respond or post if I have something to say or add. Last night my head was particularly spinning with all this, wondering should I continue this, but of course I know I will, for how can I not. But often I think, am I just all deluded and not seeing the big picture. Is my brain deceiving me or am I gullible. Sometimes I wonder how vast is this hoax, and MJ deceiving us about way more that we imagine, even if he is alive. Or is there some planetary hoax perpetrated on a collossal scale by TPTB that has scooped us up, and we hoaxers have been caught in it's spiral, whereas the general public are happily oblivious. Is TS like a jester merrily leading us on a path of craziness deep into the forest of nowhere. Yet my heart tells me this hoax is all very real and must be played out on a very specific time frame that only Michael (and God) know, and we just have to be patient because it can't be rushed by even one minute, and may take years to complete. It's just we happened to jump on the train at a very high-action segment of the story. Sometimes I think I should just leave the forum for a month or two so I'm not so impatient waiting for things to happen, but I know I don't have the strength. I have become entrenched (addicted) in the habit of viewing much of the world news, celebrity info, through the eyes of this forum. I'm addicted to the people here, with their personalities, and the community. My other problem is how can I go back to the life I had before this hoax, which has turned my world upsidedown, and often I felt like I was on the ultimate adventure. My regular world is ever so much more boring and mundane, even though I have been for the most part busy and content. This hoax called some inner voice or stirred some sleeping entity within me, and once aroused can't be put back to invisible again. Am I talking silliness, I hope you understand my ramblings. I'm sure once the trial starts there will be action galore, but after that then what, till the next event...on and on. :?   Sorry, I guess I'm feeling a little discouraged.

AnaMarcia » Fri Mar 11, 2011 2:03 pm
But unfortunately I think we're now stalled, because we not have so many more clues and even less proof of anything.
There are several areas of disagreement and no one can come to any conclusion.

Yes I agree, a strange predicament indeed after all this time of confidence and investigation.

[fordtocarr]

I think we are all on the same page.  We are in Neverland.  It is a place of Michael Jackson.  He is forever there, here.  We are in the Neverland of fun, of love, of sharing, of forgetting the real world and being with others that love Michael and give us love back.  It is Neverland.
But, I wonder, what Michael is thinking we should be doing here.  Maybe what we are.  Maybe taking note of the clues, probably.  But, maybe, taking in what he has said so far on love, children, family, God... so many things.  We have his words.  His music.  His stories.   His poems.  Maybe all this is on faith.  Faith in what we feel inside about Michael being alive.  Faith in he will do this in his time, and tell us what we need to know.  LIVE our lives and trust that he is living his as he thinks best.  If he returns, hopefully we'll know what he wants us to know.  If he don't I know, I for one will believe he's chosen to live in peace, NOT dead.
I just don't think trying to solve this mystery which leads to hard feelings amongst us, is the ultimate goal.  It's like with the clues in the Bible.  Read (which we have all our lives and still do), observe(the clues, signs) and take heed(apply what we've learned).  
I think it's the big boys that need to be hearing the message of Michael Jackson.  He knows we hear his message.  It's the ones in power to change the world that haven't been listening to him, that have been obscuring his message and what he stands for, that need to hear his message.
So, I think, it's our time to look and see the clues, perhaps not try to define them, but just to know they are still coming.  And to LIVE his message, and promote love with in US.

[VeryLittleSusie]

Thank you so much for this thread...
I guess we must wait for the trial. Now, it is a  moment of silence before the storm...  :?  Let's enjoy it because sleepless nights are comin', folks!  8-)

[Aintnosunshine]

After all this time ...

we should agree that we measure up the theory of cognitive dissonance, don`t you think?

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[fordtocarr]

After all this time ...

we should agree that we measure up the theory of cognitive dissonance, don`t you think?

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I do think so    

[~Souza~]

We do have a role, we are documenting "The Greatest Show On Earth". Every little detail of the last 20 months is posted in here and on other forums. People will be able to see what actually happened in all those months (years I can almost say) and wheter the theories are true or false, people will be able to see ALL the contradictions, inconsistencies and oddities during this time, and how they have been blind to what has been so obvious for most of us. They can also see the process of awareness we went through and how we dealt with certain things, and how we learned to think outside the box. This is an archive. We are also here to support him and that is merely why I am so pissed off to see posts about him being a druggie that killed himself with an incompetent doctor, that he could have been guilty of child molestation, that he is the anti christ etc. We should have his back, and not STAB him in the back. We can speak openly here, something the family can't and the non-believers don't, we are his voice.

I have been 100% convinced that he hoaxed his death since August 2009. My belief never reduced, it only got stronger. I also never believed he faked his death to 'live a peaceful life out of the spotlight and never return'. That never made sense to me. I don't have a date. I had many way back in the beginning and I know I will still be here after any ultimatum I might set, so there is no use. I am so confident that he will return, that I do not need that date anymore. Until bamsday I will be here, supporting him and spreading the word. There is nothing that can ever make me believe that this is not a hoax, nothing. Everything can be explained and maybe not all now, but surely things will fall into place later on. If I wouldn't have such a strong faith in the hoax and the purpose of it, I would have quit months ago.

I also believe that all the confusion and contradictions are part of the hoax. How strong is your faith? Not only in him but in your OWN beliefs? Do you trust your own judgement and are you not afraid to defend it, even when the whole world thinks you're crazy? This IS a test, we are testing ourselves. How strong are we? Can we stand up for something we believe in and make a front, dispite the ridicule and attacks? This is an awefully big adventure which -if you open yourself up for it- will give you invaluable skills, (self)knowledge and wisdom for the rest of your life and when I look at what is happening in this world today, I think we are really going to need it. We are educating ourselves, each other and others.

That's what I think we're doing here.

[Andrea]

We do have a role, we are documenting "The Greatest Show On Earth".

Thank you Souza, that makes so much sense my head is spinning.

[RK]

We do have a role, we are documenting "The Greatest Show On Earth". Every little detail of the last 20 months is posted in here and on other forums. People will be able to see what actually happened in all those months (years I can almost say) and wheter the theories are true or false, people will be able to see ALL the contradictions, inconsistencies and oddities during this time, and how they have been blind to what has been so obvious for most of us. They can also see the process of awareness we went through and how we dealt with certain things, and how we learned to think outside the box. This is an archive. We are also here to support him and that is merely why I am so pissed off to see posts about him being a druggie that killed himself with an incompetent doctor, that he could have been guilty of child molestation, that he is the anti christ etc. We should have his back, and not STAB him in the back. We can speak openly here, something the family can't and the non-believers don't, we are his voice.

I have been 100% convinced that he hoaxed his death since August 2009. My belief never reduced, it only got stronger. I also never believed he faked his death to 'live a peaceful life out of the spotlight and never return'. That never made sense to me. I don't have a date. I had many way back in the beginning and I know I will still be here after any ultimatum I might set, so there is no use. I am so confident that he will return, that I do not need that date anymore. Until bamsday I will be here, supporting him and spreading the word. There is nothing that can ever make me believe that this is not a hoax, nothing. Everything can be explained and maybe not all now, but surely things will fall into place later on. If I wouldn't have such a strong faith in the hoax and the purpose of it, I would have quit months ago.

I also believe that all the confusion and contradictions are part of the hoax. How strong is your faith? Not only in him but in your OWN beliefs? Do you trust your own judgement and are you not afraid to defend it, even when the whole world thinks you're crazy? This IS a test, we are testing ourselves. How strong are we? Can we stand up for something we believe in and make a front, dispite the ridicule and attacks? This is an awefully big adventure which -if you open yourself up for it- will give you invaluable skills, (self)knowledge and wisdom for the rest of your life and when I look at what is happening in this world today, I think we are really going to need it. We are educating ourselves, each other and others.

That's what I think we're doing here.

I'd like to add my 'amen' to all of that.

[fordtocarr]

VERY good Souza!!
I ABSOLUTELY agree with you and have the same beliefs and faith in this.  My views have changed throughout this escapade and changed again since then.  I have these wonderings if though, we are suppose to be figuring it all out at all.  There is a difference in noticing events, clues, and talking them over amongst us, as family here, and documenting it for later/a movie, and trying to no end to figure out reasons, motives, plans, dates, schemes, thoughts and how to's til no end.  I think it is all these things that bring about such discord amongst us.  It has become like the cliche about not talking in groups about religion or politics.  Everyone has an opinion and no one agrees.  It is impossible as it is just speculation.  
I hate to see so many threads becoming angry by people getting headstrong or just differing opinions and others just being rude to each other or to you for simply voicing opinions.  At times I hate to even comment as I have been ripped on a few times too.  And I've also defended you a few times.  These things happen when people try hard to defend the beliefs they have invested time and thoughts to and want others to see then could be right.  
I know we can continue to do as we are and have been doing, and it is the correct thing to do, and all we can possibly do as we are drawn to do so.  But, I wish, that instead of trying so vehemently to prove things that truly are hopeful speculation, we first remember that YOUR OPINION AND MY OPINION AND HER/HIS OPINION are all the same---all hopeful speculation.  We are here, hopefully, in the end, to LEARN from Michael.  Not solve his problems, or the reasons for his problems, or the reasons for what has us here.  But, to LOVE and LEARN and enjoy all we DO have of Michael.
We let this stress us out and too much of this is lost on rude/angry words.
We ARE called here.  We will remain here.  We are one in purpose which I really hope is not to solve these many clues, but to stick by Michael, learn from Michael and to love each other, respectfully.

[Its her]

We do have a role, we are documenting "The Greatest Show On Earth". Every little detail of the last 20 months is posted in here and on other forums. People will be able to see what actually happened in all those months (years I can almost say) and whether the theories are true or false, people will be able to see ALL the contradictions, inconsistencies and oddities during this time, and how they have been blind to what has been so obvious for most of us. They can also see the process of awareness we went through and how we dealt with certain things, and how we learned to think outside the box. This is an archive. We are also here to support him and that is merely why I am so pissed off to see posts about him being a druggie that killed himself with an incompetent doctor, that he could have been guilty of child molestation, that he is the anti christ etc. We should have his back, and not STAB him in the back. We can speak openly here, something the family can't and the non-believers don't, we are his voice.

I have been 100% convinced that he hoaxed his death since August 2009. My belief never reduced, it only got stronger. I also never believed he faked his death to 'live a peaceful life out of the spotlight and never return'. That never made sense to me. I don't have a date. I had many way back in the beginning and I know I will still be here after any ultimatum I might set, so there is no use. I am so confident that he will return, that I do not need that date anymore. Until bamsday I will be here, supporting him and spreading the word. There is nothing that can ever make me believe that this is not a hoax, nothing. Everything can be explained and maybe not all now, but surely things will fall into place later on. If I wouldn't have such a strong faith in the hoax and the purpose of it, I would have quit months ago.

I also believe that all the confusion and contradictions are part of the hoax. How strong is your faith? Not only in him but in your OWN beliefs? Do you trust your own judgement and are you not afraid to defend it, even when the whole world thinks you're crazy? This IS a test, we are testing ourselves. How strong are we? Can we stand up for something we believe in and make a front, despite the ridicule and attacks? This is an awefully big adventure which -if you open yourself up for it- will give you invaluable skills, (self)knowledge and wisdom for the rest of your life and when I look at what is happening in this world today, I think we are really going to need it. We are educating ourselves, each other and others.

That's what I think we're doing here.

8-) VERY WELL SAID!

It is our Mission Statement, and, really, marching orders :!: